How did you clean up/ debloat windows 10?

[rdl]

Apparently you can now "defer" updates on all versions of Windows 10 for up to 30 days.  There's just something very suspicious to me about a system that needs that much updating and that level of control.

[apis]

I prefer if I'm the one in charge of the computer and not the other way around.

[joeqsmith]

I am still using DD-WRT to block MS and a few others.   It's worked out really well.    Not too long ago, I wanted to play with Dave's 121GW BT software.  It required me to update my Windows 10 to the latest version.   Against my better judgement, I allowed Windows access to MS.  After the upgrade, I ran wireshark for a few more days and sure enough they had added some ways to get in.  After plugging those, the PC has once again been stable.   

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/windows-10-creators-update-1703/msg1321900/#msg1321900

[james_s]

Yes, that is true. I just worry someone might expect it to be a perfectly smooth ride; there will inevitably be some frustration when switching to a new OS.

Sure but that's going to apply to Windows now too. 8 and 10 (which I consider to be more like 8.5) are so nearly as different than previous versions as Linux. When I saw the direction Windows was going I realized I was going to have to learn a new OS one way or another and if I'm going to do that, why continue to be trapped in Windows? This is doubly true of MS manages to kill off "legacy" Win32 software and move everybody to "modern" mobile style apps. They seem to be overlooking the fact that Traditional Windows desktop software and familiarity is the whole reason almost anyone runs Windows, deprecate that and Windows no longer has any reason to exist, it's not Windows anymore.

[bitseeker]

Underneath the heavy layer of frosting that is Windows 8-10 are buried dialogs from Vista and XP. Dig deep enough (sometimes 4-5 layers down) and familiar components appear.

Nevertheless, all operating systems suck, just in different ways. Use the one(s) that annoy you the least for what you need to accomplish. At least we're not stuck with just one (yet).

[Halcyon]

https://getfedora.org

[Zero999]

That script is a good idea, but doesn't all that shit get reinstalled when Windows does a major update? Isn't there a way to do a check at boot time to detect of that crap has been reinstalled and silently run the script again, if it has?

Windows 10 is such a slow, buggy turd,  some Windows programs run better under WINE. Running under Windows, it often it takes over five minutes for the safe as dialogue box in LTSpice to become responsive, yet it happens immediately when run under WINE! I accept it may take a little longer on this Windows machine because the documents are stored on a separate mechanical hard drive, to the solid state one the OS is installed on, so perhaps a few seconds at most to start the hard drive, if it has been turned off to save power, but not over five bloody minutes!

[soldar]

I am still using DD-WRT to block MS and a few others.   It's worked out really well. 

I wanted to do that some years ago but I bricked a Linksys router and that was the end of that road.  Then I tried messing with pfsense which is very good but it did not support USB network adapters.

Maybe one of these days I should go back to looking at pfsense and/or DD-WRT solutions.

[Mr. Scram]

I wanted to do that some years ago but I bricked a Linksys router and that was the end of that road.  Then I tried messing with pfsense which is very good but it did not support USB network adapters.

Maybe one of these days I should go back to looking at pfsense and/or DD-WRT solutions.

You probably got unlucky. Flashing DD-WRT isn't terribly complicated, although I concede that the instructions aren't always presented as coherently as they'd ideally be.

[james_s]

I've been using Tomato on my router for years. It's very similar to DD-WRT although at the time at least I found the UI to be nicer. I have the Apple update servers blocked to prevent my iPhone from downloading the latest iOS every time I delete it. This sort of behavior is infuriating, I demand absolute control over my devices, the technology exists to be my slave, not the other way around.

[Mr. Scram]

I've been using Tomato on my router for years. It's very similar to DD-WRT although at the time at least I found the UI to be nicer. I have the Apple update servers blocked to prevent my iPhone from downloading the latest iOS every time I delete it. This sort of behavior is infuriating, I demand absolute control over my devices, the technology exists to be my slave, not the other way around.

I've never had the latest iOS download without an explicit command. I think you need to turn off Automatic Updates.

https://www.macworld.co.uk/how-to/iphone/stop-iphone-nagging-ios-software-update-3641478/

[james_s]

It's been off since the very start on both iPhones I've owned and it most certainly does download itself automatically. On my old iPhone 4 I had to keep the 8GB phone full of photos to prevent it from downloading the >1GB iOS7 update. On my current SE I've had to delete the iOS11 and 12 updates numerous times when they've downloaded themselves when I forgot and plugged it into power while on other WiFi networks.

It typically doesn't install itself but it will download repeatedly at which point it nags you to install. Even after deleting it I've had a perpetual red badge on the settings icon nagging me about an available update. Turning off auto update does not prevent iOS from downloading. I've had this setting since day one since I was well aware of the issue from my last iPhone and still it discovered an update is available. I deleted the update and that notification badge is still there. I eventually installed the TVOS profile as instructed on that page you found but even so a few weeks ago the @*&^# iOS12 update somehow downloaded again and offered to install.

[Mr. Scram]

It's been off since the very start on both iPhones I've owned and it most certainly does download itself automatically. On my old iPhone 4 I had to keep the 8GB phone full of photos to prevent it from downloading the >1GB iOS7 update. On my current SE I've had to delete the iOS11 and 12 updates numerous times when they've downloaded themselves when I forgot and plugged it into power while on other WiFi networks.

It typically doesn't install itself but it will download repeatedly at which point it nags you to install. Even after deleting it I've had a perpetual red badge on the settings icon nagging me about an available update. Turning off auto update does not prevent iOS from downloading. I've had this setting since day one since I was well aware of the issue from my last iPhone and still it discovered an update is available. I deleted the update and that notification badge is still there. I eventually installed the TVOS profile as instructed on that page you found but even so a few weeks ago the @*&^# iOS12 update somehow downloaded again and offered to install.

I've never seen that behaviour.  I've seen prompts to download the latest update and the notification badges, but they're not downloaded before commanded to do so. This is in line with the link I posted, so it doesn't appear something is off here. This behaviour may have been changed since iOS 7 and the issues you experienced with that though. I'll make sure to pay close attention when the next update hits.

[james_s]

I don't know, I've never had iOS7. I had 6 on my first phone which is still my favorite and 10 on the current one. In each case I've bought a new phone, got it all set up the way I want it and then my desire is to freeze the configuration until EOL. I hate updates, with each one come new features I didn't ask for, new bugs, and the phone gets more sluggish. Apple seems hell bent on updating iOS devices to about one version beyond where they should have left well enough alone, to the point that the device becomes almost unusably slow, which I'm sure is their intent. The fact that there is no way to roll back is another thorn in my side, but I don't really have any other option, there's Android but it shares many of the same pain points and has a bunch of different things that irritate me.

[hwj-d]

Back to win10. 

Last days i build a PC for someone. He wanted win7, but with NVMe-SSD, what should make it incredible fast. So I bought a Samsung 970 EVO for him, from which i know, there are win7 drivers available. I bought a ASRock H370M-ITX/ac Mini-ITX, to make it compact as possible. I have some win7 install-cd's without service pack for the initial setup on temporary external ssd, and after install all the board drivers, i wanted to install the NVMe drivers to the temp win7, and after that, clone it to the onboard NVMe-SSD to boot from there.

But, surprisingly, no any driver from the board-cd could be installed! No usb, no fundamentally INF-driver, i've had nothing to get a step further.

A look at Asrock driver download online revealed the problem:

These are WIN10 - ONLY drivers!
They don't have win7-drivers anymore 

But nowhere a reference to it, not at purchase, and also not on the original driver cd enclosed!

So, this is the conceptionaly first win10-only-board, i've seen for now.

Luckily only the lan-driver is working. So i can upgrade the very first win7 updates over the net, an then download the MediaCreationTool from my server, to install win10 directly over the net, that works. But no chance for win7 with this board.

[blacksheeplogic]

I hate updates, with each one come new features I didn't ask for.

This is the reason I stopped using apple products. They started changing the UI with updates so I would have to get used to a new way of working or I would lose a feature I liked.

I however do this updates are important if they are patching legitimate security and/or bugs. Problem is that many times the forced updates come with features I don't want and I would prefer to stay on a release without them. Apple were by far the worst updates.

[jmelson]

How did you clean up/ debloat windows 10?

Run Linux!  I've been doing it since 1998 or so, it just keeps getting better!
All of my kids and my **WIFE** are using it, too!

Jon

[james_s]

There are a handful of reasons I'm still not using Linux for my daily driver, most of that comes down to software that does not have Linux versions or comparable equivalents although that is gradually shrinking. The other thing which may just be a matter of me learning a bit more, but when something breaks in Windows I can usually manage to fix it. With Linux on numerous occasions I have spent *hours* troubleshooting only to eventually give up and reinstall the OS. Most recently my Plex server crashed and somehow corrupted the root partition so the OS wouldn't fully boot. I tried everything I could think of, eventually gave up and reinstalled.

Then there is hardware support, I have a scanner that only has Windows drivers available. I used to have a printer that only had Windows drivers.

Then things like playing DVDs used to be unnecessarily difficult or impossible, only fixed when someone managed to crack the encryption. Services like Netflix for the longest time simply wouldn't work on Linux, I believe that has changed but I "fixed" it by dumping Netflix, going back to buying used discs and ripping them onto a Plex server. Technically I think ripping the discs is illegal because it circumvents the DRM but I own the discs so screw it, I'll do as I please.

Then there is the other edge of the customizable sword, Linux is SO tweakable and customizable that there are ten zillion ways of doing everything and nobody can agree on one standard set of anything. Thankfully Ubuntu and related releases with different window managers have helped to form one well supported mass market release that has steadily become more polished. Used to be Linux was always a few steps behind on polish but Windows helped tilt that greatly by regressing so far. At the point where Winndows 7 is no longer viable due to lack of support for modern hardware I think Linux will be the only viable choice for me. For now though Win7 is still very nice IMHO.

[bitseeker]

There are a handful of reasons I'm still not using Linux for my daily driver, most of that comes down to software that does not have Linux versions or comparable equivalents although that is gradually shrinking.

The reasons you list aren't unreasonable. One size doesn't fit all. Even OS X took some time to have enough market share for sufficient software to be made for it. Windows used to dominate much more than it does now.

Technically I think ripping the discs is illegal because it circumvents the DRM but I own the discs so screw it, I'll do as I please.

Technically, you're fine. Backing up your purchased media or transforming for your own use is still legal as far as I know. *knock on wood*

Used to be Linux was always a few steps behind on polish but Windows helped tilt that greatly by regressing so far. At the point where Winndows 7 is no longer viable due to lack of support for modern hardware I think Linux will be the only viable choice for me. For now though Win7 is still very nice IMHO.

Yes, Linux has come a long way. In fact, I find that it's less hassle to set up printers on Ubuntu (and its variants) than on Windows 10, especially for older printers. Last month, with an old HP laser printer, Ubuntu found it on the network and set it up. No fuss. Windows 10 couldn't see it until I explicitly entered its IP address. Then, it didn't have a driver for it and couldn't get it from Windows Update. After going through the process of forcing Windows to download more printer drivers, it still didn't have the correct model. So, I had to try a couple of generic PCL drivers to see which one would print without garbage. It was like the dark ages. Oh, how times have changed.

[apis]

There are a handful of reasons I'm still not using Linux for my daily driver, most of that comes down to software that does not have Linux versions or comparable equivalents although that is gradually shrinking. The other thing which may just be a matter of me learning a bit more, but when something breaks in Windows I can usually manage to fix it. With Linux on numerous occasions I have spent *hours* troubleshooting only to eventually give up and reinstall the OS. Most recently my Plex server crashed and somehow corrupted the root partition so the OS wouldn't fully boot. I tried everything I could think of, eventually gave up and reinstalled.

That's what I mean, it requires a bit of effort to learn if you want to do more complicated stuff. On the other hand, if windows crashes and the automatic chkdsk doesn't solve your problem you're screwed. On Linux you usually can fix things in my experience. The problem's I've had have either been hardware related or that I screwed up somehow (or tried some experimental software like zfs on fuse, which I blame myself for). The key to not having problems with linux is to not try the new exciting stuff, just stick to defaults and stable versions.

Ideally you shouldn't have to deal with anything else than the application software you are working with.

[Mr. Scram]

That's what I mean, it requires a bit of effort to learn if you want to do more complicated stuff. On the other hand, if windows crashes and the automatic chkdsk doesn't solve your problem you're screwed. On Linux you usually can fix things in my experience. The problem's I've had have either been hardware related or that I screwed up somehow (or tried some experimental software like zfs on fuse, which I blame myself for). The key to not having problems with linux is to not try the new exciting stuff, just stick to defaults and stable versions.

Ideally you shouldn't have to deal with anything else than the application software you are working with.

I literally can't remember the last time I saw a fully broken Windows install. I'm not saying it's anywhere near a perfect OS, but that doesn't appear to be a practical problem.

[apis]

Hardware fails eventually, so it's inevitable at some point. I have seen Windows fail many times. On Linux you have the possibility to make your setup as complicated as you like and that also, unfortunately, increase the probability that something will go wrong. Windows nowadays also protect it's system files very aggressively, which might mean there are fewer ways things can fail in vivo.

[Mr. Scram]

Hardware fails eventually, so it's inevitable at some point. I have seen Windows fail many times. On Linux you have the possibility to make your setup as complicated as you like and that also, unfortunately, increase the probability that something will go wrong. Windows nowadays also protect it's system files very aggressively, which might mean there are fewer ways things can fail in vivo.

If hardware fails it's not a Windows failure. I haven't seen it happening in large amounts of mundane or very complicated use cases, so I suspect it's a PEBKAC issue. The same applies to updates. If you know what you're doing, they shouldn't bother you. If you don't know what you're doing, Microsoft is doing you a favour by making sure your system is updated and protected. Now, I'm definitely not saying there haven't been issues in the past where Microsoft opted for a much too intrusive approach. Their current approach seems to work reasonably well, although I would personally prefer the traditional Windows update style and level of control. Most users seem to think updates are a nuisance and I see how some need the encouragement to do what's in their best interest.

[rdl]

I was under the impression that Windows 7 can't be installed on anything newer than 6 series/Skylake boards, and even then the lack of USB 3.0 drivers is a problem. If it can be done, then I'm building a new machine.

Back to win10. 

Last days i build a PC for someone. He wanted win7, but with NVMe-SSD, what should make it incredible fast. So I bought a Samsung 970 EVO for him, from which i know, there are win7 drivers available. I bought a ASRock H370M-ITX/ac Mini-ITX, to make it compact as possible. I have some win7 install-cd's without service pack for the initial setup on temporary external ssd, and after install all the board drivers, i wanted to install the NVMe drivers to the temp win7, and after that, clone it to the onboard NVMe-SSD to boot from there.

But, surprisingly, no any driver from the board-cd could be installed! No usb, no fundamentally INF-driver, i've had nothing to get a step further.

A look at Asrock driver download online revealed the problem:

These are WIN10 - ONLY drivers!
They don't have win7-drivers anymore 

But nowhere a reference to it, not at purchase, and also not on the original driver cd enclosed!

So, this is the conceptionaly first win10-only-board, i've seen for now.

Luckily only the lan-driver is working. So i can upgrade the very first win7 updates over the net, an then download the MediaCreationTool from my server, to install win10 directly over the net, that works. But no chance for win7 with this board.

[Mr. Scram]

I was under the impression that Windows 7 can't be installed on anything newer than 6 series/Skylake boards, and even then the lack of USB 3.0 drivers is a problem. If it can be done, then I'm building a new machine.

Windows 7 is effectively dead. It will lose support next year and isn't getting all the features as it is. You can work around the limitations if you really want to, but expect some tinkering to keep it going and things may break unexpectedly.