General > General Technical Chat
Electricians - an awkward bunch to deal with
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tggzzz:

--- Quote from: TERRA Operative on March 29, 2023, 06:27:07 am ---The regulations weren't put in place by the government, they were originally enforced by the insurance companies. Wiring not up to code? No insurance..
It comes down to money in the end. Insurance companies won't want to take the risk on a dangerous policy, dangerous to their bottom line that is.

--- End quote ---

That's too often forgotten.

A similar example was used to wind the masses up to prepare them to vote for Brexit: "The EU mandates how straight cucumbers must be".

True. But they did it because the growers and shops wanted them to.
tggzzz:

--- Quote from: AVGresponding on March 29, 2023, 07:39:29 am ---People are people,

--- End quote ---

Precisely.

I like the Middle European variant of that: "Mensch ist mensch", the whole world over.
paulca:

--- Quote from: tggzzz on March 29, 2023, 10:05:02 am ---
--- Quote from: vk6zgo on March 29, 2023, 01:50:12 am ---
--- Quote from: unknownparticle on March 28, 2023, 08:19:20 pm ---Yeah, sparkies do tend to have a jumped up sense of self importance, particularly now they have all that complex test equipment to play with!!
And yet I've seen more utter botchery on domestic wiring installs than in any other electrical or electronic systems!

--- End quote ---

If the wiring is neat, it was some illicit stuff done by a Technician------not an Engineer, their stuff is as "bodgie" as a sparky!

--- End quote ---

Just so.

Once, 40 years ago, some of my wiring inside a prototype electric door mechanism was criticised as not being especially neat. I agreed, pointing out that I wasn't a technician. I also pointed out something in the design that a technician might have missed. The designer didn't want to acknowledge the issue; the prototype was never reliable.

If I need a diagnosis of a medical problem, I want a doctor to do it. If I want blood taken or a leg plastered, I want a nurse to do it. Vive la difference!

--- End quote ---

You know that's fair.  Because when it comes to physically installing the inverter, I actually want the spark to do it and a large part of that IS that it will be done more "tidy" and maybe with aesthetic pride if I'm lucky.  For the two or three aspects I show an interest in, he will have another 10 I never thought about of which only maybe 5 I would have found out "the hard way" mid job with the wrong tools and supplies.

I'm just trying to be an educated consumer in understanding what I need and not what I will be sold.

EDIT:  I went off scaring myself looking for people blowing up these inverters.  It will not surprise you that almost all of them came down to the simple things.  Stuffing only 1/4" of stranded AC 30Amp cable into spring clip posts on the inverter....  yep.  LOL.  The same guy after having to ASK Victron why it went on fire and receiving the advice that the wire had not enough run out and should be sleived or ferruled then started questioning the use of ferrules with stranded cable giving some whacky reason about the copper spreading out and making more contact...  I can see him setting fire to a few more things.
tggzzz:

--- Quote from: tszaboo on March 29, 2023, 08:08:03 am ---IMHO the issue is not with you doing something at home. The issue is with other people (including future you). You expect the electrical system of a place to work in a certain way. When you plug into an outlet, you expect something to happen, or when you flip a switch. If you do something that's outside the code, or you don't know the code, unexpected things lead to unsafe situations.

--- End quote ---

Daughter is having a lot of work done on the house she is moving into, including rebuilding two kitchens.

Sparky damn near electrocuted himself.

He had isolated the ringmain in one kitchen, and checked sockets weren't live. He started removing one socket, and got a nasty shock. That one socket was on a different ringmain.

Yes, he acknowledges he should have checked 100% of the sockets, but only checked 90% of them. "There, but for the grace of God, go I".
tggzzz:

--- Quote from: paulca on March 29, 2023, 10:16:08 am ---
--- Quote from: tggzzz on March 29, 2023, 10:05:02 am ---
--- Quote from: vk6zgo on March 29, 2023, 01:50:12 am ---
--- Quote from: unknownparticle on March 28, 2023, 08:19:20 pm ---Yeah, sparkies do tend to have a jumped up sense of self importance, particularly now they have all that complex test equipment to play with!!
And yet I've seen more utter botchery on domestic wiring installs than in any other electrical or electronic systems!

--- End quote ---

If the wiring is neat, it was some illicit stuff done by a Technician------not an Engineer, their stuff is as "bodgie" as a sparky!

--- End quote ---

Just so.

Once, 40 years ago, some of my wiring inside a prototype electric door mechanism was criticised as not being especially neat. I agreed, pointing out that I wasn't a technician. I also pointed out something in the design that a technician might have missed. The designer didn't want to acknowledge the issue; the prototype was never reliable.

If I need a diagnosis of a medical problem, I want a doctor to do it. If I want blood taken or a leg plastered, I want a nurse to do it. Vive la difference!

--- End quote ---

You know that's fair.  Because when it comes to physically installing the inverter, I actually want the spark to do it and a large part of that IS that it will be done more "tidy" and maybe with aesthetic pride if I'm lucky.  For the two or three aspects I show an interest in, he will have another 10 I never thought about of which only maybe 5 I would have found out "the hard way" mid job with the wrong tools and supplies.

--- End quote ---

It goes both ways: you each catch things the other doesn't catch.

In general, neither an engineer/doctor or a technician/nurse is sufficient. Both are necessary.

I distrust the knowledge and judgement of those that don't realise that.
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