I belong to the Star Trek Generation

[rrinker]

 But he was only recreating the evil Captain Kirk from Enemy Within.

(and you can see which group I belong to that I know not only the SNL reference but the Trek episode - there was a time when I could tell the episode name and number within the first 10 seconds of an episode starting, for TOS only)

[Rick Law]

We have the technology to start colonising mars now. It's just that no-one wants to foot the bill, either in sheer money (the single most expensive project in the history of mankind to date) or the inevitable high-profile loss of life that comes with all high-risk exploration.

Check out the Chinese Mars programs.  I think the Chinese is the only one with active Mars programs.

[Cerebus]

And this is not the point of this thread. Please don't turn my thread into a socio/political debate.

And it is a naive point of view thinking an asteroid or some other event couldn't happen. I am reminded that:

For us mere mortals, time is not measured by clocks, but by moments.

I can't do anything about the poverty if I am busy building new spaceships.

The most salient thing here about Star trek is that, more than anything else, they were morality plays.

[Cerebus]

Let us not forget William Shatner's own words. "It's just a TV show"

Yes, but Bill Shatner also thinks he's a actor so we ought to take what he says with a pinch of salt.

[Rick Law]

I suppose I am typical.  I like StarTrek because it shows me what may be out there.  I pretend the are right, and imagine I am actually seeing all the wonders out there.

I do think that unless we human colonize another planet, we are doomed as a species.  Whether it is asteroids or mega volcanoes or other natural phenomenons we do not yet know, something someday will hit us.  With multiple home-bases, human species has a better chance to survive.

We know, even if we are very very lucky and nothing hit us, the sun will go red-giant.  At that point, if we don't have a base as far out as perhaps Jupiter orbit, we are done.  But even before we go red-giant, Andromeda galaxy will be near.  Perhaps so near that...  Well, may be not yet, but it will.

Someday, if human lasts that long.  A person look out in the night sky, and sees this giant wheel of a galaxy covering half the night sky.  It would be quite a sight for this person.  Each day, Andromeda will be closer, more stars and more details will unveil themselves.  Scientist of that time will be treated with lots of new discoveries to be made.

Will us humans end up being consumed by the newly formed double-size super massive black hole in this new galaxy that was once our own?  Or will us human be watching as our solar system, cast away by the collision of two galaxies, be watching the show on the side and then die as our sun dies in the void of inter-galactic space without another star near by?

The wonders of the universe.  So many questions, so many wonders.

If "Q" should say to me: "I will give you three wishes..."  I would say, (1) Show me what happens to earth when we collide with Andromeda.  (2) Show me what happens as our sun dies.  (3) Take me back to present day, in my dying days, let me orbit each planet (in a safe capsule) for a few full orbits each, and then take me back to earth on my very last day.

[james_s]

I'm sure we'll blow ourselves up long, long before the sun burns out. We'll probably use up the dwindling resources we have fighting over control of what resources remain.

[Rick Law]

I'm sure we'll blow ourselves up long, long before the sun burns out. We'll probably use up the dwindling resources we have fighting over control of what resources remain.

Then, what human remaining will just rebuild.  In a million years or less, we would be a better civilization having learned from past mistake (I hope).

If not, we have 100 billion stars in an average galaxy, and (we think) 200 billion galaxies.  Someone will be around.  They will just have one less friend.

[Brumby]

Then, what human remaining will just rebuild.  In a million years or less, we would be a better civilization having learned from past mistake (I hope).

... or we will have Morlocks and Eloi.

[Richard Crowley]

Earth has a second moon? 

So what if we do?  What have we done with the first one lately?

[Ampera]

Earth has a second moon? 

So what if we do?  What have we done with the first one lately?

Took a few strolls on it and left a load of tinfoil on it.

[BravoV]

Earth has a second moon? 

So what if we do?  What have we done with the first one lately?

For sure not us .. last time its the Megatron and the gang ...


..<duck n run>

[Psi]

The answer is simple - and mundane ....

Damn psi core, always blaming the mundanes
</troll>

[tszaboo]

Earth has a second moon? 

So what if we do?  What have we done with the first one lately?

Not yet. In 2049, we will find out that the moon is a big egg for a dragon like creature, it will hatch, and lay a new one.
http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/Kill_the_Moon_(TV_story)
Ok, I get out of here now...

[tpowell1830]

I suppose I am typical.  I like StarTrek because it shows me what may be out there.  I pretend the are right, and imagine I am actually seeing all the wonders out there.

I do think that unless we human colonize another planet, we are doomed as a species.  Whether it is asteroids or mega volcanoes or other natural phenomenons we do not yet know, something someday will hit us.  With multiple home-bases, human species has a better chance to survive.

We know, even if we are very very lucky and nothing hit us, the sun will go red-giant.  At that point, if we don't have a base as far out as perhaps Jupiter orbit, we are done.  But even before we go red-giant, Andromeda galaxy will be near.  Perhaps so near that...  Well, may be not yet, but it will.

Someday, if human lasts that long.  A person look out in the night sky, and sees this giant wheel of a galaxy covering half the night sky.  It would be quite a sight for this person.  Each day, Andromeda will be closer, more stars and more details will unveil themselves.  Scientist of that time will be treated with lots of new discoveries to be made.

Will us humans end up being consumed by the newly formed double-size super massive black hole in this new galaxy that was once our own?  Or will us human be watching as our solar system, cast away by the collision of two galaxies, be watching the show on the side and then die as our sun dies in the void of inter-galactic space without another star near by?

The wonders of the universe.  So many questions, so many wonders.

If "Q" should say to me: "I will give you three wishes..."  I would say, (1) Show me what happens to earth when we collide with Andromeda.  (2) Show me what happens as our sun dies.  (3) Take me back to present day, in my dying days, let me orbit each planet (in a safe capsule) for a few full orbits each, and then take me back to earth on my very last day.

Yes, well said. I don't see StarTrek as a TV drama, science fiction, morality play, but as a small window into the whatif and all the possibilities that could happen. The technology is dreamed up by humans, but we are limited as to what we can do only by our own imaginings and the writers, who most likely were not technical people, can spur the spirit of the imaginings into technical people who are able to to envision this insight and do something with it.

[tpowell1830]

Then, what human remaining will just rebuild.  In a million years or less, we would be a better civilization having learned from past mistake (I hope).

... or we will have Morlocks and Eloi.

Ha, The Time Machine, that is a good one. I like the 1960 movie version the best.

[tpowell1830]

Earth has a second moon? 

So what if we do?  What have we done with the first one lately?

Not yet. In 2049, we will find out that the moon is a big egg for a dragon like creature, it will hatch, and lay a new one.
http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/Kill_the_Moon_(TV_story)
Ok, I get out of here now...

Sweet, DR Who references welcomed here.

[tpowell1830]

I'm sure we'll blow ourselves up long, long before the sun burns out. We'll probably use up the dwindling resources we have fighting over control of what resources remain.

Give this a listen.

[Rick Law]

Then, what human remaining will just rebuild.  In a million years or less, we would be a better civilization having learned from past mistake (I hope).

... or we will have Morlocks and Eloi.

Ha, The Time Machine, that is a good one. I like the 1960 movie version the best.

re: "or we will have Morlocks and Eloi"

Brumby, I don't think we need to wait for the end of the world for good old fashioned cannibalism.  Recall  not more than a couple of weeks ago. a CNN reporter just got in trouble eating parts of a human brain.

_{http://www.telegraph.co.uk/tv/2017/03/10/backlash-cnn-reporter-eats-human-brain-tv-tasted-like-charcoal/}

Hey, hands off!  I am the reporter, I get the frontal lobe...  You are just a lowly intern, stick with brainstem.  May be next year after you get your promotion, you can try a little cerebellum...

re: "The Time Machine, that is a good one. I like the 1960 movie version the best."

Same here.  The original is the best.  Isn't it sad that so many of the remakes are so much worst than the original.  I am waiting for a remake of Aliens, hopefully, with someone other than Sigourney Weaver.  She was great in the original, but now she is closing in on 70.  I hate to see an old lady trying to chase an alien while on her wheel chair.

She stands shoulder to shoulder with Linda Hamilton (Terminator).  Both were great as a powerful action figure who can beat a strong guy to a pulp before lunch, yet at the same time both characters shown feminine qualities that were attractive.  Easy to do either, but hard to do both.

[Brumby]

Then, what human remaining will just rebuild.  In a million years or less, we would be a better civilization having learned from past mistake (I hope).

... or we will have Morlocks and Eloi.

Ha, The Time Machine, that is a good one. I like the 1960 movie version the best.

Same here.  Although the 2002 remake did have some good special effects, the original had a certain charm about it.

[timb]

If you think about it you would die when you were transported. The new teleported you woudnt know the difference but as soon as your brain is taken apart your consciousness would stop. Like if you transported to two places at once, you would be one of them but not the other one. You wouldn't be both you would be neither.They would be new beings created from the old one. To everyone else that would be you, but the real you's consciousness would die the moment you were taken apart.

According to the Galaxy Class Starship TRM, there are two types of transporters used:

1) Quantum Resolution Transporters: These image matter at the quantum level are used for for transporting people. Because the quantum state is imaged, consciousness is preserved.

2) Molecular Resolution Transporters: These are used primarily in the cargo bays, replicators and holodeck systems. They image at a molecular resolution. They're faster and less complex but don't have the precision for organic beings.

Of course accidents do happen, but it's rare! Like the time Riker's matter-energy beam was bounced back during transport, stranding a copy of himself on a planet for years. Now there's two Rikers walking around, which is bad news for Troi, and every woman on Risa!

Then the time Nelix and Tuvok beamed up with some flowers that reproduced by symbiosis. While in the matter stream their patterns merged, creating Tuvix (or Neevox, if you will).

Another time Kirk was split into two distinct personalities, one of which went around trying to rape anything that moved. (The other was a complete pussy.)

And let's not forget the time Picard, Ro, Guinnan and Keiko beamed back as children!

Oh, and who can forget the time Broccoli, err, Barclay was attacked by plasma microbes in the matter stream and thought he had transporter psychosis...

Come to think of it, Barclay was right, having your atoms ripped apart into kiloquads of data and scattered across space *is* dangerous!

[Ratch]

Hi All

I was a kid in the 1960s and watched the advent of space travel first hand.  I was so fascinated with science fiction and watched the TV series Star Trek as it originally aired. My thoughts at the time were of the future, and I realized that we were in the infancy of space travel, but, in my mind, I thought that by the turn of the century, when I turned 50, it would be so far advanced.

I envisioned that perhaps we would have at least completely explored the moon and commercial ships would be after ores and other wonderful things that we would discover there by the year 2000. I also thought that, surely with the efforts going on in the '60s that we would have explored some of our own solar system with manned expeditions. And, yes, I had hoped that we, as a people, would have discovered the secret of using anti-gravity.

Instead, we have smart phones, the internet and IoT. Not what I expected, but pretty dang cool.

Who is working on anti-gravity? Also, who will be the ones to set foot on Mars or one of the other planet's moons? Who will come up with a safe method for matter transportation?

"Science Fiction" is a misnomer.  If it were really science, it would not be fiction.  It should instead be called "False Physics Fantasy" (FPF).  Most science fiction movies and stories are really financial fiction, where untold amounts of money are available to build and crew ships the size of aircraft carriers. During these stories, the basic laws of physics are regularly and thoroughly raped and violated in order to provide any possible basis for a scenario to happen.

Some of these ideas are really mind masturbation exercises that have no basis in reality. 

A)  Time Travel--There is no proven basis for this to be possible.  I don't have to dwell on the contradictions that can occur if someone from the present changes the past, do I?

B)  Nullification of Mass Attraction (Anti-Gravity, Null-Gravity)--Attraction for itself is one of the most intrinsic characteristics of mass, and yet it is done casually and almost without thought in FPF.  One of the greatest particle physicists that ever lived, Richard Feynman, once said that he had no idea how it could be done.  If one could nullify the attraction of a large mass and lift it up to a considerable height, you would be storing a large amount of potential energy.  Since there is no free lunch in physics, one would have to supply the process with the amount of energy needed to lift the mass. 

C)  Simultaneous Mass Transport (Teleportation)--Mass disappears from one location and shows up elsewhere.  Mass is physically located in space.  It cannot just be gone from one location and later be created somewhere else.  Besides requiring an enormous amount of energy exchange, it violates the first law the thermodynamics (mass and energy cannot be created or destroyed).

D)  Faster than Light Travel (FLT)--Here is where FPF tries to break out of God's own quarantine.  Not much to say about this.  Einstein gave a very solid proof that accelerating any amount of mass to just the speed of light requires an infinite amount of energy.

E)  Vulcan Mind Melt (Telepathy, Telekinesis,Mind-Reading, Blah-Blah)--Despite extensive research and experiments, no credible, repeatable, rigorous, scientific evidence has been shown to exist for this phenomena.  Experimenters have worn out a lot of card decks trying to make it work.

F)  Evolution Revolution--Now we come to faith based belief which avers that certain constituents found in life, left to themselves, can self-organize to a simple life form.  And furthermore, change into a more complicated organism.  That takes faith beyond belief.  Things never go from simple to complex by themselves.  The universe is winding down. not building up.  This pseudo-science prevades most of the biological sciences.  Because of this biological outlook, I think that it is a possible reason that despite a funding 30 billion dollars over a period of 30 years during the Nixon Administration, no cancer cure has yet been found.

In conclusion, FPF is the creation of Hollywood and novelists for profit, not enlightenment.  Participate in it for entertainment, not inspiration.

Ratch       

[rrinker]

 But see they get around some of those by clever design.

 Take for example the Vulcan Mind Meld. OK, there is no scientific evidence for any sort of thing like this AMONG HUMANS, And in the Trek universe, humans don't have this ability. But Vulcans are not humans. Merely humanoid (and close enough that with some technological assistance, cross-fertile -  the possible explanation for that was in one of TOS episodes as well). Vulcans evolved separately, in a completely different environment. Humans may not have evolved telepathy, but who says some critters on some other planet did not?

 All in all it just seems more plausible than some story where a few humans have capabilities unexplainable by any science.

[Ratch]

But see they get around some of those by clever design.

 Take for example the Vulcan Mind Meld. OK, there is no scientific evidence for any sort of thing like this AMONG HUMANS, And in the Trek universe, humans don't have this ability. But Vulcans are not humans. Merely humanoid (and close enough that with some technological assistance, cross-fertile -  the possible explanation for that was in one of TOS episodes as well). Vulcans evolved separately, in a completely different environment. Humans may not have evolved telepathy, but who says some critters on some other planet did not?

 All in all it just seems more plausible than some story where a few humans have capabilities unexplainable by any science.

Did you read my point "F" in the above post?  Unless you can show evolution to be viable, it should not be considered an explanation for anything.

Ratch

[james_s]

Show evolution to be viable? Evolution is no more controversial than gravity or chemistry. It has been shown to be viable decades ago, there is no controversy. One can watch it happen even within the tiny period of a human lifespan which is a microscopic spec on the time scale of millions or billions of years.

[Ratch]

Show evolution to be viable? Evolution is no more controversial than gravity or chemistry. It has been shown to be viable decades ago, there is no controversy. One can watch it happen even within the tiny period of a human lifespan which is a microscopic spec on the time scale of millions or billions of years.

No, evolution has been accepted and declared to be viable.  Proof is lacking.  Show me an example, and explain how how something complex comes from something simple by itself with no help or guidance from a cognizant entity.

Ratch