General > General Technical Chat
Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
<< < (9/14) > >>
drussell:

--- Quote from: SilverSolder on December 29, 2020, 05:19:49 pm ---I also have a DAZOR brand lamp over my work bench, which uses two real fluorescent tubes...    I could replace the tubes with LEDs, but why would I do that when the fluorescent tubes are just so awesome? :D


--- End quote ---

If it is a darkish brown like it appears in your photo, then I've got one of the exact same model of articulating drafting table lamp as that.  :)  Little red and black start/off buttons on top....

It's quite old but it is very handy, works perfectly and I really like it.
tooki:

--- Quote from: james_s on January 11, 2021, 01:36:28 am ---There is no conspiracy involved in the 750-1000 hour lifespan, there is simply a tradeoff between lifespan and efficiency and 750 hours is a reasonable compromise that offers reasonable (by incandescent standards) efficiency at an acceptable lifespan. On one end of the spectrum are long life bulbs, you used to be able to get 130V bulbs that would last substantially longer on 120V but they were also quite dim for the wattage. On the other end of the spectrum are photoflood bulbs, I have a few of those and they have a rated life of 6(!) hours but they are very bright and produce a lot of light for the power they consume, again by incandescent standards. If you ignore the cost of your time to acquire and replace bulbs, the optimal lifespan for incandescent is probably around 100 hours or so. Longer life bulbs cost you more in electricity and shorter life bulbs cost you more in bulbs. In the real world the value of the time, effort and convenience shifts things toward longer life.

--- End quote ---
Normally, I’m the first person to interject that planned obsolescence is practically entirely a myth. But in the case of light bulbs, we have a documented, official case of colluded planned obsolescence: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoebus_cartel

Before it, light bulbs lasted 2500 hours typically. The Phoebus cartel’s members all agreed to reduce the lifespan to just 1000 hours.
tom66:
There have been a few cases of planned obsolescence over the years.  However, I think the key issue is that people don't generally re-purchase products from suppliers who produce unreliable goods.  Quality is seen as one of the more important factors that consumers consider when purchasing a product, and while price is also a critical factor, that creates a balancing act for manufacturers.

For instance, while I am sure car manufacturers have considered making unreliable cars to sell more cars,  they ultimately spend an enormous amount of money making their vehicles last for a long period of time,  because it is bad customer image if their product only lasts 7 years. 
tooki:

--- Quote from: tom66 on January 11, 2021, 05:15:37 pm ---There have been a few cases of planned obsolescence over the years.  However, I think the key issue is that people don't generally re-purchase products from suppliers who produce unreliable goods.  Quality is seen as one of the more important factors that consumers consider when purchasing a product, and while price is also a critical factor, that creates a balancing act for manufacturers.

--- End quote ---
Precisely. That's why I think 99.99% of the claimed "planned obsolescence" actually isn't: what customer is going to buy from you again, if your product failed so quickly? (The entire premise of planned obsolescence is forcing the consumer to buy from you over and over again, but they won't if your product sucks.)

Hence why when it really is planned obsolescence, it requires a cartel behind it to make sure nobody makes any product that is noticeably better.
james_s:

--- Quote from: tooki on January 11, 2021, 12:38:10 pm ---Normally, I’m the first person to interject that planned obsolescence is practically entirely a myth. But in the case of light bulbs, we have a documented, official case of colluded planned obsolescence: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoebus_cartel

Before it, light bulbs lasted 2500 hours typically. The Phoebus cartel’s members all agreed to reduce the lifespan to just 1000 hours.

--- End quote ---

Dissolved in 1939, so not really relevant to most of us here. Planned obsolescence is not a complete myth, there have been cases of it, but it is not the reason light bulbs in the tungsten filament era last the length of time they do. There is a very predictable relationship between voltage, filament temperature, lifespan and efficiency. The hotter you run the filament, the more efficient the lamp and the shorter it lasts. Reducing the voltage even a modest amount results in a dramatic increase in lifespan with an equally dramatic reduction in efficiency as the spectrum is shifted toward IR.

There was one more modern case I'm aware of where bulbs were lasting too long and were later changed to reduce this. GE with their Bonus Line and Westinghouse with their Lifeguard series of mercury vapor lamps developed an electrode formulation that resulted in white deposits in the arc tube instead of the typical light absorbing black deposits. These were very good quality lamps in general, made during the peak of mercury vapor lighting and it was found that instead of lasting a few years they were lasting decades, there are a few documented cases of these lamps lasting well over 100,000 hours. My grandparents had a barn light with a GE Bonus Line lamp in it that my grandpa put up in the late 70s and it was still running dusk till dawn on the original lamp as of a few years ago when the house was sold after my grandmother passed away. By the 1980s both manufactures had gone back to electrode formulations that caused the arc tubes to blacken, although that was also around the time when high pressure sodium was really being pushed and mercury took a back seat so this may have been about cost reduction more than deliberately reducing lamp life, I don't know.
Navigation
Message Index
Next page
Previous page
There was an error while thanking
Thanking...

Go to full version
Powered by SMFPacks Advanced Attachments Uploader Mod