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heartbroken that John Clauser seems to have joined climate change denial.
<< < (39/67) > >>
mendip_discovery:
One thing that winds me up though is if you have questions about climate change you automatically get labelled as a denier and therefore are not allowed in the conversation.

As a kid of the 80's I grew up with the fear of the Ozone layer being destroyed and we even had a TV show called Captain Planet and the Planeteers and that made a big thing about cleaning up the world. Yet it didn't do a thing to change stuff if the current press is to be believed.

Part of me is aware the masses always need a level of fear to keep the populace in line, cold war, world war, starvation etc. but as you get older you just see it as the way things are, no point getting angry. It is like working hard for a boss that will only make more money on your hard work.

I do note the wording has changed over the years to better cover their arses. It was global cooling then warming, and now its climate change. The planet is billions of years old and we are using 170 years of temperature data (50 for sea water) and you can use that to make statements about the change.

I can't see that every house/business now has indoor heating and cooling that pushes heat into the surrounding area, with the number of people and houses we have these days that is clearly going to have an effect on the temperature. We also have lost our green land and trees that on a hot summers day are very good at making cool zones.
PlainName:

--- Quote ---As a kid of the 80's I grew up with the fear of the Ozone layer being destroyed and we even had a TV show called Captain Planet and the Planeteers and that made a big thing about cleaning up the world. Yet it didn't do a thing to change stuff if the current press is to be believed.
--- End quote ---

Didn't the ban on CFCs fix that up? Can't recall any recent press stuff about this either way, so if you have a relevant link I'd be interested to see it.
tszaboo:

--- Quote from: Dr. Frank on August 05, 2023, 05:31:02 pm ---
--- Quote from: Wallace Gasiewicz on August 05, 2023, 04:23:41 pm ---Absolutely, the scientific community and the medical community were threatened by the Govmint bureaucrats. Doctors had licenses to loose if they did not follow the party policy, professors would loose their jobs. 
So they just rolled over and put up with the idiocy. 
You could easily get censored on any medical blog for not agreeing with the party line, so no one knew that there were people who did not agree with it. Social media was biased against any dissent.   
If you believe in Govmint control and that it is good, you must also believe that dissent is either a traitorous action or a mental disease.  Welcome to totalitarianism.

--- End quote ---

I don't regard the Medical  community, especially the epidemiologists and virologists as "Scientists", as especially here in Germany they did neither use Scientific methods, as of part 1) of my description, nor did they use overall Risk Assessment methods as I mentioned about our A3 Sheet method.

In Germany, they filed a final report about the whole government "Expert" team consisting mainly of medical guys, and it was clearly stated, that this report could not decide, whether the measures like lock-down of the whole country was appropriate or not, or had any positive effect, due to the fact, that the medical team did not collect appropriate data material at all.

As Germany was not able to make automated data acquisition, they (Mrs. Merkel) simply locked our country down, when a  limit of 35 incidents (*) / 100k people was exceeded. This arbitrary limit was simply defined by the maximum manual capacity of our local health offices, which received the data by FAX only.
Germany is really not a country of good engineering any more.

Frank

(*) "incidents" meant reported number of  people which were supposed to be sick with C.
Officially, later, they of course argued with the limited Intense Medical Care capacity of the hospitals.

--- End quote ---
In a way, it's not possible to apply the scientific method when dealing with an unknown situation. We didn't have a large global pandemic for a while, the last one, Spanish flu maybe killed more people than WW2. So our politicians are not prepared to handle it, because they are not experts. So what is the reasonable thing to do? Stepping down and creating a party neutral cabinet with experts. Almost no politician said that they have no idea how to handle the situation while stepping down, and that's just criminal.
You can even look at the German government when they had a diversity hire as the Minister of Defense, who never served, while there is a war going on in Europe.
Instead important positions are filled up with ideologs and idiots.
Dr. Frank:

--- Quote from: tszaboo on August 05, 2023, 06:17:36 pm ---
In a way, it's not possible to apply the scientific method when dealing with an unknown situation. We didn't have a large global pandemic for a while, the last one, Spanish flu maybe killed more people than WW2. So our politicians are not prepared to handle it, because they are not experts. So what is the reasonable thing to do? Stepping down and creating a party neutral cabinet with experts. Almost no politician said that they have no idea how to handle the situation while stepping down, and that's just criminal.
You can even look at the German government when they had a diversity hire as the Minister of Defense, who never served, while there is a war going on in Europe.
Instead important positions are filled up with ideologs and idiots.

--- End quote ---

I fully disagree on the first part
"Scientists" are able to analyze existing data, and from that make good predictions for unknown cases and into the future.
As well they always do research on expected future scenarios, "what would be, if".
Those are the key features of a real scientist, I guess.

Especially in this case our Robert Koch Institute had a big data base of all virus epidemics, pandemics and the "seasonal" flu, probably covering over 100 years.
Those epidemiologist's for a long time already expected another pandemic event. Remember, that the Pig Flu about 15 years ago, Ebola, and also AIDS were already epidemic or pandemic diseases. So the medical guys should have been prepared a long time ago.. sure the politicians everywhere have absolutely no clue, neither in medical nor in climate / energy questions.

Another story: In late 2019, Physicists from Göttingen, Aerosol research, only they investigated theoretically on the transport mechanism of viruses under different circumstances like talking, singing, making music, and they made  the suiting experiments. They found out the distance of those ominous 1.5m, where the aerosol particles fall down by gravity, and they did practical research on the effectiveness of different kind of face masks. They also investigated on room particle filters for schools.

None of their results were taken over by those government experts, and after 3 years of blind flying, our gvt. was still not able to recognize anything useful, especially our infamous Prof. "Karlchen" Lauterbach, who was by chance my fellow student at RWTH Aachen at that early 1980ties.

Frank
coppice:

--- Quote from: PlainName on August 05, 2023, 06:03:17 pm ---
--- Quote ---As a kid of the 80's I grew up with the fear of the Ozone layer being destroyed and we even had a TV show called Captain Planet and the Planeteers and that made a big thing about cleaning up the world. Yet it didn't do a thing to change stuff if the current press is to be believed.
--- End quote ---
Didn't the ban on CFCs fix that up? Can't recall any recent press stuff about this either way, so if you have a relevant link I'd be interested to see it.

--- End quote ---
It would appear that changes to CFC usage have reversed the problem, and the ozone holes have been closing up.
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