General > General Technical Chat

"Gas Armageddon": Energy/electricity prices in EU/UK (and how to deal with them)

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wraper:

--- Quote from: tom66 on September 06, 2022, 09:38:32 am ---
--- Quote from: SiliconWizard on September 05, 2022, 08:35:38 pm ---Maybe that should have been pondered earlier?

--- End quote ---

Possibly - but it also shows how desperate Russia is.  What else can they do now?  Europe knows the gas isn't coming back, so they should pile even more into Ukraine and hope that the winter is warm.  Meanwhile, production from Norway/UK/Netherlands is up, some older nuke plants are coming back online or won't be shut off soon, and more storage will open.  And Germany will have more LNG terminals.

--- End quote ---
Who's desperate? Russia is making way more money on energy sources than the last year. What you all should understand is Russian mentality. They will never submit because you f. them in the ass with sanctions. In 99% of cases they will rather do something in spite even if it hurts them even more. Not to say they have much higher pain threshold than Europeans. It's done not out desperation but so that Europe does not imagine it can feel warm and cozy while hurting Russia.

tom66:

--- Quote from: wraper on September 06, 2022, 11:03:14 am ---Who's desperate? Russia is making way more money on energy sources than the last year. What you all should understand is Russian mentality. They will never submit because you f. them in the ass with sanctions. In 99% of cases they will rather do something is spite even if it hurts them even more. Not to say they have much higher pain threshold than Europeans. It's done not out desperation but so that Europe does not imagine it feel warm and cozy while hurting Russia.

--- End quote ---

This may have been true when NS1 was running at 20%, as high price of gas meant that 20% * cost was still high.

But now it's at 0%.  Only flow into EU is via Ukraine and TurkStream and price is falling...

Meanwhile they are flaring off gas that they cannot sell, and cannot convert into LNG to sell to China et al.

nctnico:

--- Quote from: tom66 on September 06, 2022, 11:09:21 am ---
--- Quote from: wraper on September 06, 2022, 11:03:14 am ---Who's desperate? Russia is making way more money on energy sources than the last year. What you all should understand is Russian mentality. They will never submit because you f. them in the ass with sanctions. In 99% of cases they will rather do something is spite even if it hurts them even more. Not to say they have much higher pain threshold than Europeans. It's done not out desperation but so that Europe does not imagine it feel warm and cozy while hurting Russia.

--- End quote ---

This may have been true when NS1 was running at 20%, as high price of gas meant that 20% * cost was still high.

But now it's at 0%.  Only flow into EU is via Ukraine and TurkStream and price is falling...

Meanwhile they are flaring off gas that they cannot sell, and cannot convert into LNG to sell to China et al.

--- End quote ---
Yup. It is not like Russia suddenly has extra capacity to export gas to China. They'd need to put extra pipes in place for which they need components from abroad...

Siwastaja:

--- Quote from: tom66 on September 06, 2022, 11:09:21 am ---This may have been true when NS1 was running at 20%, as high price of gas meant that 20% * cost was still high.
But now it's at 0%.  Only flow into EU is via Ukraine and TurkStream and price is falling...

--- End quote ---

They already made full year worth of profit (possibly much much more) by selling the product at increased price while production cost was the same.

It was a totally conscious political decision by Germany to monetize Russia's war machine by artificially doubling the gas price and deliberately continue buying it, and ask the puppets in Finland to monetize Germany's gas customers so that the increased price doesn't reflect into the bills, finally so that the average Germans don't need to know/feel what is going on. It seems the Finland's "Germany gas" bill is now at around 30 billion and increasing, which means around 20000 EUR bill for the average Finnish taxpayer. As a result, we are now done as a country, it seems irreversible now. (Some might remember me saying we can probably take one such debt "package" more and that's it, maybe a month or two ago. It came faster than anyone imagined.)

We can do nothing but to watch this farce, and of course re-design our lives from scratch, for example become more self-sufficient with food and energy, stop going to work (or at least stop getting paid for it), and so on. And of course, with no public healthcare anymore, and with no money to buy private services, better not fall sick. Full blown survivalist shit we all laughed at just a few years ago.

We live in a total clown world.

wraper:

--- Quote from: tom66 on September 06, 2022, 11:09:21 am ---Meanwhile they are flaring off gas that they cannot sell, and cannot convert into LNG to sell to China et al.

--- End quote ---
EU cannot get LNG out of nowhere either. It's all about who gives up first. And I'm pretty sure it won't be Russia.

--- Quote from: nctnico on September 06, 2022, 11:27:28 am ---Yup. It is not like Russia suddenly has extra capacity to export gas to China. They'd need to put extra pipes in place for which they need components from abroad...

--- End quote ---
They'd build a new pipeline rather than submit IMHO.

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