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Elon Musk is a nice chap

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james_s:

--- Quote from: PlainName on December 19, 2022, 12:45:37 am ---
--- Quote ---It seems that Musk can't do the latter, either, so civil action is the best recourse in his case
--- End quote ---

I am missing something here. If Musk can take out a civil action, then (assuming he succeeds) what does it matter if the thing is or isn't illegal? If he wins then clearly it is wrong, even if not illegal.

I get the impression the argument has degenerated to focus on "it's illegal" "no it's not" whereas what should be considered is just whether the chap shouldn't be doing it or it's perfectly acceptable.

--- End quote ---

Clearly *he* thinks it's wrong, or that the court will side with him, or more likely, faced with the prospect of going to court the person will stop doing it, I think the latter is the most likely motivation. In the USA you can take someone to court for literally any reason, you don't have to have a leg to stand on, you only have to be able to afford to pay the lawyer. There is a risk though, a judge can simply throw out your case without looking at it if they think it's frivolous, or they can judge against you and you can be out everything you spent on court costs, or worse, you can be hit with a counter suit and have to pay the costs of the person you're suing. Musk is rich, he doesn't have to care about any of that, he can sue anyone he wants just for fun and he knows it. This sort of thing happens all the time here, people are effectively extorted into settling out of court because going to court can end up costing them a lot more.

vk6zgo:

--- Quote from: PlainName on December 19, 2022, 12:45:37 am ---
--- Quote ---It seems that Musk can't do the latter, either, so civil action is the best recourse in his case
--- End quote ---

I am missing something here. If Musk can take out a civil action, then (assuming he succeeds) what does it matter if the thing is or isn't illegal? If he wins then clearly it is wrong, even if not illegal.

I get the impression the argument has degenerated to focus on "it's illegal" "no it's not" whereas what should be considered is just whether the chap shouldn't be doing it or it's perfectly acceptable.

--- End quote ---

A civil suit normally concentrates upon whether what is done injures the person bringing the suit in any way.
If the person being sued loses, they normally have to pay damages & cease the offending action.

If something is illegal, in Australia, it is officially an offence against "The Crown" (King Charles III in all his glory ;D ;D), but in effect against the State or the Commonwealth of Australia.
You may have to pay a fine, or perhaps be sent to the slammer, depending on the seriousness of the offence.

Most countries have similar laws.

PlainName:

--- Quote from: vad on December 18, 2022, 03:47:55 pm ---
--- Quote from: Stray Electron on December 18, 2022, 02:48:15 am ---That is clearly STALKING.

--- End quote ---
Musk is a public figure who loves to be in public spotlight both on TV, in the press and while twitting to his 121 million followers. He is known for making political statements in public, and making actions that impact political system both in this country and around the world.

As being the public figure, Musk does not have the same privacy protections as a private citizen has. It is of public interest to know every piece of Elon’s life: including information about his travel destinations, who he golfs with, who his mistress is, and what did he eat for breakfast. This also includes information about his adult family members. People who are obsessed with Hunter Biden’s affairs should fully support the last part.

If Musk was a typical workaholic CEO, who screws competitors, demands employees to work 80 hours a week while sleeping in the office, enjoys private jets, yachts and expensive mansions, but keeps his mouth shut in public, then that would be a completely different story.

--- End quote ---

So engaging with people on social media means one is public and fair game? If you post a Youtube video are you now fair game for 'public interest'? Are YOU fair game because clearly you want to engage in public on this forum? How about Dave? He's not exactly shy, so would it be OK to stalk him for 'public interest'?

Sorry, but I think that just because someone is well known it doesn't mean they lose their right to privacy. Actors are famous and stalked, but all they are doing is a job and once that job is done they are a private person like you and me. You will say that they promote themselves on Twitter and Facebook, but why should they be silenced merely because you know of them from another source?

I think there some element of envy involved here: those people are famous and rolling in money whereas I am not, so therefore they should suffer where I don't.

PlainName:

--- Quote ---A civil suit normally concentrates upon whether what is done injures the person bringing the suit in any way.
--- End quote ---

Well feel free to correct me, but if someone has been injured then surely the person causing that has been naughty.

james_s:

--- Quote from: PlainName on December 19, 2022, 01:05:46 am ---So engaging with people on social media means one is public and fair game? If you post a Youtube video are you now fair game for 'public interest'? Are YOU fair game because clearly you want to engage in public on this forum? How about Dave? He's not exactly shy, so would it be OK to stalk him for 'public interest'?

Sorry, but I think that just because someone is well known it doesn't mean they lose their right to privacy. Actors are famous and stalked, but all they are doing is a job and once that job is done they are a private person like you and me. You will say that they promote themselves on Twitter and Facebook, but why should they be silenced merely because you know of them from another source?

I think there some element of envy involved here: those people are famous and rolling in money whereas I am not, so therefore they should suffer where I don't.

--- End quote ---

Yes. Again what you think is irrelevant, it does not matter at all to anyone but you. The only thing that matters is what the law says. If something is against the law then it's a crime, if not then it's legal to do.

If someone wants to track Dave's whereabouts it is perfectly ok for them to do that (in the USA at least, I do not know about Australian law) and it is not stalking. To stalk someone requires either physical presence on their property or unwanted communications. You can't follow Dave around and heckle him everywhere he goes, that would be harassment and a pattern of this could be considered stalking. There is nothing to stop you from creating a website that shows his location and following him around from a distance in public observing where he goes and what he does. A person has no right to privacy when they are in public, no matter who they are, that has been long established. It's annoying, I could understand him being irritated with you, and I would question your motivation for doing so, but it is not stalking and it is not a crime. He could try to sue somebody for doing it, and in most cases the person would probably stop rather than risk losing in court but there is absolutely no guarantee that he would win if it did go to court.

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