Author Topic: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)  (Read 9420 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline james_s

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 21611
  • Country: us
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #50 on: January 12, 2021, 05:04:26 am »
You forgot about flashbulbs, which have a rated life of a few milliseconds.  :-DD

Those could arguably be classified as pyrotechnics more so than light bulbs. The light comes from burning magnesium in a pure oxygen environment, not an incandescent glow from a hot filament.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2021, 07:33:19 pm by james_s »
 
The following users thanked this post: tooki

Offline tom66

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 7334
  • Country: gb
  • Electronics Hobbyist & FPGA/Embedded Systems EE
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #51 on: January 12, 2021, 08:49:16 am »
I got suckered when I bought a "Wertheim" vacuum cleaner, a so-called "top of the line" model which was purported to be "German designed".(After all, it had a nice "pretend" German name,)

All I can say is the designers had never seen the inside of an Engineering classroom.
More likely drawn on the back of a placemat at the local boozer!

Needless to say, it was bloody useless, never operating for more than10 minutes before overheating, the hose continually blocking because the dumbos ran the wiring for the "power head" loose though it.
(Our little 15 year old Toshiba had wires running in the hose, too, but they were embedded in the wall.)

The Wertheim was chucked into the shed, & the poor, old, long suffering Toshiba put back into service.
After a few attempts to fix the POS, it went to the verge rubbish pickup.

After some years, the venerable Toshiba finally failed, & was replaced by a $A50 "Ozito"canister vacuum cleaner, which has worked admirably for several years.

I recently got rid of our absolutely junk Zanussi vacuum cleaner - my mother had an old one that lasted 30+ years and I made the mistake and 'impulse bought' a cheap Zanussi for my new flat.  What a piece of junk!  The motor eventually died on it after about a year and a half, probably the brushes,  but the construction made it near-impossible to easily access the motor without essentially destroying the appliance. 

To replace it we bought a Miele,  it was about 3x as expensive as the Zanussi and had a lower power rating.  It:
- cleans better
- runs quieter
- doesn't produce as much dust out the back as it seems to suck up
- so far doesn't smell of burnt brushes

Most of my home is now full of appliances from manufacturers I have trust in because I have repaired similar devices in my travels.    I do not get bitten twice. 
 
The following users thanked this post: tooki

Offline GlennSprigg

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1259
  • Country: au
  • Medically retired Tech. Old School / re-learning !
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #52 on: January 12, 2021, 01:55:36 pm »
Do parts of Australia still use the differently phased power grid?

I think it used the ground as the return?

Sorry if it's a bit old here mate, but that's an good & understandable question!  :-+
Here in Australia, we transmit power at many varying voltages, depending on the distance. Ranging from 275-kv,
right down to typically 11-kv into the Suburbs.  All this is via 3-Phase Delta. Usually, the final legs in our typical
streets is 11-kv (Delta) to 415v (Star connections), and so producing a virtual 'neutral' at the star-point. The result
of this is to create 240v from each phase to the star-point, being the common 'Neutral'. You will find in the typical street,
that every 3rd or 4th house is connected to varying phases, including the common star-point. Even though this is so, our
switchboards have a main earth, as well as a link from the main earth bar to the neutral bar. We call this a M.E.N. link,
which means Mains-Earth-Neutral.  Now partially answering your question....

In some typically remote Country/Farm locations, there is a system known as S.W.E.R., which stands for 'Single Wire
Earth Return'. For that, there is a typically 9.6kv single wire transmission through the majority of the transmission, where
at the farms etc, has a 9.6kv to 415v/240v transformer, where the 'HV' uses Earth as the return! (Reduced cabling!)  :phew:

Interesting addendum....
Different countries use different HV transmission voltages. This is mainly due to to countries local cost for copper/aluminium
as opposed to cost of towers/insulators etc!! Although the higher 'HV' seems better, the local cost is a different story!!
« Last Edit: January 12, 2021, 02:01:39 pm by GlennSprigg »
Diagonal of 1x1 square = Root-2. Ok.
Diagonal of 1x1x1 cube = Root-3 !!!  Beautiful !!
 
The following users thanked this post: cdev

Offline Sal Ammoniac

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1764
  • Country: us
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #53 on: January 12, 2021, 05:46:07 pm »
You forgot about flashbulbs, which have a rated life of a few milliseconds.  :-DD

Those could arguably be classified as pyrotechnics more so than light bulbs. The light comes from burning magnesium in a pure oxygen environment, not an incandescent glow form a hot filament.

True, but they're still a "bulb" intended to produce light. We still call CFLs and LEDs bulbs despite their not being based on an incandescent glow from a hot filament.
"That's not even wrong" -- Wolfgang Pauli
 

Offline james_s

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 21611
  • Country: us
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #54 on: January 13, 2021, 12:29:38 am »
True, but they're still a "bulb" intended to produce light. We still call CFLs and LEDs bulbs despite their not being based on an incandescent glow from a hot filament.

Well, yes, but context. In my post I was specifically discussing incandescent lamps. I left out a wide range of other electric light sources with longer and shorter lifespans, higher and lower efficiencies and other characteristics.
 

Offline tooki

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 13156
  • Country: ch
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #55 on: January 13, 2021, 04:04:23 pm »
To replace it we bought a Miele,  it was about 3x as expensive as the Zanussi and had a lower power rating.  It:
- cleans better
- runs quieter
- doesn't produce as much dust out the back as it seems to suck up
- so far doesn't smell of burnt brushes

Most of my home is now full of appliances from manufacturers I have trust in because I have repaired similar devices in my travels.    I do not get bitten twice.
I wish I had a justification to buy a Miele vacuum, but my Siemens one is still going strong and I still have a bunch of bags for it... :p
 

Offline james_s

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 21611
  • Country: us
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #56 on: January 16, 2021, 07:36:53 pm »
My aunt has a Miele that she has been happy with, it cost a fortune when she bought it though, it's one of those "exotic" European brands in the US. We have a Dyson upright that my partner bought on sale back before I met her, it's actually quite good, it's the only bagless vacuum I've used that worked worth a crap, most of them need to have the bin constantly emptied and fiddled with, this one you can run until it's filled up to the line and it keeps right on sucking.
 

Offline sibeen

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 271
  • Country: au
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #57 on: January 17, 2021, 01:26:44 am »


We call this a M.E.N. link,
which means Mains-Earth-Neutral.  Now partially answering your question....



Just a quick correction, MEN = Multiple Earth Neutral.

Every house has one so there is multiple earth neutral connections on the output of each transformer.
 
The following users thanked this post: GlennSprigg

Offline james_s

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 21611
  • Country: us
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #58 on: January 17, 2021, 05:34:57 am »
What is a multiple earth neutral? That's not a term I'm familiar with, if we have it we probably call it something else here.
 

Offline VK3DRB

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2272
  • Country: au
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #59 on: January 17, 2021, 10:06:31 am »
Is it? I thought the standard was 240V?

It has been 230V for almost 2 decades. And AM radio stations are allocated 9kHz apart, not 10kHz ;).

Thinking our mains is 240V is still common for some reason. But around 1995 I worked with an "engineer" at IBM who actually thought our mains voltage was 110V 60Hz. He plugged in a special 110V monitor imported from the US into our mains and wondered why it blew up. He said he had a degree in Electronic Engineering from RMIT. I suspect his degree was fake. It turned out his technical skills were quite low, and other engineers and technicians often did his work for him. His incompetence produced a number of serious electrical hazards. Despite being a nice bloke, he was fired within a year of joining the company.
 

Offline sibeen

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 271
  • Country: au
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #60 on: January 17, 2021, 10:20:08 am »
What is a multiple earth neutral? That's not a term I'm familiar with, if we have it we probably call it something else here.

At the entrance to each house or building, at the sites incoming switchboard a connection is intentionally made between the Earth and the Neutral. In a suburban setting a pole transformer feeds multiple households and at each of these the Earth - Neutral bond is made, so for each transformer there are multiple earth to neutral connections made.

Even if a large building has a dedicated transformer where only one earth to neutral connection is made we still call it the M.E.N link
« Last Edit: January 17, 2021, 10:26:11 am by sibeen »
 
The following users thanked this post: GlennSprigg

Offline sibeen

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 271
  • Country: au
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #61 on: January 17, 2021, 10:21:28 am »
Is it? I thought the standard was 240V?

It has been 230V for almost 2 decades. And AM radio stations are allocated 9kHz apart, not 10kHz ;).

Thinking our mains is 240V is still common for some reason.

It is common for the very good reason that generally the voltage is 240 volts or quite close to it. The standard changed but the voltage didn't.
 

Offline BradC

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2129
  • Country: au
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #62 on: January 17, 2021, 10:34:15 am »
It has been 230V for almost 2 decades.

Maybe for a VK3, but for a VK6 it has been 240 for decades, down from 250.

Thankfully we are still relatively isolated over here.
 

Offline GlennSprigg

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1259
  • Country: au
  • Medically retired Tech. Old School / re-learning !
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #63 on: January 17, 2021, 12:06:18 pm »


We call this a M.E.N. link,
which means Mains-Earth-Neutral.  Now partially answering your question....



Just a quick correction, MEN = Multiple Earth Neutral.

Every house has one so there is multiple earth neutral connections on the output of each transformer.

Oops!!  You are right of course!!   :phew:  I must have had a Brain-Fart writing 'Mains' hahaha...
Diagonal of 1x1 square = Root-2. Ok.
Diagonal of 1x1x1 cube = Root-3 !!!  Beautiful !!
 

Offline GlennSprigg

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1259
  • Country: au
  • Medically retired Tech. Old School / re-learning !
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #64 on: January 17, 2021, 12:23:10 pm »
Is it? I thought the standard was 240V?

It has been 230V for almost 2 decades. And AM radio stations are allocated 9kHz apart, not 10kHz ;).

Thinking our mains is 240V is still common for some reason.

It is common for the very good reason that generally the voltage is 240 volts or quite close to it. The standard changed but the voltage didn't.

Yea, the AM stations 10-khz separation is not used here in Australia.  We use 9-khz separation.
That's actually quite handy here, as multiples of 9 have an interesting outcome whereby all the digits add up to 9.
As such, you know you are on station with a digital tuner!  For example....
1323-AM.  1 + 3 + 2 + 3  = 9  Ok.
954-AM.    9 + 5 + 4  = 18.  1 + 8  = 9  Ok.    8)
All half decent receivers here have a selectable 9 or 10 khz sep setting/switch.
Diagonal of 1x1 square = Root-2. Ok.
Diagonal of 1x1x1 cube = Root-3 !!!  Beautiful !!
 

Offline james_s

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 21611
  • Country: us
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #65 on: January 17, 2021, 07:25:16 pm »
Manufacturers have a perfect "out", especially with household items-------- they simply reduce the quality of the "prestige" brands, so that they are just as bad as the "El Cheapo" option.

It's less insidious than that. They acquire the "prestige brand" and then cost reduce the products, reducing the quality in the process but the goal is only to reduce the cost. Then they ride it out, extracting as much profit from the brand as possible until the reputation runs out. Wash, rinse, repeat. It's like mining fossil fuels, it took many years for those brands to build up their potential and then companies come along and gobble them up and wring everything they can out of it before throwing away the carcass.
 

Offline SilverSolder

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 6126
  • Country: 00
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #66 on: January 17, 2021, 08:37:54 pm »

Will we eventually run out of "good brands"?

 

Offline james_s

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 21611
  • Country: us
Re: Fix the voltage campaign (Australia)
« Reply #67 on: January 18, 2021, 04:55:29 am »

Will we eventually run out of "good brands"?

As others turn to junk there is more room for a new company to sprout up building good quality gear, build up a reputation and then eventually get bought out by one of these companies that goes around buying up companies and extracting everything they can from them and the cycle continues.
 


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf