IMPORTANT POLL: New Forum Categories / Reorg

[tggzzz]

Having too many categories brings just as many problems as too few categories.
The major issue is that many posts span several categories, in which case it is difficult to decide where to put a post.
A trivial example: if I, as an RF beginner, think there might be something wrong with my spectrum analyser, should I post a question in "RF/Ham", "test equipment", "repair", "beginner". All that categories do is enable you to know where something isn't, e.g. Jobs or PCB etc.

The answer is there is no no answer, it's impossible to cater for every scenario.
What seems to be the consensus is that a few more categories would be helpful, as would a reorg.

Just so, and that's what I voted for.

Where categorisation/filing systems are concerned, my experience matches that of RW Jones, the head of British Scientific Intelligence during the war. He tried several methods of organising all the info that came across his desk and that he had to assess and present to Churchill. He just had a large number of box files in a few categories, and when he needed to go back to something he quickly searched throught them. Too many "categories" meant there were too many places where the info might be.

BTW Jones' book "Most Secret War" is still fascinating. When it was first published, eminent historians accurately said it "rewrote" the history of WW2.

[Rick Law]

What would improve the new visitors' visiting experience, and encourage new visitors' re-visit would probably be an ability to have sub-threads.  Under the UT61E thread, there may be a sub-thread on back-light mod, another sub-thread on the UT61E calibration, another sub-thread on external voltage reference...

Not possible with this forum software.
And it would be a dog to maintain, and people would have to vigilant about sticking to it. That won't ever happen.

Forums are not wikipedia information resourses, they are as their name suggests, forum where people discus stuff.

You have a point, but too bad.  I think that will attract more newbies.

It must have taken me the first few months to "stick with it" and finish those extra-long threads.  The rigol thread, the owon scope thread, the UT61E thread...  I think a lot of newbies may not "stick with it" as long.  It would be their lost.

Then again, may be I am under-estimating their level of interest and their tenaciousness.

[EEVblog]

You have a point, but too bad.  I think that will attract more newbies.

Yes, but then it's no longer a forum, and people would stop using it as such.
You can't have a discussion forum and a wiki like information repository in the same place, it's just not possible.

[Syntax_Error]

I could take or leave a big reorg, but some new forums or subforums would be nice. I strongly agree with the notion for an RF forum. Originally, I was going to suggest a (likely to be shot down) idea of a amateur radio related forum, but the much wider scope of RF in general is far superior, as the only reason I was suggesting the ham room was for *technical* discussion, not operating discussion.

Also, currently the PCB forums are all software-package related, which makes sense, but what about general discussions of design rules, practices, board manufacturing details such as material, clearances, impedance issues, etc? These things are not software specific, and a lot of the threads to date about these things are scattered throughout beginners, projects, and other forums.

[Rick Law]

You have a point, but too bad.  I think that will attract more newbies.

Yes, but then it's no longer a forum, and people would stop using it as such.
You can't have a discussion forum and a wiki like information repository in the same place, it's just not possible.

Dave, no argument about forum vs expository.  Suggestion: perhaps you should consider starting a knowledge repository also.  With the reputation of EEVBLOG, people can use the knowledge with more confidence!

It is like selling coffee with the donut.  It is a natural.  People come here to yap about EE stuff, and to find solutions. 

(I think with this, I've said all I should.  Otherwise, it seems to argumentative.)

[EEVblog]

Dave, no argument about forum vs expository.  Suggestion: perhaps you should consider starting a knowledge repository also.  With the reputation of EEVBLOG, people can use the knowledge with more confidence!

There already is an EEVblog Wiki, but few bothered to edit it.

[Richard Crowley]

There already is an EEVblog Wiki, but few bothered to edit it.

It would be great to have a running summary/ranking of test gear that have been reviewed/torn-down.
Top 10 lists for
Meters (Premium/Midrange/Budget)
Osciloscopes (Premium/Midrange/Budget)
Bench Power Supplies
Signal Generators
etc...

I would be satisfied by keeping it simple with Dave's subjective ranking
vs. some sort of comprehensive, statistically-complex rating system.

[MT]

It was not the organization.  I manage to find the categories just fine.  The biggest trouble I got was
some threads were so long it appears a daunting tasks to read just the thread - just one thread.

As an old timer on the net (fairly) and newbie to various forums long threads is the worst. Some forums i frequent have
over 1000 responses in a thread, it's impossible to read those threads to try find single info that's relevant, other forums
with similar lengthy threads the forum owners have a length limit and when reached starts "part 2" of the discussion in
a new thread and so on. still the same discussion just chopped up in parts but way easier to read and follow.

[EEVblog]

As an old timer on the net (fairly) and newbie to various forums long threads is the worst. Some forums i frequent have
over 1000 responses in a thread, it's impossible to read those threads to try find single info that's relevant, other forums
with similar lengthy threads the forum owners have a length limit and when reached starts "part 2" of the discussion in
a new thread and so on. still the same discussion just chopped up in parts but way easier to read and follow.

I fail to see how it's easier to read 1000 post in 1 thread, or 100 posts in 10 different threads.
Splitting them does not magically categorise them, you still might have to look through all 1000 posts to find what you want.

Having said that can we please keep this thread to suggestion for new categories and organisation. No new add-on or custom code requests etc.

[MT]

I fail to see how it's easier to read 1000 post in 1 thread, or 100 posts in 10 different threads.
Splitting them does not magically categorise them, you still might have to look through all 1000 posts to find what you want.

Didn't say anything about any kind of magically categorizing, it's about visibility and saving time/efforts.
When you read Horowitz Hill do you read the entire book over and over or frequent parts over and over
to look for info, relevant info tend to span several posts but not entire threads of 1000 posts.
Well, it was just a suggestion.

[SL4P]

How about a completely irreverent, but serious thread to discuss ridiculous overkill projects...
e.g. a repurposed PDP-11 to blink Christmas lights etc.

Maybe some extensive solution to notify when the kitty litter gets a workout...
The good old days when your Arduino tweeted every sheet rolled of the toilet paper...

[obiwanjacobi]

Does it matter? No really. I see posts in the wrong place all the time. I also see member veer off topic as if there is no tomorrow. So if there is no admin/moderator to keep the members from making a mess, it does not matter at all what you call the categories or how many you have.

Instead I would opt for a better search function. At least then we're better able to find stuff again.

[2c]

[EEVblog]

Didn't say anything about any kind of magically categorizing, it's about visibility and saving time/efforts.
When you read Horowitz Hill do you read the entire book over and over or frequent parts over and over
to look for info, relevant info tend to span several posts but not entire threads of 1000 posts.

But that's the thing, this is a discussion forum not a book where things are discussed in order. Multiple different conversions along different tangents between dozens of people can be going on at once and interleaved all in the one thread. That's just the nature of discussion forums.
Occasionally we'll split out threads to a new topic if they warrant it and it makes sense to do so, but it's not often.
Bottom line is you can't take a 1000 post thread and chop it up, it ads absolutely no value in doing so, unless you sort and categorise the posts and split them out in meaningful ways.

[Brumby]

... and then you have posts that straddle two or more ideas/discussions that only make sense in the original context.

[MT]

author=EEVblog link=topic=60467.msg831424#msg831424 date=1451374871]
But that's the thing, this is a discussion forum not a book where things are discussed in order. Multiple different conversions along different tangents between dozens of people can be going on at once and interleaved all in the one thread. That's just the nature of discussion forums.

You seams a little bit annoyed this issue was brought up!
The book was "analogy" in terms of searching "INFO" not a s a definitive structure as such, i'm glad books is not made in the form
of certain forum formats.
But again i didn't say anything about the "nature of discussions forums", there are many forms, i'm well aware of how topic threads
turns all non/topic ways and back, i.e i was once moderated for not following your here proposed "natural way of forum discussions"!
What about that!

Bottom line is Dave, what do we use forums for? Well exchange of INFO i imagine, what else?

Occasionally we'll split out threads to a new topic if they warrant it and it makes sense to do so, but it's not often.

See, you do it so maybe you should do it more often? Btw i'm NOT talking about split long threads into "new topic's", read again
what i said. I'm also not talking about sub categories as suggested by Rick law.

Bottom line is you can't take a 1000 post thread and chop it up, it ads absolutely no value in
doing so, unless you sort and categorise the posts and split them out in meaningful ways.

Evidence are on the net multi-fold, whether you like it or not it do work fine and has a value. But that was not what i said, i said "thread
length limits" your against a post actions i'm talking about a pre actions.  You are 30 years old or something im 89 well go figure if i have
time to wade trough you 1000 post threads for info that's in 5 or 6 posts! Maybe you have to get into my age until you understand fully!
I also have parkinsson, it's hell to solder anything smaller then 0402 but i'm one hell of improvised jazz drummer!

unless you sort and categorise the posts and split them out in meaningful ways.

Doing that you will destroy the topic entirely. Dont see the point.

Yet you do run into having too many categories brings just as many problems as too few categories.And another big
problem are when many posts span several categories, in which case it is difficult to decide where to put a post.

But its your forum i cant tell you what to do!Only suggest!

[Dave]

+1 for the RF section.
Name it "RF Voodoo".

[tautech]

Dave, don't do anything too rash like the plonkers here did over the last couple of days:
http://forum.accurateshooter.com/

That forum was down for 24+ hrs and still not right.

They had a perfectly good SMF forum much like yours and nuked it for the POS they have now.
Avatars gone, User names reverted to actual names  , post #'s gone, a lottery if you quote a post if it comes out right....
A right proper mess.

[miguelvp]

Dave, don't do anything too rash like the plonkers here did over the last couple of days:
http://forum.accurateshooter.com/

That forum was down for 24+ hrs and still not right.

They had a perfectly good SMF forum much like yours and nuked it for the POS they have now.
Avatars gone, User names reverted to actual names  , post #'s gone, a lottery if you quote a post if it comes out right....
A right proper mess.

Hmm, you a bench rest aficionado?

I did work on this simulation
http://www.amazon.com/Xtreme-Accuracy-Shooting-PC/dp/B0002LDGKS

Pretty bad reviews from gaming sites, but it was never intended to be a game

It does cover all the aspects about the sport. Was done with Hall of Famer Speedy Gonzalez
http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/lid=12950/guntechdetail/Benchrest_Shooting
and Hall of Famer Tony Boyer
http://www.rifleaccuracybook.com/

Alas apparently it doesn't work on Windows 7 or higher although I'm pretty sure I did run it on Windows 7, hmm. But it's pretty old and dated but we did pretty good among that small community.

Did also a high power rifle simulation.

Research was fun

[tautech]

Dave, don't do anything too rash like the plonkers here did over the last couple of days:
http://forum.accurateshooter.com/

That forum was down for 24+ hrs and still not right.

They had a perfectly good SMF forum much like yours and nuked it for the POS they have now.
Avatars gone, User names reverted to actual names  , post #'s gone, a lottery if you quote a post if it comes out right....
A right proper mess.

Hmm, you a bench rest aficionado?

Not really are you?

Homerange is my login there, check out my introduction post
Shooting sports in general have been part of my life for 40+ years, much less game these days now mainly paper punching or clay targets.
Reloading is a strong interest.

[miguelvp]

Dave, don't do anything too rash like the plonkers here did over the last couple of days:
http://forum.accurateshooter.com/

That forum was down for 24+ hrs and still not right.

They had a perfectly good SMF forum much like yours and nuked it for the POS they have now.
Avatars gone, User names reverted to actual names  , post #'s gone, a lottery if you quote a post if it comes out right....
A right proper mess.

Hmm, you a bench rest aficionado?

Not really are you?

Homerange is my login there, check out my introduction post
Shooting sports in general have been part of my life for 40+ years, much less game these days now mainly paper punching or clay targets.
Reloading is a strong interest.

Not anymore, I did dable when I was doing those simulations, I actually got pretty good groupings all connected at 200 Yards on windy days.

On reloading, the most important thing is to do your ammo at the same time. The differences in weather while reloading makes your ammo behave differently.
I'll try to upload the manual somewhere because it's bigger than the 1MB limit. (5MB total)

I did upload the manual to a website I have, although I did put it on the seek thermal camera folder I created for Mike a while back.

http://www.miguelvp.com/ForMike/XAS/Manual/Manual.htm

Hopefully this is helpful for reloading, I don't take credit for the manual I just did the full game engine but we had an engineer (works for NASA) that did all the physics and math behind it all.
So it's terse but definitely accurate.

I might find the High Power Rifle manual too, but for reloading it's about the same thing.

Edit: the Installation and setup links seem to be broken, the rest seems to be complete.

[tautech]

Dave, don't do anything too rash like the plonkers here did over the last couple of days:
http://forum.accurateshooter.com/

That forum was down for 24+ hrs and still not right.

They had a perfectly good SMF forum much like yours and nuked it for the POS they have now.
Avatars gone, User names reverted to actual names  , post #'s gone, a lottery if you quote a post if it comes out right....
A right proper mess.

Hmm, you a bench rest aficionado?

Not really are you?

Homerange is my login there, check out my introduction post
Shooting sports in general have been part of my life for 40+ years, much less game these days now mainly paper punching or clay targets.
Reloading is a strong interest.

Not anymore, I did dable when I was doing those simulations, I actually got pretty good groupings all connected at 200 Yards on windy days.

On reloading, the most important thing is to do your ammo at the same time. The differences in weather while reloading makes your ammo behave differently.
I'll try to upload the manual somewhere because it's bigger than the 1MB limit. (5MB total)

I did upload the manual to a website I have, although I did put it on the seek thermal camera folder I created for Mike a while back.

http://www.miguelvp.com/ForMike/XAS/Manual/Manual.htm

Hopefully this is helpful for reloading, I don't take credit for the manual I just did the full game engine but we had an engineer (works for NASA) that did all the physics and math behind it all.
So it's terse but definitely accurate.

I might find the High Power Rifle manual too, but for reloading it's about the same thing.

Edit: the Installation and setup links seem to be broken, the rest seems to be complete.

Thanks for that, it'll be good reference material to share with shooting buddies.
Got plenty of good docs on reloading, ballistic programs etc and cloverleaf all our hunting rifles @100yds.
I won't hijack Dave's thread anymore but you and others feel free to PM me on this stuff if you wish.

[tautech]

Dave, don't do anything too rash like the plonkers here did over the last couple of days:
http://forum.accurateshooter.com/

That forum was down for 24+ hrs and still not right.

They had a perfectly good SMF forum much like yours and nuked it for the POS they have now.
Avatars gone, User names reverted to actual names  , post #'s gone, a lottery if you quote a post if it comes out right....
A right proper mess.

Just a heads up Dave:

From their Forum Boss today:
Overall, regarding change we wish everything could be seamless with no problems. But the situation was that the existing software, SMF, was no longer supported. We looked at all the major Forum software offerings -- all were less than perfect. We picked the one that was the fastest, had the highest security, and the most flexibility.


Is this fact or BS?

[Richard Crowley]

... :the existing software, SMF, was no longer supported"...

There is nothing on the SFM website that would suggest anything but continued support.
See for yourself: http://www.simplemachines.org/
I would ask them to cite their source of information on that one.

[tautech]

... :the existing software, SMF, was no longer supported"...

There is nothing on the SFM website that would suggest anything but continued support.
See for yourself: http://www.simplemachines.org/
I would ask them to cite their source of information on that one.

Yes Richard that has crossed my mind. 
I don't really want to rock their boat, they've got enough shite going down ATM and the administrators seem to be an anal bunch, not at all like here on EEVblog.

I see Dave is using version 2, I have no recollection of the version they were using and maybe their upgrade costs made them move away from SMF. 

No doubt it's like any forum......a perpetual work in progress.

[PedroDaGr8]

Beginner
Design
- Projects, PCB Design, KiCad/gEDA, DIPtrace, Eagle, Altium Designer, DesignSpark
Hardware
- Open source, Crowd Funding, Micros & FPGA, Manufacturing & Assembly
Equipment
- Oscilloscopes, Multimeters, Soldering, Other (open more if required)
Repair
Buy/Sell/Wanted
EEVblog
- EEVBlab, Amphour, News, Suggestions, Contests 
General Chat
- Supporters, Blogs, Jobs, Work Wanted

Not a radical change just tidy up the child forums move some and shorten the length of the front page (descriptions for each forum could be shortened).

+1 

I wouldn't change too much though. People are used to the way it is now.

Overall, I REALLY like this layout but something bothers me. It feels clean and organized, much better than the way things feel right now. Really, things like Projects and RF would belong under the same category because they are usually about building hardware or hardware analysis but then THAT category becomes a bit daunting with all of the PCB Software. On the flipside, maybe it is just me, but OpenSource and Crowd Funding tend to be not all that heavily used and end up being a bit more advertising/spammy in feel. The Crowd-Funding is seldom about hardware at all and usually just an ad for someones upcoming crowd funded project. Open Source seems to be 90% ideas for designs without implementation and 9% check-out this cool half-done open source project and 1% someone working on open source stuff. That being said, it keeps these kinds of threads out of the main forums so there is that.