Author Topic: Help me, I have boreout  (Read 10830 times)

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Online capt bullshot

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #50 on: January 18, 2018, 12:05:02 pm »
That's like DIlbert in real life  :o

Stuff like that happens all over the place where I'm working (and I've been told so from somewhere else), people doing so don't even think they might offend you by doing so - I can't really understand that. I can understand you, that's a big demotivator. I guess it'll be hard to find a better place where such stuff doesn't happen. You're just a cost centre for the bean counters and the bosses and managers ... That's the sad reality in engineering today.
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Offline Kjelt

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #51 on: January 18, 2018, 12:32:35 pm »
Are you still working there?  |O
Past time to move on, go fly out, there are a lot of jobs out there, stop complaining and take action.
 

Online NANDBlog

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #52 on: January 18, 2018, 12:44:41 pm »
Are you still working there?  |O
Past time to move on, go fly out, there are a lot of jobs out there, stop complaining and take action.
Jeah, I'm doing that. Browsing linkedin now.

That's like DIlbert in real life  :o
They did this, after discussing the exact same thing at the yearly performance review in December. I also told them, that they have to change. It is a small company. It has no experience launching products. I do. My manager even mentioned that there will be a meeting today. I told him I should be on it, and this is exactly the thing that we talked about.
BTW this is a manager, who got promoted to be my boss. He is an IT system administrator. No experience in electronics. Gets to be my boss. Well, I dont think so.
 

Offline Cyberdragon

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #53 on: January 18, 2018, 04:31:36 pm »
Make sure you scramble all of your product designs and stuff you made into absolute gibbrish before you leave. >:D

Also set your lock screen and screensaver to the "you didn't say the magic word" meme. >:D
*BZZZZZZAAAAAP*
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Offline mcinque

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #54 on: January 18, 2018, 04:39:38 pm »
With your knowledge, you could start your own company. Take one of your ideas, one project you consider good and build it and sell it on your own. Instead looking at news or forums at work, you could use that time to work on your projects. It would be more productive and would give you a scope. Just my 2 cents
I'm basically still a rookie and because of this, even with the best intentions, I often say bullshits
 

Offline Galenbo

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #55 on: January 18, 2018, 09:51:05 pm »
I have a job, where they will not fire me, but I have nothing meaningful to do. I became Wally (from Dilbert).
Literally, I do nothing at work for days. I go to work, sit at my PC, open web browser, start looking at daily news, look at it 20x the day,...
Stop this, It will make you depressed. Social media and news are there to catch you, enslave you, passivate you.

... In the meantime, I keep the appearance, like I'm working. I hate that. Alt tabbing and leaving one of my screens for continuously scrolling linux bullshit, having two or three SSH window open...
Sometimes I desing a PCB just for the fun. I have a folder with 11 PCB projects, that are completely useless, like 12V DC input hat for raspberry PI zero. Nobody needs that. I designed it, because I don’t want my abilities to completely go to waste.
Why not design something useful, market it, sell it ?

The situation is bad. Effecting my health. I cough every morning after waking up. It's philological. And I'm tired in the evening. After doing 8 hours of nothing. I have low self-esteem, and I feel depressed.
Should I quit again? Should I move?
You should start another real challenge. Outside or inside company, doesn't matter.
It seems like you can perfectly combine your job with another professional activity.
I was in the same situation for 2 years, and could put ALL the money I made aside, because I could live from what I made extra, during their hours.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2018, 09:53:12 pm by Galenbo »
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Offline cdev

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #56 on: January 18, 2018, 10:22:15 pm »
If you're really in a rut you should look for another job, from your home computer- while you are home. Don't do that from work.

If you find another job, give them whatever the customary notice is. And don't diss your previous employer.

Don't ever check your personal email accounts from work.

Don't just try to look professional, be professional.  You may not see things the same way as they do. 

« Last Edit: January 18, 2018, 10:30:02 pm by cdev »
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Online tggzzz

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #57 on: January 21, 2018, 07:44:22 am »
Finally it explains why so many keyboard warriors with multi thousand post count on this forum, posting about always anything with no substance.

That's one of the more succinct self-referential postings I've seen in quite a while. Or did you have a point you wished to make?
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
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Online tggzzz

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #58 on: January 21, 2018, 08:03:17 am »
I was in the OP's position once, near the beginning of my career.

There was a company reorganisation/takeover, and I had a choice of jobs:
  • one, on the same site, would have been comfortable but boring and stagnant from a career PoV
  • the other, on a different site, was unknown but potentially interesting - but with an intolerable commute
I chose to avoid that first easy path that leads down to nowhere, and to put myself in a position where I had to make a decision. If second remote job was good I would move house. If it was merely OK then I would change job/company. In the end, after 3 months in the remote job, I left and found a job in a different part of the country. That worked out very well for me, partly through luck but partly because I made my own luck.

OTOH it would have been far more difficult if I had family commitments, as happened later in my career.

Alternative viewpoint: use your current stagnation to decide whether you want to continue in the same (technical) direction, or use it as an opportunity to develop into something different, e.g. sales, marketing, or project management.

Apart from that, use the time to develop technical skills in a new area that might be useful to your current employer or a new employer.

Do not visibly develop any product or concept that you might wish to personally use outside your current employment. Similarly be careful about looking as if you are "poaching" clients from your existing employer on behalf of your next employer. Employment law is complex and a source of revenue for lawyers; your next employer might be frightened off.
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
Having fun doing more, with less
 

Offline cdev

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #59 on: January 21, 2018, 12:55:50 pm »
The pressures causing 'boreout' arent just a problem at the employee level.

Pressure to become profitable immediately is blocking a lot of potentially creative businesses from forming, and forcing existing ones out of business..

What are the ways to escape this cycle at the company/management level, one has to wonder also.

This is a short excerpt from an excellent essay by John Reader..


"1.6
THE RISE OF THE NEW ECONOMY

I will now examine the argument that the current context is the result of a series of decisions and
policies that some within the field of politics and sociology term the rise of the New Economy.
In other words, there are clear and identifiable changes within the global economic structure
that derive directly from deliberately pursued political decisions and that reflect the interests
of a certain set of key players. One of the major contributors to this theory is the sociologist
Castells who has written one of the seminal works in recent years on the subject of what he calls
the Network Society (Castells, 2000).

This New Economy has emerged during the last quarter of the twentieth century and
is characterized by three distinctive features. First, it is informational in that the productivity
and competitiveness of all agents in the economy (firms, regions or nations) depend upon their
capacity to generate, process and apply knowledge-based information. Secondly, it is global as
the core activities of production and consumption as well as their components (capital, labour,
technology, markets etc.) are organized on a global scale. Finally, it is networked because it is
through networks that competition is played out on the global stage. The information technology
revolution has been instrumental in creating this new set of conditions and both the constraints
and possibilities that flow from them (Castells, 2000, 77). What are the implications of this for
the ways in which work is now organized?

Quote
Castells suggests that companies operating in this new environment have a number of
strategies that they can pursue towards both skilled and unskilled labour (Castells, 2000, 254).

These are as follows:
  • Downsize the firm, keeping the indispensable highly skilled labour force in the North
    while importing inputs from low-cost areas (very much the Dyson approach to matters).
  • Subcontract part of the work to their transnational establishments and to auxiliary
    networks whose production can still be internalized through the network enterprise
    system.
  • Use temporary labour, part-time workers, or informal firms as suppliers in the home
    country.
  • Automate or relocate tasks for which the standard labour market prices are too high.
  • Obtain from the labour force agreement to more stringent conditions of work and pay as
    a condition for the continuation of their jobs, thus reversing social contracts established
    under more favourable conditions for labour.

It is possible that any combination of these will be encountered in specific situations
depending upon local conditions and decisions. The effect is to draw all countries into this system
though and to create a convergence of labour market conditions across the globe. Furthermore,
as Castells says:

The pressure towards greater flexibility of the labour market and toward the reversal of
the Welfare State in Western Europe come less from the pressures derived from East Asia
than from the comparison with the United States. (Castells, 2000, 254)

Any company wishing to compete on anything like equal terms with a U.S. based business
will have little choice but to follow the same route of creating greater labour flexibility. Hence
“lean production, downsizing, restructuring, consolidation, and flexible management practices
are induced and made possible by the intertwined impact of economic globalization and diffusion
of information technologies” (Castells, 2000, 255).

So although there is not a unified global labour market, similar patterns of labour orga-
nization emerge across national boundaries. Was this inevitable though? Castells suggests not:
This model is not the inevitable consequence of the informational paradigm but the result
of an economic and political choice made by governments and companies selecting the
‘low road’ in the process of the transition to the new, informational economy, mainly using
productivity increases for short-term profitability. These policies contrast sharply, in fact,
with the possibilities of work enhancement and sustained, high productivity opened up
by the transformation of the work process under the informational paradigm. (Castells,
2000, 255)

What begins to emerge from this, assuming Castells is correct, is that the way that
engineering is now being shaped as a result of the forces of globalization, is only one possibility,
albeit the one that leads to short-term gain for some but at the expense of others. Is this good
for engineering or good for engineers? If one contrasts what is occurring with other possibilities,
then one might argue that it is not. What we do have at the moment is a loss of jobs in the North
combined with more stringent working conditions and the general demise of earlier victories
gained by the labour movements. Increasing instability and job insecurity are combined with
the downgrading of newly incorporated urban labour in industrializing countries. This is not
the result of the structural logic of the informational economy which could just as easily have led
to higher levels of secure employment and greater opportunities for investment and innovation.
Instead, the use of networking and the political decision to create a more mobile and volatile
labour market have undermined such possibilities. Now that these processes are ‘locked in’ it is
going to be extremely difficult to reverse them.

Agencies such as the International Monetary Fund and national government organizations have suggested that the problems of rising unemployment, income inequality and social
polarization are the result of a skills mismatch, exacerbated by a lack of flexibility in the labour
market—we have encountered such interpretations already in the area of SET. So there is a
shortage of requisite skills to enable people to take advantage of the New Economy and this is
to be tackled through the educational system. However, some now argue that the evidence for
this is actually extremely thin and that simply increasing the numbers of people in training will
not itself create jobs that have now gone overseas. Castells documents the evidence for what has
been happening in the USA in terms of unemployment and growing inequality (Castells, 2000,
298), but also points out that similar trends are visible elsewhere in the developed world. The
new vulnerability of labour is not confined to low-skilled jobs but is spreading up the labour
market hierarchy and into the ranks of professionals. Political parties of all persuasions on both
sides of the Atlantic are pursuing the same policies with very much the same results.
Membership of corporations, or even countries, ceased to have its privileges because
stepped-up global competition kept redesigning the variable geometry of work and mar-
kets. Never was labour more central to the process of value making. But never were the
workers (regardless of their skills) more vulnerable to the organization, since they had be-
come lean individuals, farmed out in a flexible network whose whereabouts were unknown
to the network itself. (Castells, 2000, 302)

So this is the wider context in which engineering is now operating, one in which instability
and uncertainty have been deliberately built into the system in ways which discourage individuals
from challenging the decisions and policies of their employers and which may also act as a
disincentive for businesses themselves to invest in innovative or high-risk projects. Unless a
project can show a swift profit turnaround for its investors—i.e. within 12 months is the figure
I have heard in some companies where the real lead time for research and development would
expect to be considerably longer—there is no chance of funding. The more ‘competitive’ the
global economy becomes, the less likely it is that smaller companies will survive or that general
deteriorating working conditions will be reversed."[/i]

(Source: Globalization, Engineering, and
Creativity by  John Reader
SYNTHESIS LECTURES ON ENGINEERING, TECHNOLOGY AND
SOCIETY #3  Morgan & Claypool Publishers)
« Last Edit: January 21, 2018, 01:08:50 pm by cdev »
"What the large print giveth, the small print taketh away."
 
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Offline basinstreetdesign

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #60 on: January 22, 2018, 07:45:51 am »
I was in the OP's position once, near the beginning of my career...

Me too.  I had got a reputation for being able to design some hardware that would need little to no debugging to get it working.  BTW: Once, I designed some complicated hardware-only project, it was built by a tech over the next few weeks.  He came to me and said "guess what?  It works!"  I said "what do you mean it works?"  And it did, flawlessly - no debugging required.  This can be deadly - they will come to expect it every time.

Anyway, sales dried up and I had not much to do for several months at a stretch.  But I was consulting on the side.  The situation was stupid.  I would come in to the office and do the square root of dick all for 8 hours and then go home and bust my ass for 4 hours every night and on weekends to get a system up and running.  But the two bosses liked me so much that when I told them I had better prospects consulting than staying they offered to keep me on the payroll at 50% but otherwise I was free to go. All I had to do was come in once in a while if needed. This surrealistic deal lasted 6 months.  I was literally getting paid to stay home.

They eventually re-organized their business and I joined them again.
STAND BACK!  I'm going to try SCIENCE!
 

Online tggzzz

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #61 on: January 22, 2018, 08:41:58 am »
The pressures causing 'boreout' arent just a problem at the employee level.

Pressure to become profitable immediately is blocking a lot of potentially creative businesses from forming, and forcing existing ones out of business..

What are the ways to escape this cycle at the company/management level, one has to wonder also.

This is a short excerpt from an excellent essay by John Reader..

Long semi-political diatribe snipped.

Please do not post such things here; when I want to read them I go to sci.electronics.design, which has the advantage that Win Hill occasionally surfaces.
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
Having fun doing more, with less
 

Online NANDBlog

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #62 on: January 26, 2018, 12:08:08 pm »
Another update.
For anyone who is interested.

My employer and me terminated our work contract earlier today.
They pushed me over the edge yesterday. I think this was intentional. They did the same to one of my coworker before. Terminating contract on a short notice, acting passive aggressively.
Firing an employee is very expensive in Belgium. It is a disgusting way to conduct business IMHO.
At least now I'm free to find a better things to do. I have "fuck you" money for the foreseeable future.
 

Online bd139

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #63 on: January 26, 2018, 12:19:46 pm »
Been there and completely understand how you can get shit on like that. My current employer did that to me. Then they had to hire me back on contract at 3x the daily rate when they realised I was basically master plate spinner :-DD

If you have some fuck you money, good job. Take some time off and work out how to be human again, not wage slave. I find employment dehumanising if I'm honest.
 

Online tggzzz

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #64 on: January 26, 2018, 03:55:45 pm »
I have "fuck you" money for the foreseeable future.

Good; that's a good feeling - don't waste it!

Personally I prefer calling it "drop dead money", from the novel quoted in this source: https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Drop%20dead%20money
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
Having fun doing more, with less
 

Offline taydin

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #65 on: January 26, 2018, 04:20:50 pm »
If it pays sufficiently, an "all day idle" job can also be a blessing. You can concentrate on your personal electronic projects when at home, and you can do online research on those while at work :)
Real programmers use machine code!

My hobby projects http://mekatronik.org/forum
 
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Online NANDBlog

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #66 on: January 26, 2018, 06:09:01 pm »
I have "fuck you" money for the foreseeable future.

Good; that's a good feeling - don't waste it!

Personally I prefer calling it "drop dead money", from the novel quoted in this source: https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Drop%20dead%20money
I know, the term is vulgar, not nice.
But Dave also used it in one of his videos, so I guess it will be OK for the forum.
Been there and completely understand how you can get shit on like that. My current employer did that to me. Then they had to hire me back on contract at 3x the daily rate when they realised I was basically master plate spinner :-DD

If you have some fuck you money, good job. Take some time off and work out how to be human again, not wage slave. I find employment dehumanising if I'm honest.
I've actually asked a consultant to do some mentoring and tell me how he does it. It would probably suit my daily habbit better (I'm a night owl) and working on my own terms... I can only dream of what's that like.
 

Offline Ice-Tea

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #67 on: January 26, 2018, 06:20:33 pm »
I've actually asked a consultant to do some mentoring and tell me how he does it. It would probably suit my daily habbit better (I'm a night owl) and working on my own terms... I can only dream of what's that like.

I do that as well. Feel free to shoot me a PM if you want some pointers ;)

Offline AndyC_772

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #68 on: January 26, 2018, 06:41:40 pm »
Me too. Feel free to ask anything, that's what the forum is for  :-+

Offline chris_leyson

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #69 on: January 26, 2018, 07:40:53 pm »
Hi Nandblog sorry to hear things didn't work out, from what you've said it sounds very much like constructive dismissal. At least now you've got a bit of free time to chill out for a while and think about what you would like to do in the future.

My last employer became isolvent and terminated everyones contracts, we're still owed a months pay as well as redundancy pay but the company owner managed to screw things up by transfering company assets to another company before becoming insolvent so nobody gets statutory redundancy pay from the government and we have to take the owner to court. I'm still out on this one because I don't any of us are going to see a penny, will probably have to pay legal costs and by the time the case comes up the owner may very well have moved all the physical assets to China. Rant over.

Anyway, I landed on my feet eventually and now I'm working for a large Japanese company within a team of twenty or so hardware and software engineers. I like the company ethos and it's nice change to work for someone who puts a lot of effort into product design.

Good luck Nandblog something will turn up eventually  :-+

 

Online nctnico

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #70 on: January 26, 2018, 08:13:25 pm »
Another update.
For anyone who is interested.

My employer and me terminated our work contract earlier today.
They pushed me over the edge yesterday. I think this was intentional. They did the same to one of my coworker before. Terminating contract on a short notice, acting passive aggressively.
Firing an employee is very expensive in Belgium. It is a disgusting way to conduct business IMHO.
At least now I'm free to find a better things to do. I have "fuck you" money for the foreseeable future.
If you wanna work on something interesting in the NL then drop me a line. No need to speak Dutch and no chance to get bored.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 
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Offline Dubbie

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #71 on: January 26, 2018, 08:28:52 pm »
Sorry to hear NANDBlog. Hopefully you’ll look back on this as a turning point towards much better things.

A bit of self confidence at this stage is one of the most valuable things you can have.

Best of luck!
 

Offline Galenbo

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #72 on: January 31, 2018, 09:00:19 am »
My employer and me terminated our work contract earlier today.
They ...
At least now I'm free to find a better things to do.

Good, now you have more of your life for you.
Can you link/post/PM a short version of your CV ?
If you try and take a cat apart to see how it works, the first thing you have on your hands is a nonworking cat.
 

Online NANDBlog

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #73 on: March 01, 2018, 01:42:04 pm »
Hi Nandblog sorry to hear things didn't work out, from what you've said it sounds very much like constructive dismissal. At least now you've got a bit of free time to chill out for a while and think about what you would like to do in the future.
Yes, definitely. I actually felt happy after leaving the company.

I do that as well. Feel free to shoot me a PM if you want some pointers ;)
Thanks for the offer. I will stay an employee for the time being.

I got head hunted with an offer I cannot refuse, just signed the papers.
My country flag will change, but that is just life. I'm smiling.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2018, 02:39:21 pm by NANDBlog »
 

Offline Ice-Tea

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Re: Help me, I have boreout
« Reply #74 on: March 01, 2018, 01:48:37 pm »
 :-+


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