Author Topic: Health issues due to soldering fumes.  (Read 1597 times)

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Offline james_s

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #25 on: April 05, 2020, 06:50:50 pm »
Interesting, well either way there are good reasons we got rid of the stuff. I just think many people tend to be overly paranoid about things. Asbestos is another example, it could be harmful in some situations and to some people however it was mostly occupational exposure that caused cancer. Miners and shipyard workers and such who were exposed to large amounts of asbestos, many of them also smokers. I recall reading that the health effects were far greater in people who both smoked and were exposed to asbestos than in those who only had one or the other. A lot of the regulations around asbestos and the removal of it were pushed by the asbestos removal industry itself which tends to make me a little suspicious. More recently a friend was telling me they're running out of asbestos to remove so the latest thing to worry about is formaldehyde in fiberglass insulation. Nothing compares to radiation when it comes to causing irrational fear though, they stopped making the good thorium oxide based lamp mantles because they are slightly radioactive even though the dose from normal use is extremely small. People worry about granite counters due to them being very, very slightly radioactive, or the tiny dose form a dental xray not even realizing that natural radiation is everywhere.
 

Offline jogri

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #26 on: April 05, 2020, 07:15:43 pm »
As long as you don't break an asbestos sheet it is perfectly safe to handle... I just don't get the "we have to get rid of it NOW" movement, it isn't going to harm you if you don't screw around with it.

@james: Thorium oxide is currently having a comeback as a "negative ion source" in some chinese "healing" products... Funny given the fact that it actually emits He2+ ions^^^
 
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Offline Electro Detective

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #27 on: April 05, 2020, 10:17:30 pm »
Next time try soldering with protective eyeware , thin gloves

and wear one of those cheap face masks that are USELESS for the Corona virass, yet good enough for direct solder fumes in your face

Please don't do that, soldering while wearing rubber gloves is a good way to get yourself into the emergency room...
A burn might hurt for a while, but having molten plastic inside a wound is a totally different story.
Btw, at a guess i'd say that the normal face mask won't do anything against the fumes: We are dealing with gases, those particles are way too small to get blocked by the mask. You would need a mask that has a layer of activated carbon, and those masks are long gone.



Good points  :-+

I have revised that comment to allow for any lack of common sense

"Next time try soldering with protective eyeware , thin LEATHER or fire resist gloves"
FYI >  test  ~burn~ the gloves BEFORE putting them on


and those cheap face masks will protect one from surprise direct fumes, giving the frugal operator time to back off or turn away = better than no mask and copping a face full of crap fumes

Anyway it's worked for ages for me, especially when too lazy to set up a cheap fan and aim it..     :-[    :palm:

YMMV/EMMV applies

« Last Edit: April 05, 2020, 10:23:07 pm by Electro Detective »
 

Offline james_s

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #28 on: April 05, 2020, 11:42:00 pm »
I picked up the wrong end of a firestick a few times when I was a kid but I haven't had that happen since getting a soldering station with a decent stand. Closest I've come is brushing my finger just briefly with the barrel of the iron, makes a sizzle sound but doesn't burn living tissue if it's just an instantaneous brush. I don't think gloves offer much benefit to soldering, just wash your hands well when you're done and don't eat finger food while doing it.
 

Offline tooki

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #29 on: April 06, 2020, 02:25:03 am »
The old corrosive fluxes were definitely bad for your lungs, and I used to wheeze a bit when doing a lot of soldering, but I was fine. These days, fluxes are pretty safe.
What are you talking about?!? Modern lead-free fluxes are far more aggressive to the lungs than old rosin flux was. Did you not read the thread before replying, where even a health and safety official in a company was able to be convinced that the modern fluxes are worse than the old ones?
 

Offline tooki

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #30 on: April 06, 2020, 02:28:13 am »
There seems to be big difference between brands too. Bought some small spool of Stannol solder and it makes me cough and feel ill immediately. Smoke it makes is just so terrible I can't use it at all. But my two decades old spool of Multicore solder, no such symptoms. Both are lead-free, so the difference is not in that. But anyway I use solderless breadboard usually.
Stannol and Multicore are the same company (Henkel). But they make many different fluxes, so even within lead-free, there are some that are rosin based, others organic chemical based, others synthetic resin...
 

Offline Electro Detective

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #31 on: April 06, 2020, 02:41:43 am »

The same rules that the welding industry never stops pumping into wannabee zappers should be the same in soldering

Avoid any and all fumes at any cost,
or consider a career change asap

i.e. when melting any metal to metal,
your are going to have a bad day breathing in crap that human lungs were not designed for from birth = DUH...   :o
 

Offline GlennSprigg

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #32 on: April 06, 2020, 01:21:47 pm »
I'm old now, so I'm sorry that I don't give a F$%# now!   :)
If I can't smell the solder/flux when doing my 'work' then it just doesn't seem real!  ;D
I've been 'Doing-It' & 'Smelling-It' for over 50 years now, and it has nothing to do with
my life limiting condition as we speak!!  (Except being informed about my Grammar !!  8))

I guess it's all to do with teaching an old dog new tricks. I'll leave that to the Future!  ;D
 
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Online SilverSolder

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #33 on: April 06, 2020, 02:45:22 pm »

If you are sensitive to the fumes, maybe arrange for a "proper" fume extractor, i.e. one with a hose that actually pumps the fumes outside the house.  It could easily be a DIY solution, with a hose going out through the window or something...

 

Offline james_s

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #34 on: April 06, 2020, 04:20:29 pm »
My partner is very sensitive to fumes, if I burn an oil lamp she complains bitterly about the smell of kerosene even when it isn't strong enough for me to smell it at all. I got a small fume extractor that sucks the air through an activated charcoal filter and that has been sufficient to stop the complaining about soldering smells.
 
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Offline Pinkus

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #35 on: April 06, 2020, 05:06:29 pm »
I would have a dermatologist check if there is an allergy to colophony. The flux contains colophony and an allergy to it is not uncommon.
I, for example, have such a rosin (colophony) allergy with various cross-allergies. Since I am sucking off the soldering fumes, I have no more problems.
I usually use a tiny suction nozzle mounted to the soldering iron (Weller WFE P) and for some other jobs a big suction device (Pace Arm Eva 250). The Weller suction nozzle can also be attached well to soldering irons of other manufacturers (in my case JBC T245). I would never ever work without it. It sucks off 99% of the fume immediately after it emergences. I'll try to submit a photo later.
 

Offline MT

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #36 on: April 06, 2020, 05:10:19 pm »
Hi all,

as a teenager I spent hours and hours in my bedroom putting veroboard projects together and tinkering around with devices as many of us did when we were younger. The trouble is that I was the eldest sibling, and neither of my parents had a clue as to what electronics involved, never-mind the health&safety aspects of my hobby (...which later went on to become my career).

With no mentor or guidance, I proceeded to do a lot of 60/40 soldering in a small room with no filter fan or air extraction unit. I at least had the common sense to crack the top window opening, and blow the fumes away while soldering, but I don't think these practices were enough. Now approaching 40, I can't do 30 seconds worth of soldering without getting a headache, and instantly becoming totally run down with tiredness. The combination of these two symptoms I suppose you could compare to 'brain-fog.' I am currently working in the opto-electronics industry where I can avoid soldering, but I am very eager to get back to my first love of electronic debug and repair. The stress of not doing a job that I like is slowly killing me, and I urgently need to change something.

So my question is regarding how I should proceed with getting on top of these health issues... Has anyone ever been tested for chronic heavy-metal poisoning, what's involved, and if it's treatable what are the options available? (Not sure what I'm going to do with the current restrictions regarding the coronavirus COVID-19 crisis, but now is the time for me to gather all the advice that I can.) Please, please share your experiences or stories. I'd appreciate any weblinks too that may help.

Thanks, Paul.
I suggest you try ASMR, meditation and other inwards looking/relaxing methods then to kill your self to an drug addiction
such as soldering. Try magic mushrooms, walk in the forests, bicycling, balooning, parapeting, rally car d riving, what have you! Get a cat!
« Last Edit: April 06, 2020, 05:12:44 pm by MT »
 

Offline paul8f

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #37 on: July 02, 2020, 06:15:24 pm »
Lead doesn't boil off at any reasonable temperature. The fume is mostly flux. Theoretically lead can get oxidized and the nano oxide particle gets carried by larger flux particles in the smoke, but that's highly unlikely since the flux is there to prevent oxidation and to reduce oxidized layer to promote wetting.

Apologies for taking so long to respond to any of the replies. That makes sense that it's the flux you need to be more concerned with. The multicore solder-wire I normally use has a rosin based no-clean flux.
 

Offline paul8f

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #38 on: July 02, 2020, 06:31:02 pm »
1. Test your eyesight:   ....I just got a 2nd opinion from a different optometrist, and sure enough my lens prescription was a little too strong. Not good when I can spend up to 2 hours a day driving. Thanks for the heads up!

2. Quit alcohol:  ....Haven't had alcohol in over a year and a half.

3. Amount of light: ....Already use a light a work, but my home set-up needs improvement.

4. Use a magnifier:  ....Check!

5. Quit coffee : ....Very rarely drink caffeine (maybe 2-3 cups of tea a month)

6. Try green tea : ....Green tea is supposed to have as much caffeine as black tea. I use herbal teas instead.

7. Avoid sugar:  ....I avoid it like the plague, and I read product ingredients like they're going out of fashion! I have a treat maybe once a month.
Thanks again.
 

Offline paul8f

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #39 on: July 02, 2020, 06:34:02 pm »
....wanted us to move over to unleaded solder (we're exempt from RoHS regulations)....

Just curious...., what sectors are exempt from RoHS?
 

Offline paul8f

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #40 on: July 02, 2020, 06:39:39 pm »
May sound obvious, but just use a decent fume extractor.

I open the window, and use a basic bench-top fume filter, but I've no way to direct the air outside. I'd really love a proper extraction system, but I can't afford one, and then there's the extra cost and hassle of boring holes in walls....
 

Offline paul8f

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #41 on: July 02, 2020, 06:46:18 pm »
You might want to get checked out for Asthama

I've heard it can be linked to asthma, but I think what might not be helping me is hay-fever, and possibly a mild food intolerance to something. Now just to figure out what that something is...!
 

Offline jogri

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #42 on: July 02, 2020, 07:05:13 pm »
....wanted us to move over to unleaded solder (we're exempt from RoHS regulations)....

Just curious...., what sectors are exempt from (the ban of leaded solder by) RoHS?

Primarily automotive but also telecommunications (partly)
 

Offline paul8f

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #43 on: July 02, 2020, 07:38:25 pm »
Primarily automotive but also telecommunications (partly)

Automotive... I'm guessing due to the wide temperature swings and vibrations?
Telecommunications... something to do with reliability too?
 

Offline Zero999

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #44 on: July 02, 2020, 08:39:14 pm »
Primarily automotive but also telecommunications (partly)

Automotive... I'm guessing due to the wide temperature swings and vibrations?
Telecommunications... something to do with reliability too?
Added aerospace to the list, or at least I believe, but I don't work in a place which manufactures electronics, so we don't have a to comply with RoHS.
 

Online MrMobodies

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #45 on: July 02, 2020, 08:58:35 pm »
6. Try green tea : Having green tea has really boosted my eyesight. Now I am without glasses for over 2 years. I am not 100% sure if it is only the green tea which has contributed to it, but from my personal experience, it has helped a lot. It is a powerful anti oxidant and stress reliever.  It can help cure your eye muscle fatigue when taken over long duration. It may take months before you see a difference. Just 2 cups a day for 1 month should be enough to notice some result.

7. Cut down sugar and switch to honey for your tea.

I am hearing all good things about green tea. Got to give a try.

A couple of days ago I starting seeing strange things in my vision and it happens when I don't do much work eat sugary things or bread and I end up going to sleep for a while so now I am trying to be careful.
 

Offline Wallace Gasiewicz

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Re: Health issues due to soldering fumes.
« Reply #46 on: July 03, 2020, 12:10:13 am »
I worked in health and safety. One of the things we had to monitor was lead.
Lead almost always gets into the body through the mouth.
Things like zinc can be very harmful as "fumes, lead can be also. This happens when someone welds or cuts with a torch.
This is called "metal fume fever" and is quite striking and can make you very sick for a short time. Again this is with usually cutting or welding. Solder temperatures are not that high.
Lead poisoning happens almost always through the mouth. Grinding used to be a common cause of lead poisoning in auto body production when lead was used to cover seams in auto bodies. The lead was applied in semi solid form at controlled temperatures with such implements as putty knives and then ground down with powered grinders. Talk about a good (bad?)  way to get particles airborne and into your face!!! This has been eliminated in production as far as I know. This method of auto body repair also resulted in the term "lead sled" i.e. a custom auto body. Almost impossible to find anyone who is skilled enough to do this.
Another place where lead exposure can be high is in lead battery recycling where old batteries are crushed and lead separated by physical methods before being re smelted. Also lead smelting and refining.
We had one goofy guy who had high lead levels. Turns out he had a habit of keeping bullets in his pocket (I do not know why), bullet to hand to mouth. I just bring this up to emphasize the oral rout. This would also go to old toy lead soldiers and old toys painted in lead paint.
Lead levels decreased in workers when proper industrial hygiene was implemented. The most effective procedures for safety included bans on eating, drinking and smoking when there was lead dust involved. Also there were facilities available for showering and for containment of work clothing so lead would not follow workers home.
Slag from the top of molten lead pots is dangerous also. It can become airborne as dust much more easily than molten lead. This is dust,not "fumes", but a bad source of lead exposure.
Childhood lead poising is mostly from eating lead paint which tasted pretty good. Another source is water. There are thousands of miles of lead pipes carrying city water to millions of homes last that I knew. (Remember Flint, Michigan??) This can be a problem if the water is acidic, then the lead leaches from the pipes and into the water. Some pewter serving vessels and some ceramic glazes contained lead. Do not drink tomato juice or lemonade from these . These vessels are an unlikely source of lead poisoning. I do not think they make these things anymore but there are some old ones about and who knows what amateur potters will use?
As far as "flux" goes... It is variable. There are many "fluxes" one of the predominant fluxes in the past was Rosin, a pine tree product used in lots of things including shoe manufacturing and the bag at pitcher's mound. It can be an allergen. Some people are allergic to it and get allergic rashes.

Multiple studies have shown no risk to solderers in electronic assembly in the past where soldering was done by hand. This was done in assembly where workers soldered 8 hours a day. But again proper hygiene and eliminating oral rout of contamination by little particles of lead is necessary.
Here is my opinion:
Solder fume extractors probably do not meet any standards but cannot hurt. They just take some smoke particles out of the air. Good idea but no where near getting most of the particles out of the air. Can't hurt.
Proper hygiene should focus on hand to mouth contamination with lead. Lead will rub off on your fingers just by handling cold solder, Just look at you fingers after an hour or so of soldering.

There were people who were advertising "chelation" as a treatment for undiagnosed chronic heavy metal poisoning(all sorts of heavy metals, not just lead). Chelation is extremely dangerous and can kill you.

As to the "allergic" reaction described as being "foggy", pardon me if this offends you, that is not my intention. These "unusual" symptoms have been described in connection to all sorts of things, one of them is chocolate.(believe it or not).
I really do not know if these things are really connected to the alleged "allergen" but there are some boni fide real allergists (MDs) who believe it. Things like this are an ongoing topic and I reserve my right to have no opinion except to again say there are some very conservative good allergists who believe in these allergic connections.(maybe "allergic" is the wrong term here maybe "idiosyncratic" to include non allergic reactions?) If this is the case that there is some sort of individual reaction, I would doubt that a standard solder fume filter would eliminate the exposure.
Allergies like "hay fever", (really ragweed or Russian ragweed, i.e tumbleweed) do make people sleepy besides making them miserable. I know, I have hay fever.
Wally
« Last Edit: July 03, 2020, 12:13:58 am by Wallace Gasiewicz »
 
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