General > General Technical Chat
Full-self-driving needs external infrastructure
EEVblog:
--- Quote from: tom66 on March 08, 2023, 11:34:17 pm ---Even then many of these have at least automated manual transmissions as an option. For instance, even Smart cars now have dual clutch automatic transmissions though you can still get a manual if you ask.
Besides, on my automatic car there exists a manual mode and it behaves much like a manual car. It will even let you hit an electronically limited red line and won't shift up unless you sit at that red line for more than 10 seconds or so (probably just component protection at that point!) About the only thing it won't let you do is destroy your engine/gearbox by shifting into the wrong gear, but I'm not sure anyone wanted that feature to stay :).
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My ICE car has a CVT and "manual" drive mode. You shift the stick over and then use it like a manual but shifting back and forth to go up and down the "gears".
james_s:
--- Quote from: tom66 on March 08, 2023, 11:34:17 pm ---Besides, on my automatic car there exists a manual mode and it behaves much like a manual car. It will even let you hit an electronically limited red line and won't shift up unless you sit at that red line for more than 10 seconds or so (probably just component protection at that point!) About the only thing it won't let you do is destroy your engine/gearbox by shifting into the wrong gear, but I'm not sure anyone wanted that feature to stay :).
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A manually shifted automatic is pointless. You have all the mechanical and hydraulic complexity and weight of a slushbox and no clutch pedal so you lose that aspect of control which is hugely beneficial in snow and ice. It's kind of the worst of both worlds, may as well just have an automatic at that point. You'd have to try pretty hard to shift into the wrong gear and destroy something, if you try to for example shift a manual gearbox into 2nd gear at highway speed it won't go in, unless maybe you force the lever really hard and get the synchro to spool up the input shaft. These manual modes are toys for people that want the video game experience, it is totally different than driving a real manual, it's not even close.
james_s:
--- Quote from: EEVblog on March 08, 2023, 10:27:12 pm ---You are projecting your desires onto others, that doesn't work.
Some (most?) people just want to get from A-B
And who says I can't enjoy driving an automatic as much or even more than you enjoy driving your manual. Just because you like having one hand on the stick and manually controlling it, others might like other aspects of driving like hanging one arm out the window hand surfing just relaxing cruising along regardless of the conditions. I LOVE driving my EV, it's smooth, it's quiet, and I don't have to constantly dick around with a stick in traffic. Do you really enjoy your manual stick in heavy traffic, really? Why?
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I'm not projecting anything. I'm simply saying that if everyone had the opportunity to drive a manual, a much larger percentage of people would realize that it's fun and choose one. When nobody gets exposure, many fewer are interested in jumping through the hoops. It's similar to the reason we should still have shop class in high school, you give people a taste of these things and they find out they like it. Those that don't, fine, that's why automatics are available, go ahead and make that choice, but I think everyone should try a manual too.
Driving in heavy traffic is a miserable experience no matter what you have. I hardly ever do it, on the rare occasions I go into the office I take the bus. When I drive it's to go visit a friend or family member, run errands, head out on a camping trip or just go for a drive, I enjoy cruising along a twisty mountain road on a nice day, the fewer other cars around the better. Driving is fun and relaxing, I've always enjoyed it.
pcprogrammer:
--- Quote from: james_s on March 09, 2023, 07:54:48 am ---You'd have to try pretty hard to shift into the wrong gear and destroy something, if you try to for example shift a manual gearbox into 2nd gear at highway speed it won't go in, unless maybe you force the lever really hard and get the synchro to spool up the input shaft.
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Unless your gearbox has a lot of wear. >:D
I had that long long back with an Opel Kadett, I wanted to shift up, but got the reverse. :-DD Was easy to fix. Got a second hand gearbox from a scrapyard and replaced it myself.
james_s:
--- Quote from: pcprogrammer on March 09, 2023, 08:02:27 am ---Unless your gearbox has a lot of wear. >:D
I had that long long back with an Opel Kadett, I wanted to shift up, but got the reverse. :-DD Was easy to fix. Got a second hand gearbox from a scrapyard and replaced it myself.
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Most of the cars I've spent a significant amount of time driving have been Volvo and Saab. For many years Volvo has a collar you have to pull up in order to shift into reverse and I forget what the Saab had (it's been almost 20 years) but there was some kind of interlock, I have never managed to shift into reverse accidentally but I suppose anything is possible. Reverse on the cars I can think of is way over in the upper-left, so nowhere near any of the gears I'd be using at speed. I know there are some other shift patterns out there though.
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