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"Gas Armageddon": Energy/electricity prices in EU/UK (and how to deal with them)

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Someone:

--- Quote from: BravoV on September 17, 2022, 04:47:20 am ---
--- Quote from: Someone on September 17, 2022, 04:41:48 am ---
--- Quote from: NiHaoMike on September 17, 2022, 02:01:09 am ---Perhaps a simple solution would be to lower energy rates for households that get limiters installed on their heating systems?

--- End quote ---
Similar things already exist, but the unwashed masses turn it around and make out like its unfair (the poster above this being an example). Already came up in this thread... with the same poster adding misleading drama around it:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/gas-armageddon-energyelectricity-prices-in-euuk-(and-how-to-deal-with-them)/msg4396097/#msg4396097

Water is considered an essential resource for residents, but its supply pricing is treated quite differently to the "equally" essential electricity/gas/heating. Here in Australia the first essential 400-500 litres per day (averaged over the billing period) is charged at a lower rate, then usage beyond that is at a higher rate (often much much higher). Gas and electricity? the reverse! most (all?) tiered plans make the unit cost cheaper the more you use.

--- End quote ---

Read here in Swiss -> https://switzerlandtimes.ch/politics/heat-sinners-face-jail/

--- End quote ---
That's the extreme end of mandating population wide limits, a blunt instrument as individuals weren't incentivised to make the change for their own benefit. Introducing or requiring variable pricing could avoid the need for such harsh measures. But you'll just argue that any change to reduce peoples energy use is an affront to their freedoms.

The days of cheap/infinite energy on demand are no longer here and may never come back. There needs to be some change, be that free market (the rich can pay and the poor freeze), or totalitarian (everyone must set their thermostat to exactly this number). Somewhere in-between is going to be more palatable for most.

Suggesting that there is a non-linear pricing where people get a subsidised essential/basic/livable daily budget at an affordable price, and then tax/milk those who want more doesn't sound silly. Much better than subsidising (or worse capping) everyones bills indiscriminately.

Which is why this is so political, helping out those who need it? socialism communism! communism bad! rah rah rah. Distracting from the actual economic disaster that is pending. Which your inflammatory posts are just perpetuating.

Siwastaja:

--- Quote from: Someone on September 17, 2022, 04:41:48 am ---Gas and electricity? the reverse! most (all?) tiered plans make the unit cost cheaper the more you use.

--- End quote ---

Same here, the government is planning a subsidy program where electricity costs exceeding a certain threshold can apply for 60% tax deduction, and this threshold is pretty high. It's a subsidy for those who are wasting a lot of energy, who bought excessively large house with direct electric heating, and always failed to retrofit any heatpumps although they have been highly popular here for 15 years now, or do anything about their energy use, really.

The poorest get no help, again.

tszaboo:

--- Quote from: BravoV on September 17, 2022, 04:47:20 am ---
--- Quote from: Someone on September 17, 2022, 04:41:48 am ---
--- Quote from: NiHaoMike on September 17, 2022, 02:01:09 am ---Perhaps a simple solution would be to lower energy rates for households that get limiters installed on their heating systems?

--- End quote ---
Similar things already exist, but the unwashed masses turn it around and make out like its unfair (the poster above this being an example). Already came up in this thread... with the same poster adding misleading drama around it:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/gas-armageddon-energyelectricity-prices-in-euuk-(and-how-to-deal-with-them)/msg4396097/#msg4396097

Water is considered an essential resource for residents, but its supply pricing is treated quite differently to the "equally" essential electricity/gas/heating. Here in Australia the first essential 400-500 litres per day (averaged over the billing period) is charged at a lower rate, then usage beyond that is at a higher rate (often much much higher). Gas and electricity? the reverse! most (all?) tiered plans make the unit cost cheaper the more you use.

--- End quote ---

Read here in Swiss -> https://switzerlandtimes.ch/politics/heat-sinners-face-jail/

--- End quote ---
Fake news.
https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics/fact-check--will-the-swiss-be-jailed-for-heating-their-homes-above-19-c-/47894052

Faringdon:

--- Quote ---Putin isn't going to go nuclear, because his advisors would not let him.
--- End quote ---
Putin will go nuclear when we go nuclear on him.
We have no choice but to go absolute full nuclear on Putin if he doesnt get Russia totally out of all Ukraine.
..As per my threads #542 and #619 above.

tautech:

--- Quote from: Faringdon on September 17, 2022, 09:50:03 am ---
--- Quote ---Putin isn't going to go nuclear, because his advisors would not let him.
--- End quote ---
Putin will go nuclear when we go nuclear on him.
We have no choice but to go absolute full nuclear on Putin if he doesnt get Russia totally out of all Ukraine.
..As per my threads #542 and #619 above.

--- End quote ---
It might seem you can't see the wood for the Treez.

The sacrifice is far too great with nukes whereas if the EU was to grow some gonads and make a far lesser sacrifice as it should've months ago and all stand shoulder to shoulder against the aggressor, the most dangerous leader in a century, this would be have been all over by now with a very clear line in the sand and a strong message not to cross it !
But, if we continue to be run by children the current state of affairs will continue for some while yet.

When there are zero ppls left in Ukraine to defend their nation is the EU to watch it be taken by default ?

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