Author Topic: NASA unlikely to produce fully operational rocket engine of its own before 2020  (Read 11647 times)

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Offline HP-ILnerd

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Scientist:  I recall they decided against putting J-2X in the Space Launch System, because they have enough RS-25s, but they're still using F-1B. That engine is batshit amazing.
It's RS-25 and J-2X now.   http://www.nasa.gov/exploration/systems/sls/#.U3RELfldV8F

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Scientist:  I agree that this whole thread is a circlejerk for the NASA haters.
Is that what that was?  Explains much... ;D

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EEVBlog:  Good. Teach the stupid Yanks a lesson. Effectively cancelling their manned space program, practically stifling the private US rocket industry, and going to the most ridiculous pie-in-the-sky long term rocket programs because of vested interests, and one of the dumbest things the US government has ever done.

SLS is only one in a series of "Joke" programs since the Space Exploration Initiative (SEI) back in '89.  It's basically a battle between an agency that's struggling design programs to protect its own civil service jobs vs a congress that doesn't understand or appreciate science and technical stuff, as they are 99% lawyers.
Dumb is their Dominion.

And to make everyone feel better, your Elon Musk moment of cool upon cool: 
If anyone hasn't been following, the last Falcon 9 launch had a successful simulated soft-landing in the Atlantic a few weeks ago.
 

Offline Stonent

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Moscow is banning Washington from using Russian-made rocket engines, which the US has used to deliver its military satellites into orbit, said Russia’s Deputy PM, Dmitry Rogozin, who is in charge of space and defense industries.
“We proceed from the fact that without guarantees that our engines are used for non-military spacecraft launches only, we won’t be able to supply them to the US,” Rogozin is cited as saying by Interfax news agency.

Good. Teach the stupid Yanks a lesson. Effectively cancelling their manned space program, practically stifling the private US rocket industry, and going to the most ridiculous pie-in-the-sky long term rocket programs because of vested interests, and one of the dumbest things the US government has ever done.

The only bad part is that we won't be able to send things like the canadarm up as easily.

Oh yeah thanks for the arm man!

Regarding the rest of it... Can we not buy rockets directly from Starsem and use them ourselves?  I mean they're launched out of Kazakhstan, not Russia.

I found an owners manual, if NASA needs it. http://www.arianespace.com/launch-services-soyuz/Soyuz-Users-Manual-March-2012.pdf
« Last Edit: May 15, 2014, 05:05:04 am by Stonent »
The larger the government, the smaller the citizen.
 

Offline HP-ILnerd

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Stonent:  Regarding the rest of it... Can we not buy rockets directly from Starsem and use them ourselves?  I mean they're launched out of Kazakhstan, not Russia.

Why would we bother when we have other rockets to do the same job?  Only Atlas V uses the Russian motors.
 

Offline Stonent

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Stonent:  Regarding the rest of it... Can we not buy rockets directly from Starsem and use them ourselves?  I mean they're launched out of Kazakhstan, not Russia.

Why would we bother when we have other rockets to do the same job?  Only Atlas V uses the Russian motors.

??, ???? ??? ???, ?? ??? ????? ?????? ?????????? ???? ???????!
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Offline HP-ILnerd

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Stonent:  ??, ???? ??? ???, ?? ??? ????? ?????? ?????????? ???? ???????!

I apologize for any lack of clarity.  Perhaps we are talking about two different things.
The OP is about the Russians not selling us rocket engines which we only need for one rocket (Atlas V).  Delta IV Medium and Heavy use American engines, as does Falcon 9.
Why do we need to buy foreign rockets?  Even without Atlas V, we have lost no capability.
 

Offline dannyf

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your Elon Musk moment of cool upon cool

He is criticizing ULA because of money, not his love for space or the space program.
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Offline Dave Turner

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Hopefully there won't be influential politicians with knee-jerk reactions insisting on immediate (if not yesterday) results.
 

Offline calexanian

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They need to take the 90 billion they want to spend on a bullett train here in California and invest it in aerospace, desalinization, and fusion power development. Nobody will ride the train and the lawsuits are so backed up it will never get off the ground. Spend te money where it will do some good! Skunk works is close to net power gain. A couple billion would put us there!
Charles Alexanian
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Offline scientist

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Moscow is banning Washington from using Russian-made rocket engines, which the US has used to deliver its military satellites into orbit, said Russia’s Deputy PM, Dmitry Rogozin, who is in charge of space and defense industries.
“We proceed from the fact that without guarantees that our engines are used for non-military spacecraft launches only, we won’t be able to supply them to the US,” Rogozin is cited as saying by Interfax news agency.

Good. Teach the stupid Yanks a lesson. Effectively cancelling their manned space program, practically stifling the private US rocket industry, and going to the most ridiculous pie-in-the-sky long term rocket programs because of vested interests, and one of the dumbest things the US government has ever done.

I'd like to see the Aussies launch a rocket.
 

Offline kolonelkadat

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Has nasa ever built its own rockets?

building rockets seems like something they would have Boeing do.
 

Offline nctnico

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I think the USA has plenty of capability to clone the old engines,or even the Russki ones,if they put their minds ,& will,to it!
You might underestimate what this will take. I once saw a documentary about the apollo engines that were created from an enormous amount of experiments to find the right mixture, shape, fuelchamber proportions, size etc. etc. to create a stable rocketengine. They might clone this 1:1 but to make a smaller or larger version will take an equal amount of experiments since there is no proven simulation that works, still today they are unable to simulate this behaviour which I found quite interesting. We know a lot but still there are a lot of unknowns that only with practical experimentation can be created.
I think the real question is, why would any country spend billions of coins to still put some humans in space while a lot of their own people do not even have a roof over their head and food on the table  ;)
Meanwhile Europe flies rockets into space all the time... and let's not forget about China.

The Space Shuttle development has focussed too much on solid fuel rockets (which can be used in ICBMs) so now the US is behind on general purpose rockets. OTOH it could be a lot of FUD produced by NASA to get their budgets increased.
« Last Edit: May 15, 2014, 11:35:08 pm by nctnico »
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline HP-ILnerd

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dannyf:  He is criticizing ULA because of money, not his love for space or the space program.

Which does not invalidate his point.  Or, that what they did was extremely cool.
 

Offline dannyf

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Which does not invalidate his point.

True. Just that one needs to factor in his bias in consideration of his points.
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Offline calexanian

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Charles Alexanian
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Offline vk6zgo

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Moscow is banning Washington from using Russian-made rocket engines, which the US has used to deliver its military satellites into orbit, said Russia’s Deputy PM, Dmitry Rogozin, who is in charge of space and defense industries.
“We proceed from the fact that without guarantees that our engines are used for non-military spacecraft launches only, we won’t be able to supply them to the US,” Rogozin is cited as saying by Interfax news agency.

Good. Teach the stupid Yanks a lesson. Effectively cancelling their manned space program, practically stifling the private US rocket industry, and going to the most ridiculous pie-in-the-sky long term rocket programs because of vested interests, and one of the dumbest things the US government has ever done.

I'd like to see the Aussies launch a rocket.

We launched quite a few,& even one satellite,but we did cheat a bit,------we bought the rockets from the USA.
The Brits launched some fairly big ones from Woomera,but I guess they don't count.
 

Offline calexanian

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There is a Bruce in America that needs a fosters. Load a keg up in that ICBM and send it over!  :-+

That's how I envision the Aussie space program Should be. Way more fun too!
Ladies and Bruces, there is Too much Monty Python in my diet!
Charles Alexanian
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