I despise the modern phones and internet

[Kasper]

Before smart phones, sitting for 1 hour would be painfully boring.

Why, you could read a book to pass the time.

I've never liked books.

Were I snarky, I would quote the (spurious) statement of Mark Twain:  "He who will not read has no advantage over he who cannot read."
I always carry a paperback whenever I expect to need time passing.  Recently, I'm working through the new translations of Simenon's Maigret novels.
My acquaintance with modern and classical Japanese literature stems from a reasonable bookstore at Narita airport, and a dread of 13 hours with nothing but the airline magazine and bad movies.

If you were really snarky, you'd say, 'it shows', or 'I can tell'.

Then I'd reply, I'm actually allergic to books.  Eventually it'd come out that reading gives me headaches.  Particularly from books where I must pick out a word from a large block of words.  On a screen, I can dim the background and words are usually more spread out. 

This is part of why I opted for college before I eventually ended up in uni and why I opt for PCB/mech drafting over writing code.

[Kasper]

Before smart phones, sitting for 1 hour would be painfully boring.

Why, you could read a book to pass the time.

I've never liked books.

That is so sad...

A lifetime of headaches is sad.  I've missed out in some things because of it but over the decades I have been finding the causes and solving them and that is um... what's the word for the opposite of sad?  Hm.. if only I read books, I might know it.  lol.

[thm_w]

I agree.  I also hate how everything seems to revolve around needing a smartphone now too.

Yes, I recently went to a concert, paid through Ticketmaster.  The ONLY way to get in is with a smartphone, has to be either Ios or Android.  Last time I was able to print tickets from my computer, but no longer allowed.  I don't have either of these types of phones, so I had to use my wife's phone, download their app and use it to display the barcode at the door.  Massive annoyance to have to type in username and password at the door, too.
Jon

I get that ticketmaster is terrible.
But, if the purpose of the app was to display a barcode, you could have screenshot the barcode then print that out, no? Or would it not show you the barcode ahead of time.

Then I'd reply, I'm actually allergic to books.  Eventually it'd come out that reading gives me headaches.  Particularly from books where I must pick out a word from a large block of words.  On a screen, I can dim the background and words are usually more spread out. 

Interesting, I assume you've had eye exams and nothing is unusual there?

[Kasper]

I agree.  I also hate how everything seems to revolve around needing a smartphone now too.

Yes, I recently went to a concert, paid through Ticketmaster.  The ONLY way to get in is with a smartphone, has to be either Ios or Android.  Last time I was able to print tickets from my computer, but no longer allowed.  I don't have either of these types of phones, so I had to use my wife's phone, download their app and use it to display the barcode at the door.  Massive annoyance to have to type in username and password at the door, too.
Jon

I get that ticketmaster is terrible.
But, if the purpose of the app was to display a barcode, you could have screenshot the barcode then print that out, no? Or would it not show you the barcode ahead of time.

Then I'd reply, I'm actually allergic to books.  Eventually it'd come out that reading gives me headaches.  Particularly from books where I must pick out a word from a large block of words.  On a screen, I can dim the background and words are usually more spread out. 

Interesting, I assume you've had eye exams and nothing is unusual there?

I'm guessing the purpose of the app was to stop people from printing out and selling 20 copies of 1 ticket.  Not sure how they stop people from doing a similar crime with screenshots in their phones.  This is of course aside from the bunch of other reasons big business wants their app in your phone.

Yes, I've had eye exams, probably should have had more attention or at least requested more attention to sort this out decades ago but my attempts never seemed to yield any results.  I've found getting fresh air, exercise and eating healthy help more than any healthcare professional have.  An office career was probably not the smartest choice for me.

[eti]

Before smart phones, sitting for 1 hour would be painfully boring.

Why, you could read a book to pass the time.

Exactly. And it’s a calming experience.

[TimFox]

I get that ticketmaster is terrible.
But, if the purpose of the app was to display a barcode, you could have screenshot the barcode then print that out, no? Or would it not show you the barcode ahead of time.

I'm guessing the purpose of the app was to stop people from printing out and selling 20 copies of 1 ticket.  Not sure how they stop people from doing a similar crime with screenshots in their phones.  This is of course aside from the bunch of other reasons big business wants their app in your phone.

[/quote]

Printed from home tickets:  at venues here in Chicago, they scan the QR code when you enter.  Due to a mixup once, I got scanned twice and the scanning app was smart enough to report that it had already been scanned.

[Kasper]

Printed from home tickets:  at venues here in Chicago, they scan the QR code when you enter.  Due to a mixup once, I got scanned twice and the scanning app was smart enough to report that it had already been scanned.

That doesn't stop someone from selling 20 copies of 1 ticket.  Just stops their victims from getting to use their fake tickets.

[james_s]

Printed from home tickets:  at venues here in Chicago, they scan the QR code when you enter.  Due to a mixup once, I got scanned twice and the scanning app was smart enough to report that it had already been scanned.

That doesn't stop someone from selling 20 copies of 1 ticket.  Just stops their victims from getting to use their fake tickets.

It doesn't stop anything. Print at home tickets are already uniquely coded, once it has been scanned any other copies of the same code are void.

[jmelson]

I get that ticketmaster is terrible.
But, if the purpose of the app was to display a barcode, you could have screenshot the barcode then print that out, no? Or would it not show you the barcode ahead of time.

No, apparently they regenerate the bar codes every 5 minutes, and only the freshest ones will be accepted at the door.  Somehow, this defeats counterfeiting of tickets.  I guess the problem was that the person who copied a ticket would get to the door before the legitimate purchaser.
It just mekes everything more complicated.
Jon

[thm_w]

Yes, I've had eye exams, probably should have had more attention or at least requested more attention to sort this out decades ago but my attempts never seemed to yield any results.  I've found getting fresh air, exercise and eating healthy help more than any healthcare professional have.  An office career was probably not the smartest choice for me.

OK and if you get fresh air, exercise, eat healthy, THEN read a book for 30min, you'd still get the same headache?

No, apparently they regenerate the bar codes every 5 minutes, and only the freshest ones will be accepted at the door.  Somehow, this defeats counterfeiting of tickets.  I guess the problem was that the person who copied a ticket would get to the door before the legitimate purchaser.
It just mekes everything more complicated.
Jon

Yeah completely agreed that is dumb then. Although if cell phones didn't exist they'd probably find some equally stupid solution to the "problem" that they don't get a cut of ticket resales.

[Red Squirrel]

I agree.  I also hate how everything seems to revolve around needing a smartphone now too.  I see a lot of basic things like security cameras and even internet routers that require an app just to configure it.  Of course you also need to setup an account and all that BS.  Pisses me off so much, it doesn't have to be that way at all.  It would be possible to have smart phones without all the strings attached but then they couldn't sell our info!  It's all about spying on us at the end of the day.  That, and planned obsolescence. They can render your product obsolete by simply ceasing to update the app.   You'll own nothing and you'll be happy.

Old school wired cameras still exist, and they can be set up on the device themselves (hikvision, dahua, etc.).
Routers, maybe some cheap ones? Any major brand should have a standard web interface.

Sure but they are getting harder and harder to find so when you search 90% of results are now is this app/cloud stuff you have to filter through, and often you don't find out you need an app until after you already bought it.   I was looking at a Trendnet one that looked promising and was available here in Canada, only to read the doc and find out you need an app.   I'm in Canada so it's even harder to get stuff here as we just don't have as good of an online retail selection as the states does so it's slim pickings for everything.  Have not been able to find a place that sells Hikvision for example as they do have good reviews.   I know there's Amazon but lot of fakes/hacked ones on there so I tend to avoid Amazon for stuff like that. 

Routers are a new one to me but I did run into that and I fear it will become a trend too, was setting up internet for someone and that ISP's setup was super proprietary and you had to download and use an app just to configure the modem/router.    I run a custom rom on my phone so couldn't do it so had to use the customer's phone.  Super annoying that they just assume everyone has a regular phone. Not to mention how you're stuck relying on highly proprietary software/environment and your whole setup could be rendered obsolete if they stop updating it when you get a new phone.

Drones, action cameras etc are bad too.   It seems to be a trend with so many devices now.

[Red Squirrel]

(my first quote messed up and it reverts back when I edit, trying again here)

I agree.  I also hate how everything seems to revolve around needing a smartphone now too.  I see a lot of basic things like security cameras and even internet routers that require an app just to configure it.  Of course you also need to setup an account and all that BS.  Pisses me off so much, it doesn't have to be that way at all.  It would be possible to have smart phones without all the strings attached but then they couldn't sell our info!  It's all about spying on us at the end of the day.  That, and planned obsolescence. They can render your product obsolete by simply ceasing to update the app.   You'll own nothing and you'll be happy.

Old school wired cameras still exist, and they can be set up on the device themselves (hikvision, dahua, etc.).
Routers, maybe some cheap ones? Any major brand should have a standard web interface.

Sure but they are getting harder and harder to find so when you search 90% of results are now is this app/cloud stuff you have to filter through, and often you don't find out you need an app until after you already bought it.   I was looking at a Trendnet one that looked promising and was available here in Canada, only to read the doc and find out you need an app.   I'm in Canada so it's even harder to get stuff here as we just don't have as good of an online retail selection as the states does so it's slim pickings for everything.  Have not been able to find a place that sells Hikvision for example as they do have good reviews.   I know there's Amazon but lot of fakes/hacked ones on there so I tend to avoid Amazon for stuff like that. 

Routers are a new one to me but I did run into that and I fear it will become a trend too, was setting up internet for someone and that ISP's setup was super proprietary and you had to download and use an app just to configure the modem/router.    I run a custom rom on my phone so couldn't do it so had to use the customer's phone.  Super annoying that they just assume everyone has a regular phone. Not to mention how you're stuck relying on highly proprietary software/environment and your whole setup could be rendered obsolete if they stop updating it when you get a new phone.

Drones, action cameras etc are bad too.   It seems to be a trend with so many devices now.

[Kasper]

OK and if you get fresh air, exercise, eat healthy, THEN read a book for 30min, you'd still get the same headache?

If I do all that, I treat myself with beer not books

Aside from a few migraines, it's not boolean.  The more healthy choices I make, the better I feel and vica versa.  Generally, as soon as I look at a page full of words, I start feeling it.

I guess I developed a distaste for books in school and I've never found a reason to challenge it.  Datasheets, forums and news is enough reading for me and I prefer to read all 3 on my phone. 

[eti]

OK and if you get fresh air, exercise, eat healthy, THEN read a book for 30min, you'd still get the same headache?

If I do all that, I treat myself with beer not books

Aside from a few migraines, it's not boolean.  The more healthy choices I make, the better I feel and vica versa.  Generally, as soon as I look at a page full of words, I start feeling it.

How does one develop a "distaste" for books? They're paper with words on - words are words, and the paper is LESS harmful to your eyes than a backlit screen is. I am not disputing that you do not like them, it just doesn't seem to make a lot of sense in my humble opinion, but then it makes sense to you, and you're the one who knows what it means to you, which is what matters; so if you could explain a little more, maybe we could help

I guess I developed a distaste for books in school and I've never found a reason to challenge it.  Datasheets, forums and news is enough reading for me and I prefer to read all 3 on my phone.

You realise that staring at a backlit screen for hours, causes significantly greater eye strain than a piece of paper lit with ambient or directed, front light? You are literally shining white LEDs into your eyes; no wonder you get headaches!

[Kasper]

OK and if you get fresh air, exercise, eat healthy, THEN read a book for 30min, you'd still get the same headache?

If I do all that, I treat myself with beer not books

Aside from a few migraines, it's not boolean.  The more healthy choices I make, the better I feel and vica versa.  Generally, as soon as I look at a page full of words, I start feeling it.

I guess I developed a distaste for books in school and I've never found a reason to challenge it.  Datasheets, forums and news is enough reading for me and I prefer to read all 3 on my phone.

You realise that staring at a backlit screen for hours, causes significantly greater eye strain than a piece of paper lit with ambient or directed, front light? You are literally shining white LEDs into your eyes; no wonder you get headaches!

I've had headaches since before phones had screens.  For me, the most bothersome part of reading is picking words out from a large block of text.  Books have that, phones, not so much.

I adjust the backlight often.  Usually between dim and very dim, unless there is bright ambient light.

Funny coincidence, I just saw an article about people shining green lights into eyes to reduce chronic pain, including headaches.  Seems counter intuitive to me.

[Kasper]

Besides that, it's pretty tough to get datasheets, forums or news on paper.  So the choice is between phone and computer monitor.  Both of which have dimmed backlights.

[magic]

I really don't mind technology. I would gladly buy a pocketable computer myself, if such things actually were available that weren't a hopeless pile of disposable consumer stinking rubbish.

Pic below is where it all went downhill. In retrospect, it was probably predictable

[Kalvin]

Straight from ChatGPT, when I asked it to write a comforting reply to a person who says "I despise the modern phones and internet":

It's completely understandable to feel overwhelmed by technology at times. The constant stream of information and notifications can be exhausting, and it's important to take breaks and set boundaries for ourselves.

If you're feeling overwhelmed by your phone and the internet, you could try setting limits on your usage, taking breaks throughout the day to disconnect, or finding ways to use technology in a way that feels more manageable and positive for you.

It's also important to remember that technology is a tool, and it's up to us to use it in a way that serves us, rather than letting it control us.

If you're finding that your phone and the internet are causing more stress than they're worth, it might be helpful to explore other ways to stay connected with the world and the people you care about. It's okay to take a step back and find a balance that works for you.

[pcprogrammer]

Straight from ChatGPT, when I asked it to write a comforting reply to a person who says "I despise the modern phones and internet":

That proves it, the internet is very wise. 

[tooki]

You realise that staring at a backlit screen for hours, causes significantly greater eye strain than a piece of paper lit with ambient or directed, front light? You are literally shining white LEDs into your eyes; no wonder you get headaches!

A photon is a photon, regardless of its source. (At least in the context of incoherent light, that is, not lasers.)

There is no evidence to support a backlight per se being a source of eye strain. What we know does cause issues is poor contrast, flicker, blurriness, and slow refresh rates. A well designed screen with non-flickering backlight and very high resolution solve those issues.

In contrast, people frequently read books with far too little light, and that is known to cause eye strain because it makes focusing difficult.

I think a problem is that people don’t adjust screen brightness appropriately, so that it’s not blindingly bright in a dim room.

What we do know is that when reading on screens, people tend to blink less frequently than when reading on paper. That is something one can try to actively counteract, of course.

[tooki]

I've found that LED lights give me eye strain/pain and trigger migraines. Reading a book underneath them is a 100% sure way to trigger a migraine and cause eye strain/eye pain. I use CFL and only CFL in rooms such as bedrooms, living rooms, anywhere where I spend a long amount of time.

I used to use Incandescent to get by but I've found a happy medium with CFL.

That doesn’t make sense, at least as a blanket statement.

LEDs vary in design and quality, both regarding color quality (color rendering index), where most CFLs are quite bad, cheap LEDs are bad, and good LEDs are excellent, though not exactly as good as incandescent; flicker; diffusion; etc.

Some LED bulbs produce flickery light (at 50/60 or 100/120Hz), and that could cause issues, but most do not.

Some LEDs are closer to point light sources, which can be annoying if pointed at you, or produce lots of sharp shadows. Fluorescent inherently produces a much more diffused light. But you can also get LED lighting that is just as diffuse.

In short: you may want to give LED more chances. Cause the best out there now can easily be mistaken for incandescent, they’re that good.

[Black Phoenix]

I've found that LED lights give me eye strain/pain and trigger migraines. Reading a book underneath them is a 100% sure way to trigger a migraine and cause eye strain/eye pain. I use CFL and only CFL in rooms such as bedrooms, living rooms, anywhere where I spend a long amount of time.

I used to use Incandescent to get by but I've found a happy medium with CFL.

That doesn’t make sense, at least as a blanket statement.

LEDs vary in design and quality, both regarding color quality (color rendering index), where most CFLs are quite bad, cheap LEDs are bad, and good LEDs are excellent, though not exactly as good as incandescent; flicker; diffusion; etc.

Some LED bulbs produce flickery light (at 50/60 or 100/120Hz), and that could cause issues, but most do not.

Some LEDs are closer to point light sources, which can be annoying if pointed at you, or produce lots of sharp shadows. Fluorescent inherently produces a much more diffused light. But you can also get LED lighting that is just as diffuse.

In short: you may want to give LED more chances. Cause the best out there now can easily be mistaken for incandescent, they’re that good.

Totally agree, got some Phillips LED light fixtures for my home this 11/11. 6500K type, 11W for corridors and a 24W for the living room and as cool daylight they have absolutely no whiteish blue hue as normal 6500K white bulbs have (and I hate).

[MrMobodies]

I was given a Samsung J5 with an old copy of Android Marshmallow where I disabled most of the animations that would irritate and annoy me.

I don't use it for the browsers, only for making calls, taking pictures, writing a few notes (with some tools I found that were free and not ad paid for)

Now the for pictures I found this tool but had to patch the bootloader to make it work,
https://apkfab.com/samba-filesharing-for-android/com.funkyfresh.samba

It was built for phones with extra buttons but the J5 only has 3. I found by depressing the two excluding the middle brings up the menu but have to keep holding down then use another finger to select then it will open the settings but after letting go it will go to a screen to select open programs and I'd just reselect.

So I when I take pictures, turn on the wifi, open a shortcut and copy it over but on a newer Sony phone with Lineage missing those buttons no chance to access the menu but I got it working in a way that it is useful without many of the animations, suggestions and predictive word stuff. I do see a few dimming overlays that I can't turn off like when adjusting the brightness which I find stupid because it darkens background more that I am trying to get the measure of behind the brightness slider.

There was this touch overflow overscroll thing I can't remember the setting name of it now that I was able to turn off in Android Marshmallow but still appears in Android 9:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/dodgy-technology/dimming-madness-with-chrome-and-mobiles/msg3580326/#msg3580326

and an increase with these things but darker that hurt my eyes when most of the screen/background flips from light to dark to light excessively:



That's some of the reasons I despise them when animations/decoration(excessive dimming/flashing) that interfere causes me discomfort to my eyes that I can' turn off. Before I installed Linageos on this Sony phone the stock firmware had this screen that use to suddenly appear with gestures I couldn't turn off and a version of Microsoft swiftkey that had no setting to turn off suggestions, spell checker, predictive stuff and in settings just something about collecting the words I type and sending it to Microsoft labs for analysis... what an insult and they won't allow me to free up room on the keyboard with things I don't want or need. I found I couldn't install the original Android keyboard that I know have settings to disable that stuff so that's when I found Lineage but still many animations I find I can't turn off.

I have seen someone's new Android phone some months ago just setting up the wifi details and noticed the brightness adjust no longer dims as I was adjusting it to low.

Still seems to be an issue:
https://support.google.com/pixelphone/thread/132936922/how-to-turn-of-android-12-overscroll

Edward van Raak Mar 25, 2022
This isn't only messing with people eyes. While the screen is in this bouncing animation clicks aren't registered. This is incredibly annoying if you flick a page up and then quickly select a radio button, or text or list item or whatever.

However came up with this idea at Google probably is causing millions upon millions of unnecessary clicks around the world each day. And nobody is outraged.

Or maybe this is just my OEM, but still, WTF!

User 495737937406355213 Apr 26, 2022

The overscroll effect is awful, and makes me dizzy every time I see it! I've disabled  animations to get rid of it, but that causes problems in various apps. Please, please make it possible to turn off the overscroll effect.

User 2013977589997406614 May 8, 2022

This makes me feel literally sick as well, who could think it was a good idea?

I wonder about the amount of work that may into this sort of stuff:
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/39277258/overscroll-glow-not-working-on-scrollable-div-in-webview

Overscroll 'glow' not working on scrollable div (in webview)?
Asked 6 years, 3 months ago Modified 6 years, 3 months ago Viewed 958 times

* I'm having some issues getting the 'overscroll glow' to work on a scrollable div. ** The first problem is finding answers or documentation on this because this thing has a lot of names, I'm not entirely sure what the correct term is and most of them I tried confuse google (i get a lot of results for 'overflow:auto;' etc). So for clarity, here's an image of the effect I'm looking for:


I'm having some issues getting the 'overscroll glow' to work on a scrollable div.

The first problem is finding answers or documentation on this because this thing has a lot of names, I'm not entirely sure what the correct term is and most of them I tried confuse google (i get a lot of results for 'overflow:auto;' etc). So for clarity, here's an image of the effect I'm looking for:

*look, it's overscroll glow!

Anyway, my problem is this: I did have this effect when my html/body elements were scrollable but when I moved things to divs (in this case the .content element), it stopped working.

Something like this:

html, body {
    overflow: hidden;
    width:100%;
    height:100%;
    margin:0;
    padding:0;
}

.appbar {
    position: absolute;
    top:0; left:0; right:0;
    height:56px;
    background-color:#ccc;
}

.content {
    position: absolute;
    top:56px; left:0; right:0; bottom:0;
    overflow-x:hidden;
    overflow-y:auto;
    -webkit-overflow-scrolling: touch;
}

.make-it-scrollable {
    height:200%;
}

<body>
<div class="appbar"></div>
<div class="content">
    <div class="make-it-scrollable"></div>
</div>
</body>
On iOS I get the elastic 'rubber banding' effect when I try to scroll past the content (thanks to the -webkit-overflow-scrolling) but on Android I get nothing.

Is this by design? (meaning: is the overscroll effect disabled or 'not implemented' for divs with overflow:x?

Or am I missing something?

Oh btw I'm testing this on Android 5.1 with the latest Chromium based webview (it's a cordova app)

Yes, what good does that do to the user?
Nothing
What benefit does it to provide to them?
None
How does this make the content any clearer?
Interferes and obscures whatever it is covering up
What if the user doesn't want to see this crap?
What about those with light sensitivity?
Tough luck

*"He's having issues" implementing it but what about those it annoys and suffer from it.
** "The first problem" was not a problem before where when it could be switched off pretty much everywhere but now developers like this one are looking to override it and force everyone to see their effect in everything they can for the sake of it like that is more important than everything else.

It seems to me like they are create to make work for themselves by creating problems that were not problems before.

[PlainName]

There is no evidence to support a backlight per se being a source of eye strain. What we know does cause issues is poor contrast, flicker, blurriness, and slow refresh rates. A well designed screen with non-flickering backlight and very high resolution solve those issues.

I used to get headaches quite often when using my PC a lot. It wasn't the screen but me: as I tired I'd lean forward on the desk and get eyestrain from trying to focus too close. Once I figured that out I took care not to try and read things I can't really focus on (particularly my phone - damn, my glasses are in my pocket but just answering this text quickly won't hurt), and now it's rare that I get headaches.

I wonder if the high resolution screens make things worse, in that they tempt you to look at smaller things that you should be comfortable with. They sure look good, but you have to focus better. A book tends to be lower resolution (even though it's printed at 600dpi or whatever, the text is low-res), whereas a computer screen has many tiny things to attract your eye.

[james_s]

I get headaches from flicker, I've never had a problem with high res or small things though. Some monitors have PWM backlighting that flickers.