Electronic Horror Gallery

[kizzap]

The biggest "horror show" I could think of was in the aftermath of hurricane Sandy, where one of the telephone exchanges in Manhattan was flooded to the point that all the paper covered copper was flooded. The cables had air pumped through them deliberately to stop flood waters getting into the paper, but it proved ineffective as the pumping stations also went under water. As a bonus, even paper covered copper that was above the flood-line was wet, due to capillary action. Contractors were ripping up parts of the road so they could dry the area/get fresh air in.

Photos here:

http://www.theverge.com/2012/11/17/3655442/restoring-verizon-service-manhattan-hurricane-sandy

[TVman]

Oh wow.

[abaxas]

The biggest "horror show" I could think of was in the aftermath of hurricane Sandy, where one of the telephone exchanges in Manhattan was flooded to the point that all the paper covered copper was flooded. The cables had air pumped through them deliberately to stop flood waters getting into the paper, but it proved ineffective as the pumping stations also went under water. As a bonus, even paper covered copper that was above the flood-line was wet, due to capillary action. Contractors were ripping up parts of the road so they could dry the area/get fresh air in.

Photos here:

http://www.theverge.com/2012/11/17/3655442/restoring-verizon-service-manhattan-hurricane-sandy

Surely someone got sacked for putting it in such a stupid place?

[amyk]

The biggest "horror show" I could think of was in the aftermath of hurricane Sandy, where one of the telephone exchanges in Manhattan was flooded to the point that all the paper covered copper was flooded. The cables had air pumped through them deliberately to stop flood waters getting into the paper, but it proved ineffective as the pumping stations also went under water. As a bonus, even paper covered copper that was above the flood-line was wet, due to capillary action. Contractors were ripping up parts of the road so they could dry the area/get fresh air in.

Photos here:

http://www.theverge.com/2012/11/17/3655442/restoring-verizon-service-manhattan-hurricane-sandy

Reminds me of this: http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-25862543

[aroby]

The biggest "horror show" I could think of was in the aftermath of hurricane Sandy, where one of the telephone exchanges in Manhattan was flooded to the point that all the paper covered copper was flooded.

It's only events like that that force the modernization that was well overdue.

Anthony

[janoc]

Well see in Russia, they dont safegaurd everything like in the US. If you want to be an idiot, they allow you to be an idiot. Plenty of things are done in Russia and you can see on youtube.

Hmm, how many electrified railway tracks are in the US and in Russia? I hope you do realize that there are thousands of kilometers of electrified track in Russia and it would be physically impossible to guard every meter of it. So if an idiot wants to climb on a train and risk death, they have ample opportunities to do so ...

In Slovakia, where I am from, there are every year several people either killed or severely burned because they are climbing over stationary railway cars at stations (often to avoid having to walk around the entire train) - and get hit by the 25kV AC arc. And that is in stations, which are usually being watched by cameras and with staff being around.

What has me really puzzled is how it is possible that the two morons on the locomotive don't get fried while standing on the roof and pulling the pantograph down - the roof is normally not insulated from the chassis of the engine and there are usually beefy ceramic insulators on which the pantograph assembly is mounted for that reason.

[Bored@Work]

What has me really puzzled is how it is possible that the two morons on the locomotive don't get fried while standing on the roof and pulling the pantograph down - the roof is normally not insulated from the chassis of the engine and there are usually beefy ceramic insulators on which the pantograph assembly is mounted for that reason.

Gloves and luck.

[max666]

In Slovakia, where I am from, there are every year several people either killed or severely burned because they are climbing over stationary railway cars at stations (often to avoid having to walk around the entire train) - and get hit by the 25kV AC arc. And that is in stations, which are usually being watched by cameras and with staff being around.

What has me really puzzled is how it is possible that the two morons on the locomotive don't get fried while standing on the roof and pulling the pantograph down - the roof is normally not insulated from the chassis of the engine and there are usually beefy ceramic insulators on which the pantograph assembly is mounted for that reason.

What puzzles me is how anyone can think that climbing over a train is easier than going around 
Don't you guys have underpasses in Slovakia?

As others have suggested, the train track in the video might only be running on 3kV, and the yellow ends of the pantograph look to be insulated.

[Bored@Work]

What puzzles me is how anyone can think that climbing over a train is easier than going around 
Don't you guys have underpasses in Slovakia?

You can see the same attitude on this forum. I have given up counting the number of times I got beaten to pulp her just because I suggested a particular practice or instrument is unsafe. What could possibly go wrong? But it is cheaper! But it is faster! I have always done it this way! I pay attention when doing this. Bureaucratic bullshit, restricting my freedom! Real men do it this way. I don't care, I don't have to.

[rob77]

In Slovakia, where I am from, there are every year several people either killed or severely burned because they are climbing over stationary railway cars at stations (often to avoid having to walk around the entire train) - and get hit by the 25kV AC arc. And that is in stations, which are usually being watched by cameras and with staff being around.

What has me really puzzled is how it is possible that the two morons on the locomotive don't get fried while standing on the roof and pulling the pantograph down - the roof is normally not insulated from the chassis of the engine and there are usually beefy ceramic insulators on which the pantograph assembly is mounted for that reason.

What puzzles me is how anyone can think that climbing over a train is easier than going around 
Don't you guys have underpasses in Slovakia?

As others have suggested, the train track in the video might only be running on 3kV, and the yellow ends of the pantograph look to be insulated.

actually it's not true... there were some cases in the past , but it's definitely not a several cases per year. i would say it's rather one case per several years.

but the number of lazy dumb-asses is not so low here
basically it's not about climbing over a train like those russian stupid kids... it's more about crossing a railroad through a "parked" train's  freight carriages (the open ones) - the air gap between the person and the 25kV is significant.  - it might be considered even kind of safe if it's not raining and the person doesn't carry an umbrella but i wouldn't do that , i would rather walk around the train - even if it would be several hundreds of meters.
another point is why to even do it rather than use the over/underpass - the trains are never parked on places where a pedestrian is supposed to cross the railroad and there is no over/underpass.

and i need to mention that it's strictly prohibited to even cross the railroad on places not dedicated for crossing.warning signs are present on all railroad stations. if the railroad police is catching you, then you get fined.

[max666]

... Real men do it this way. ...

Actually that would be a good enough reason for me 

[GabYoung92]

I had this customer once who bought a small switch, a 1m 12V LED strip, a 3A fuse and fuseholder from me. He came back 30 minutes later and wanted a bigger fuse. Sold him a 10A this time. Another 30 minutes later he was back again, again demanding a bigger fuse, 20A this time. Another half hour later he wanted a 30A fuse.
At this moment I asked him what the problem was. He told me his LED strip kept blowing his fuses. I started asking him what he'd done exactly and from his answers I drew this little sketch.

I'm sure you can see his mistake...

I work at Jaycar, and I can tell you that this is seen almost daily! The amount of times I have to explain how to wire up a switch and how people are shocked that "positive and negative" don't go into the switch...

[Tinkerer]

Well see in Russia, they dont safegaurd everything like in the US. If you want to be an idiot, they allow you to be an idiot. Plenty of things are done in Russia and you can see on youtube.

Hmm, how many electrified railway tracks are in the US and in Russia? I hope you do realize that there are thousands of kilometers of electrified track in Russia and it would be physically impossible to guard every meter of it. So if an idiot wants to climb on a train and risk death, they have ample opportunities to do so ...

In Slovakia, where I am from, there are every year several people either killed or severely burned because they are climbing over stationary railway cars at stations (often to avoid having to walk around the entire train) - and get hit by the 25kV AC arc. And that is in stations, which are usually being watched by cameras and with staff being around.

What has me really puzzled is how it is possible that the two morons on the locomotive don't get fried while standing on the roof and pulling the pantograph down - the roof is normally not insulated from the chassis of the engine and there are usually beefy ceramic insulators on which the pantograph assembly is mounted for that reason.

I did not mean literally guarded like that. In the US they generally put impediaments in your way and signs and all that and if someone sees you, you will likely be arrested etc. In Russia, when people see you, they either dont give a damn, or you are told off usually; not sure how many safety signs etc they got.

[TVman]

Well see in Russia, they dont safegaurd everything like in the US. If you want to be an idiot, they allow you to be an idiot. Plenty of things are done in Russia and you can see on youtube.

Hmm, how many electrified railway tracks are in the US and in Russia? I hope you do realize that there are thousands of kilometers of electrified track in Russia and it would be physically impossible to guard every meter of it. So if an idiot wants to climb on a train and risk death, they have ample opportunities to do so ...

In Slovakia, where I am from, there are every year several people either killed or severely burned because they are climbing over stationary railway cars at stations (often to avoid having to walk around the entire train) - and get hit by the 25kV AC arc. And that is in stations, which are usually being watched by cameras and with staff being around.

What has me really puzzled is how it is possible that the two morons on the locomotive don't get fried while standing on the roof and pulling the pantograph down - the roof is normally not insulated from the chassis of the engine and there are usually beefy ceramic insulators on which the pantograph assembly is mounted for that reason.

I did not mean literally guarded like that. In the US they generally put impediaments in your way and signs and all that and if someone sees you, you will likely be arrested etc. In Russia, when people see you, they either dont give a damn, or you are told off usually; not sure how many safety signs etc they got.

Of course.

[janoc]

I did not mean literally guarded like that. In the US they generally put impediaments in your way and signs and all that and if someone sees you, you will likely be arrested etc. In Russia, when people see you, they either dont give a damn, or you are told off usually; not sure how many safety signs etc they got.

Ehm, then UK has to be the safest place on Earth, judging by the amount of various warning and safety signs ... And yes, even Russians do use signs and know that electricity is deadly. Do you really believe that the signs would prevent something like that? 

I think the difference is more in the mentality of the people. You see that sort of stunt and go "WTF?! Idiot!", however a lot of people from my country would think - "Oh, cool!" instead. It has to a lot to do with the cultural norms in the place - which are obviously not the same everywhere. Good example of this are the various sexism and sexual harassment scandals - what gets you fired in one place gets you admiration from your peers elsewhere ... 

[janoc]

What puzzles me is how anyone can think that climbing over a train is easier than going around 
Don't you guys have underpasses in Slovakia?

Did you ever see an underpass in a railway yard or a cargo station? And yes, people do think that climbing between cars is faster, because the trains could be easily few hundreds of meters long - 800m long cargo consists are quite common.

The people are not supposed to be walking over the tracks in the first place - there are usually fences and everything, but they still do it, because it saves them detours and few minutes (doesn't make it any less stupid or dangerous, of course). I used to live near a rather busy line and there were fatal accidents with people being killed by passing trains every week or two - only trying to save about 5 minutes of walking to an underpass when trying to reach a bus stop on the other side ...

As others have suggested, the train track in the video might only be running on 3kV, and the yellow ends of the pantograph look to be insulated.

3kV will still fry you to a crisp, it just doesn't arc as far as 25kV does. And no, the yellow ends are *not* insulated - that's only the original colour of the pantograph assembly.

Not sure whether this is the same engine type, but here you can see the typical arrangement on the roof:

http://spz.logout.cz/foto2005/vl80s_1811mk_ds.jpg

See the large insulators on which the pantograph is sitting? The entire assembly is live and there is a thick main wire going from it to the traction circuits.

[Thilo78]

Ehm, then UK has to be the safest place on Earth, judging by the amount of various warning and safety signs ...

Oh, always keep  in mind:
Warning signs are not there to keep people safe. They have been installed so that after an incident companies can say: "See, we told you so! No refunds here!"

It's the same with warning signs as with safety instructions, manuals, and so on.

We live in an insurance society, and it's all about keeping the risk at the lowest end of the food chain.

[janoc]

actually it's not true... there were some cases in the past , but it's definitely not a several cases per year. i would say it's rather one case per several years.

 it might be considered even kind of safe if it's not raining and the person doesn't carry an umbrella

It is more frequent than that - my ex used to work in a burns yard in a hospital - and they had multiple cases every year. Usually teens that got caught by a 25kV arc while trying to climb over a parked train. It doesn't take much, especially if the dumbass tries to climb using the ladders on the cars instead of going straight over the buffers.

[G7PSK]

Well see in Russia, they dont safegaurd everything like in the US. If you want to be an idiot, they allow you to be an idiot. Plenty of things are done in Russia and you can see on youtube.

Hmm, how many electrified railway tracks are in the US and in Russia? I hope you do realize that there are thousands of kilometers of electrified track in Russia and it would be physically impossible to guard every meter of it. So if an idiot wants to climb on a train and risk death, they have ample opportunities to do so ...

In Slovakia, where I am from, there are every year several people either killed or severely burned because they are climbing over stationary railway cars at stations (often to avoid having to walk around the entire train) - and get hit by the 25kV AC arc. And that is in stations, which are usually being watched by cameras and with staff being around.

What has me really puzzled is how it is possible that the two morons on the locomotive don't get fried while standing on the roof and pulling the pantograph down - the roof is normally not insulated from the chassis of the engine and there are usually beefy ceramic insulators on which the pantograph assembly is mounted for that reason.

Rubber shoes on wood duck boards and rubber gloves, if you look at the top of the train there are wooden boards running down both sides and the voltage is only three thousand.

[janoc]

Rubber shoes on wood duck boards and rubber gloves, if you look at the top of the train there are wooden boards running down both sides and the voltage is only three thousand.

That could explain it, but it is still an incredibly stupid thing to do - all it would take is a bit of moisture on the boards. I am not sure how thick the rubber soles and gloves would have to be to protect you even from "only" 3kV shooting through.

[amyk]

I am not sure how thick the rubber soles and gloves would have to be to protect you even from "only" 3kV shooting through.

In ideal conditions, ~1cm of rubber would probably be enough; see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dielectric_strength

Since conditions are never ideal there was definitely current flowing through them in that video, it just wasn't enough to be perceptible.

Of course, the amount of energy available if the insulation does break down is a different matter altogether....

[SeanB]

Just look for Train surfing and you will see some horrid footage.

Saw a building where they were doing some renovation, and the builders were using an extension cord that was rather well used. No plug on the end into the wall, just the 3 brass pins where there used to be a plugtop, and with bare wiring showing at spots all the way along the cord, and the socket at the end being broken.

The cable below was in use until the beam was removed because of woodborer........

[NiHaoMike]

The biggest "horror show" I could think of was in the aftermath of hurricane Sandy, where one of the telephone exchanges in Manhattan was flooded to the point that all the paper covered copper was flooded. The cables had air pumped through them deliberately to stop flood waters getting into the paper, but it proved ineffective as the pumping stations also went under water. As a bonus, even paper covered copper that was above the flood-line was wet, due to capillary action. Contractors were ripping up parts of the road so they could dry the area/get fresh air in.

Photos here:

http://www.theverge.com/2012/11/17/3655442/restoring-verizon-service-manhattan-hurricane-sandy

Any reason they wouldn't throw some high power RF (a few hundred watts) on the lines to dry them out?

[SeanB]

Wet paper plus copper plus the regular 48V battery bus voltage means a green goo within minutes as the copper corrodes out of the cable into the paper. The lines probably were powered until the local battery banks failed from salt water ingress into the cells.

[Tinkerer]

I did not mean literally guarded like that. In the US they generally put impediaments in your way and signs and all that and if someone sees you, you will likely be arrested etc. In Russia, when people see you, they either dont give a damn, or you are told off usually; not sure how many safety signs etc they got.

Ehm, then UK has to be the safest place on Earth, judging by the amount of various warning and safety signs ... And yes, even Russians do use signs and know that electricity is deadly. Do you really believe that the signs would prevent something like that? 

I think the difference is more in the mentality of the people. You see that sort of stunt and go "WTF?! Idiot!", however a lot of people from my country would think - "Oh, cool!" instead. It has to a lot to do with the cultural norms in the place - which are obviously not the same everywhere. Good example of this are the various sexism and sexual harassment scandals - what gets you fired in one place gets you admiration from your peers elsewhere ... 

Like other commenters say, the signs are for insurence purposes. I am sure that signs do persuade some of the less inclined people however and possibly those who may somehow be ignorant of the danger. For the other people, they help provide ample "wtf-ness" when they do violate them.

The biggest "horror show" I could think of was in the aftermath of hurricane Sandy, where one of the telephone exchanges in Manhattan was flooded to the point that all the paper covered copper was flooded. The cables had air pumped through them deliberately to stop flood waters getting into the paper, but it proved ineffective as the pumping stations also went under water. As a bonus, even paper covered copper that was above the flood-line was wet, due to capillary action. Contractors were ripping up parts of the road so they could dry the area/get fresh air in.

Photos here:

http://www.theverge.com/2012/11/17/3655442/restoring-verizon-service-manhattan-hurricane-sandy

Any reason they wouldn't throw some high power RF (a few hundred watts) on the lines to dry them out?

Possibly because of shorting hazard. Dirty water does conduct and because everything was wet, you wouldnt just wanna shove energy down the line as it might end up electrifying that water faucet someone is using nearby...(for example, I would find it unlikely somewhat, but the hazard I would not count out) Plus the fact that like commented, "green goo".