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Electroboom: How Right IS Veritasium?! Don't Electrons Push Each Other??
AnalogueLove1867:
--- Quote from: electrodacus on July 03, 2022, 05:39:44 pm ---
--- Quote from: AnalogueLove1867 on July 03, 2022, 10:09:10 am ---What I am saying isn't a theory ( it is well established fact ).
And it isn't a unifying field theory of everything.
Likewise, nobody has ever produced a unifying field theory and I doubt that it is even possible.
It could be just as futile as trying to create a perpetual energy machine.
--- End quote ---
Perpetual motion machine means only eliminating friction and at microscale that is possible as a current flow (electron stream) can be sustained forever (as far as we can measure) in a superconductor.
So a closed loop of superconductor wire in which you induce an electrical current will be maintained forever (at least we can not measure any reduction in current).
But if you check Veritasium video about the Faster than wind direct downwind vehicle you will see him basically claiming not perpetual motion but much worse overunity.
He claims vehicle can drive forever faster than wind in the same direction which will mean overunity but he can not understand even that is what he is saying.
It is worse that an university physics professor lost 10K as it was unable to explain how the vehicle works.
I tried to explain that vehicle has an energy storage device (the propeller) that creates a pressure differential (air is a compressible fluid) and that stored energy is what allows vehicle to just temporarily exceed wind speed.
They just made incomplete tests and drawn wrong conclusions about what they were seeing and even changed well known equations to fit what they think they saw.
That video, especially the second one where he doubled down by showing a University professor incapable to understand how it works lose the argument and bet gave me PTSD.
I just imagined smart young people failing to get in to university because the solved correctly this problem and the professors failing them.
And yes this exact problem was present in US at least in physics competitions.
You will think that access to all this information will make the society smarter overall but it seems that wrong information travels and spreads much faster and people do not have the time to think.
--- End quote ---
I just watched your video analysis of the blackbird faster-than-wind device. Cheers . :-+
You must be 100% right on that one. Completely agree with you.
I prefer your definition of perpetual motion because it fits the name better.
Perpetual motion historically has been a goal for things like running a water pump forever
"Over-Unity" is a modern new-age hippy term that means exactly the same thing with the same impossible goal.
Full of crackpots and vicious scam artists.
Perpetual motion of a flywheel with no load is impossible because there is always loss. Even in a hard vacuum with magnetic levitation.
Even atoms vibrate less and less, gradually cooling down over time if they receive no outside energy
Perpetual motion with a load is also impossible.
Although there is no resistance in superconductors, They don't maintain superconductivity forever due to the
interference of outside magnetic fields over time ( apparently from stuff I've read). So although they are extremely efficient, they still require some energy
to 1) maintain the low temperature obviously and 2) Top up the Current every now and then.
Out of curiosity I tried to find an article about superconductors running continuously with no current top-up for years and couldn't find anything.
Petrol stored in a shed would be a better long term energy storage solution than a superconducting loop.
Theoretically a Vacuum capacitor would also retain its charge forever. But knowing how the world works that wouldn't be true.
For info on flywheel losses
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/343930266_Analysis_of_Standby_Losses_and_Charging_Cycles_in_Flywheel_Energy_Storage_Systems
electrodacus:
--- Quote from: AnalogueLove1867 on July 04, 2022, 06:03:34 am ---
I just watched your video analysis of the blackbird faster-than-wind device. Cheers . :-+
--- End quote ---
It is a boring video. Wish I was more entertaining as many mentioned could not watch more than 2 or 3 minutes.
I made the video more to have a summary of what I was replaying on forums.
I had long conversations including with Derek (via email) and with the owner of Blackbird on a forum tho they can not be convinced.
They have seen the results of an incomplete experiment and they think that is proof and they modify equations so that it sort of fits what they think they seen in the experiment.
I feel that the "energy doesn't flow in wire" videos and faster than wind direct down wind powered only by the wind videos have similar things in common and that is understanding energy and energy storage. Energy storage is always ignored and when mentioned is just dismissed as relevant.
The term perpetuum mobile is the ability for something to move forever with no loss so you can store the energy you put in do not create any energy from nothing.
electrodacus:
--- Quote from: AnalogueLove1867 on July 04, 2022, 06:03:34 am ---Although there is no resistance in superconductors, They don't maintain superconductivity forever due to the
interference of outside magnetic fields over time ( apparently from stuff I've read). So although they are extremely efficient, they still require some energy
to 1) maintain the low temperature obviously and 2) Top up the Current every now and then.
Out of curiosity I tried to find an article about superconductors running continuously with no current top-up for years and couldn't find anything.
Petrol stored in a shed would be a better long term energy storage solution than a superconducting loop.
Theoretically a Vacuum capacitor would also retain its charge forever. But knowing how the world works that wouldn't be true.
--- End quote ---
If there is no resistance (equivalent with no friction) then nothing can slow down the flow of electrons in an isolated system. You can shield the system form outside influence.
I'm not an expert in superconductivity, superfluids or most things related to quantum mechanical properties.
It seems super conductivity and superfluids have quite a bit in common. Here is a short video about superfluids
AnalogueLove1867:
--- Quote from: electrodacus on July 04, 2022, 06:56:24 am ---
--- Quote from: AnalogueLove1867 on July 04, 2022, 06:03:34 am ---Although there is no resistance in superconductors, They don't maintain superconductivity forever due to the
interference of outside magnetic fields over time ( apparently from stuff I've read). So although they are extremely efficient, they still require some energy
to 1) maintain the low temperature obviously and 2) Top up the Current every now and then.
Out of curiosity I tried to find an article about superconductors running continuously with no current top-up for years and couldn't find anything.
Petrol stored in a shed would be a better long term energy storage solution than a superconducting loop.
Theoretically a Vacuum capacitor would also retain its charge forever. But knowing how the world works that wouldn't be true.
--- End quote ---
If there is no resistance (equivalent with no friction) then nothing can slow down the flow of electrons in an isolated system. You can shield the system form outside influence.
I'm not an expert in superconductivity, superfluids or most things related to quantum mechanical properties.
It seems super conductivity and superfluids have quite a bit in common. Here is a short video about superfluids
--- End quote ---
Yeah, completely agree with you. No resistance so no loss by that mechanism.
Placing a piece of unmagnetized iron next to the superconductor loop would also reduce the current of the loop as it expends energy in magnetizing the iron.
Same goes with the air and other moving gases or liquids. the flow of air past a superconductor would gradually extract energy because it has a relative permeability of 1.00000037 lol.
So you would need magnetic shielding AND a vacuum to prevent those loss mechanisms.
Just don't understand why nobody has done a long-term superconducting energy storage test. Seems crazy. Would love it if someone could find some study over months or years.
PlainName:
--- Quote from: electrodacus on July 03, 2022, 11:50:00 pm ---
--- Quote from: dunkemhigh on July 03, 2022, 11:34:47 pm ---
--- Quote ---In the SPICE simulation you do not define the length of the wire
--- End quote ---
You're a piece of work, eh. The wires are virtually non-existent. Zero length, as close as you can make them. Even if they were 10ft long (3m and a bit for the EU) whatever effect they could have would be NOTHING compared to the 1W burned up by the resistor, not the 1V of the supply.
It seems that you cannot actually answer the question and instead just go off on the slightest thing as a diversion.
--- End quote ---
I answered your question but maybe you missed the replay. Or you only read the first row of my replays as some others are doing.
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/electroboom-how-right-is-veritasium!-dont-electrons-push-each-other/msg4277425/#msg4277425
--- End quote ---
I just quote the relevant part of your post that I am commenting to, not the wall of irrelevant text (some exclusions). Just because it's not quoted doesn't mean it wasn't read. Although you seem to not be able to read or understand posts you comment to!
And, actually, you didn't answer the question. You go on about how one circuit is 1V/1W and the other is 2V/2W and that's exactly the point! Despite that difference, there is still 1A going along that top wire.
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