General > General Technical Chat
Electric shower, anything I can do?
Nusa:
--- Quote from: soldar on July 25, 2019, 07:20:13 pm ---
--- Quote from: Nauris on July 25, 2019, 07:06:33 pm --- For reference I draw schematic how hot water and heating is arranged here traditionally. (altought these days heat pumps are very much in, oil not so much)
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The problem with using a heat exchanger in the big heating tank for domestic hot water is that (1) you need the big tank always hot, which makes no sense when you do not need heating, and (2) efficiency suffers.
--- End quote ---
I totally agree with you in general. However, the costs of that decision varies greatly with climate, since it's a pretty efficient solution when you DO need heating.
Nauris's "here" is presumably Finland. The heating season encompasses the bulk of the year. It happens I am of Finnish heritage, and spent a year there as a child. That's when I learned to ice skate, although I was pretty inept compared to the local kids.
Your here is presumably Spain, which I believe has a long hot summer. Not the same thing at all.
Where I am currently (coastal southern california) my heating season is about 1 month long. It wouldn't make sense at all.
The bulk of the UK is probably closer to Finland in climate than either of us.
soldar:
Well, yes, obviously any solution needs to be tailored to the specific circumstances and many factors come into play like different costs of energy sources, type of use, etc.
Someone:
--- Quote from: soldar on July 25, 2019, 12:38:03 pm ---
--- Quote from: Someone on July 25, 2019, 11:25:15 am ---All the units I'm familiar with do have power control with ratios over 20, even beyond a factor of 30 so based on your choice of numbers they work fine. This is going back 20 years so its nothing new or exclusive, there are multiple suppliers of products which meet those requirements.
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I am interested in this. I'd like to see a gas water heater that can modulate output from say 12 KW down to say 500 W. Sounds very interesting.
Other than that there is no need to belittle my preference just as I don't belittle yours. You do whatever you want. I don't care. Just allow others their own choice.
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Not disagreeing with your preferences but you repeated provably false statements as fact, so just correcting your misinformed position that you make so loudly. 500W is down in the electric power level, most gas systems bottom out at a few kW but since they are all continuous flow models you can have multiple in series/parallel configurations for people with very special requirements for ranges or volumes of water.
--- Quote from: paulca on July 25, 2019, 09:19:01 pm ---
--- Quote from: Someone on July 25, 2019, 11:25:15 am ---If you can't possibly wash you hands in the kitchen with 43 degree water while someone else is showering, or wait for them to finish their shower before running a washing tub at 60 degrees, then you've got some first world problems.
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So you are suggesting that when I want hot water of X degrees for X purpose I put my shoes on and go out to the boiler and set the hot water temperature manually and when I then want to use the water at Y degrees for Y purpose I go and change the temperature at the boiler again?
Who does that? In fact most combi boilers with on demand hot water are just set at MAX and you mix hot and cold at the demand with a mixer tap. They are of course differential, so if you want a low temp, it's mostly cold and very little hot is used. The boiler will put out hotter water with a lessened flow, but it's really not an issue and surprisingly easy to balance by moving the tap, or shower valve.
The benefit of this approach with a shower is that you must mix a bunch of cold into the hot, which gives you even higher pressure.
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Its like you are living in the 19th century. We have controls inside the house to set the temperature, no messing with mixer taps to try and get the temperature where you want it.
sambonator:
I thought this thread was about this...
paulca:
--- Quote from: Someone on July 26, 2019, 03:22:46 am ---Its like you are living in the 19th century. We have controls inside the house to set the temperature, no messing with mixer taps to try and get the temperature where you want it.
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Do you have multiple boilers too for when there are more than one person in the house and they want different water temp? What about when the washing machine fills (if it's a hot fill model)?
In the UK the heating systems are fairly simple and as someone correctly pointed out the "heating season" is most of the year. In fact I run my heating at least 30 minutes every morning 365 days a year. In summer here, if it's sunny and/or warm then you really don't need the heating, but "summer" here in Northern Ireland is about one, maybe two weeks, before it returns to cloudy, rainy, cool and damp again and the heating will be needed the odd evening. From September to May it's needed at least 1-2 hours a day, more like 4-8 hours a day in winter when it's -2*C in the mornings, is dawn at 9am, dusk at 4pm and the temp barely gets above 5*C most days.
19th century, no, but my house, like the vast majority of them was build decades ago (1968 actually). There are houses around here build 100 years ago. Sure they could be modernised (and I'm trying to modernise mine), but there are limits to what you can do depending on your budget. New builds with vast acreage are very rare here, unless you want to live in the middle or nowhere or can afford to spend millions on your house. I gather that is not quite the same as Aus. A 3 bed semi detached with a total of aprox. 100m2 footprint is circa 150,000GBP, a large detached house with 200m2 is going to cost you 300,000GBP. Renovating that £150,000 house to be all modern tech like your image suggests will cost you 30,000-100,000GBP. Even just a new basic heating system will cost me 3,000-5,000.
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