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Giving interviews, disappointing, am I getting old?

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jeremy:

--- Quote from: paulca on October 20, 2021, 06:58:16 pm ---It's why I am creating a set of code tests, one of which includes this:

Write a program to generate all combinations of a shuffled deck of cards.

The right answer IS "No".  The "better" answer is realising its impossible and explaining why.

--- End quote ---

I think this is the wrong move. I don’t think most people go into interviews expecting an adversarial process. Not everyone has the confidence to second guess the interviewer.

Also, your problem is ill-defined, as-is I don’t see why it is impossible. There is even a built-in python function which does it all for you (iteratively, so you don’t run out of memory): https://docs.python.org/3/library/itertools.html#itertools.combinations

tggzzz:

--- Quote from: SiliconWizard on October 20, 2021, 07:21:12 pm ---
--- Quote from: paulca on October 20, 2021, 10:53:33 am ---They seem to want to push towards minimising code by increasing architectural complexity, dependencies and overheads.  Stacking frameworks on top of frameworks for fear of having to write a few hundred lines of code.  Of course few of them understand those things beyond having followed a few tutorials and worked in a project that used it a few times.

--- End quote ---

That's been the trend for years. I'd say even for a good couple decades now... with it getting worse in the last 10 years or so.

--- End quote ---

I don't mind people using frameworks (and often it is preferable to re-invention of an elliptical wheel), but I do want them to understand what a framework cannot do. Too often people use frameworks and think they no longer need to think about failure modes, because the framework deals with it. It is remarkable how many frameworks have solved distributed ACID transactions, the byzantine generals problem, the split-brain problem, and have managed to ensure there is a single global unique time.

For wry amusement, consider the layering of asynchronous protocols on top of synchronous protocols, and vice versa.

Slh:
Interviewing for hardware folks feels similar to be honest. A worrying number of"senior" engineers appear to have forgotten the fundamentals and even people who do know some of it don't listen to the question that they're being asked (it does get repeated if they appear not to have understood ...).

My main technical competence question is supposed to get the candidates to show that they know the fundamentals (some equations, some knowledge of how to apply them etc) even if they don't get the answer or need some prompting. When they get to the answer it's also a really useful result that's worth knowing. One "principal" engineer tried to tell me that the current when charging a capacitor is constant for 2 tau (and reduced thereafter) and that power was the same as energy... He seemed annoyed by my attempts to push him in the right direction so I guess the question did a good job showing technical level and attitude...

Asking them to describe a project they've worked on is usually good as well (and having usually beaten them up on the fundamentals it gives them some nice home ground to work from). From that you can hopefully get an idea of what they've done, enthusiasm and what they're likely to be able to bring to the team.

Fgrir:

--- Quote from: jeremy on October 20, 2021, 09:19:27 pm ---
--- Quote from: paulca on October 20, 2021, 06:58:16 pm ---It's why I am creating a set of code tests, one of which includes this:

Write a program to generate all combinations of a shuffled deck of cards.

The right answer IS "No".  The "better" answer is realising its impossible and explaining why.

--- End quote ---

I think this is the wrong move. I don’t think most people go into interviews expecting an adversarial process. Not everyone has the confidence to second guess the interviewer.

Also, your problem is ill-defined, as-is I don’t see why it is impossible. There is even a built-in python function which does it all for you (iteratively, so you don’t run out of memory): https://docs.python.org/3/library/itertools.html#itertools.combinations

--- End quote ---
There is only one combination of a shuffled deck of cards and writing a program to generate it should be trivial.

Now permutations is another story, or combinations of a 5-card hand dealt from the deck...

Brumby:

--- Quote from: Fgrir on October 21, 2021, 09:40:00 pm ---There is only one combination of a shuffled deck of cards and writing a program to generate it should be trivial.

Now permutations is another story, or combinations of a 5-card hand dealt from the deck...

--- End quote ---

I would't respond like that.  You would risk being labelled a smart-arse.

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