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| Full-self-driving needs external infrastructure |
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| AndyC_772:
I'd quite like one for occasions when I'm not able to drive myself - like, for example, home from a night involving beer. Perhaps when I'm older, and no longer as physically fit as I am today, it'll be useful too. I've no interest at all in one that I might be expected to take over and drive if the computer sees something it can't cope with, though. The entire use case for a self driving car revolves around the fact that there are times when I can't drive it, or, by extension, take responsibility for it. |
| CatalinaWOW:
There is an interesting correlation I have noticed. In various threads on this forum many users have expressed their opinions about standard transmissions vs automatic transmissions. To a large degree those that favor standard transmissions and the driving experience are the ones denigrating FSD technology, and projecting their views of the market onto the entire market. The penetration of automatic transmissions into the US marketplace is an indicator that there is a flaw in this perception. More on topic, I definitely agree that the task of FSD could be greatly simplified with external infrastructure. The version of FSD envisioned by GM in the 1950s (implemented only on limited access freeways with guide wires in each lane, and no human driven cars allowed) could easily be implemented today. Whether it is impossible without external infrastructure seems to me to be an open question, and one that has both technical and social content. The required performance of an FSD vehicle is largely a social issue, as indicated by all the discussion of liability and whether FSD has to be merely better than the drunks and otherwise incapacitated drivers that inhabit our roads, better than the average driver, or substantially better than the very best drivers. In my circle of acquaintances opinions on this subject vary widely, and with a noticeable trend in acceptance of FSD among the younger members of that group. Which indicates that even if the answer were sorted out today, there is real potential for change over time. That difference in acceptance is likely regional also, as indicated by the widely different acceptance of automatic transmissions in different parts of the world. This social acceptance thing has other parameters. The Teslas driving into the backs of vehicles gets lots of attention, and it is often stated that it is something a human driver would never do. But a close personal friends wife did just that, and a few minutes searching on YouTube will surface many other cases people driving into the backs of construction vehicles, service vehicles and police cars making traffic stops. While it is obvious that a fully attentive, cautious and capable person wouldn't do these things, no one is constantly fully attentive. Our perceptions of what people do are often not data driven. |
| james_s:
--- Quote from: CatalinaWOW on March 07, 2023, 06:40:11 pm ---There is an interesting correlation I have noticed. In various threads on this forum many users have expressed their opinions about standard transmissions vs automatic transmissions. To a large degree those that favor standard transmissions and the driving experience are the ones denigrating FSD technology, and projecting their views of the market onto the entire market. The penetration of automatic transmissions into the US marketplace is an indicator that there is a flaw in this perception. --- End quote --- I *hate* automatic transmissions, I think manual transmission proficiency should be required to get a driver's license, then if you really want an automatic you can get one. Manual transmissions make better drivers that are more engaged and more attentive, less likely to be multitasking. With a manual it is impossible to mistake the gas for the brake and smash through a building. You can't coast along in la-la land with a phone in one hand and a coffee in the other steering with your knee, you're actively using both hands and both feet. The problem we have now is that so many people have never had the opportunity to drive a manual that few ask for one and few cars are made with one, which results in even fewer people experiencing one. Many people don't even know somebody that has one that could teach them. My number one requirement for a ICE powered car is manual transmission, if it doesn't have that I'm not interested, won't even consider it. It is probably the same characteristic that makes me not want self driving. When it comes to machinery I am a control freak, I want complete control over the machine, period, this is not negotiable. I absolutely loathe technology that tries to be helpful and guess what I want because more often than not it is wrong and I find myself fighting with the tech. A human driver that slams into the back of a lit up emergency vehicle should lose their license on the spot and be charged with negligent driving, that is inexcusible. |
| CatalinaWOW:
--- Quote from: james_s on March 07, 2023, 06:50:46 pm --- --- Quote from: CatalinaWOW on March 07, 2023, 06:40:11 pm ---There is an interesting correlation I have noticed. In various threads on this forum many users have expressed their opinions about standard transmissions vs automatic transmissions. To a large degree those that favor standard transmissions and the driving experience are the ones denigrating FSD technology, and projecting their views of the market onto the entire market. The penetration of automatic transmissions into the US marketplace is an indicator that there is a flaw in this perception. --- End quote --- I *hate* automatic transmissions, I think manual transmission proficiency should be required to get a driver's license, then if you really want an automatic you can get one. Manual transmissions make better drivers that are more engaged and more attentive, less likely to be multitasking. With a manual it is impossible to mistake the gas for the brake and smash through a building. You can't coast along in la-la land with a phone in one hand and a coffee in the other steering with your knee, you're actively using both hands and both feet. The problem we have now is that so many people have never had the opportunity to drive a manual that few ask for one and few cars are made with one, which results in even fewer people experiencing one. Many people don't even know somebody that has one that could teach them. My number one requirement for a ICE powered car is manual transmission, if it doesn't have that I'm not interested, won't even consider it. It is probably the same characteristic that makes me not want self driving. When it comes to machinery I am a control freak, I want complete control over the machine, period, this is not negotiable. I absolutely loathe technology that tries to be helpful and guess what I want because more often than not it is wrong and I find myself fighting with the tech. A human driver that slams into the back of a lit up emergency vehicle should lose their license on the spot and be charged with negligent driving, that is inexcusible. --- End quote --- QED |
| james_s:
I mean this is hardly surprising is it? It should be obvious that a person that dislikes having the car shift for them is going to dislike having the car drive for them even more. At least I would think that's obvious. For some people a car is nothing more than a transportation appliance, Americans in particular are lazy and just want to get where they're going, other people like to drive. Another symptom of this is that the vast majority of cars are incredibly boring and nondescript, the market seems to have settled on the generic CUV design, virtually everyone is making them and they all have comically enormous grills and emblems because that's about the only thing that differentiates the brands. |
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