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Is Arduino killing the electronic hobby?
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ataradov:
Another thing with 555 is that you automatically need to stock a range of capacitors and resistors to be able to adjust the period. Do either your costs or your frustration go up right away. With Arduino it is just adjusting one number in the code.

Also, even for a final production solution the cheapest generally available MCU costs as much as 555 in low quantities. And 555 needs a lot of other components with very specific value. The MCU needs a bypass capacitor of virtually any value if you feel generous.
FriedMule:
I am not saying that an MCU in not a fantastic tool or almost 100% necessary in many projects, unless you have an engineering degree.
Yes you can maybe not get every function as an add-on but it's not far from, and if you can't get an add-on, then is it something special. In the situations where you can not get an add-on, do the learning curve skyrocket, you do have to design a PCB who fits on the MCU board, who conform to the standard, is able to be coded into the project, with the right components, the right layout and so on. You could add the expectation on top of that, a 100% noob do only know what is professional possible but have no idea of what it takes, so a "I'll just need a gyroscopic module with elevation sensor, looking like the other add-ons.

Some of you have talked about the price, please forgive me but I do not think most of us is considering if our project costs $10 and could be solved by a $1 nano Arduino. Do we not build electronic for the share fun and challenge without thinking "gee I could get a pro solution for $1.99 at Walmart? :-)

What do you think of those who is realistic toward a 100% noob and says "if you want to make a blinker do you need to learn to solder, design your PCB, find the right components, expect it not to work and start all over again! It's easier if you just take an Arduino."?
ataradov:

--- Quote from: FriedMule on June 20, 2021, 05:40:17 pm ---In the situations where you can not get an add-on, do the learning curve skyrocket, you do have to design a PCB who fits on the MCU board, who conform to the standard, is able to be coded into the project, with the right components, the right layout and so on.

--- End quote ---
  You can always just make it on a protoboard. It does not have to be in the Arduino form factor.

And I definitely used Arduino shield board for experiments with new devices without Arduino, simply because  I did not feel like making a board and sourcing the component for a quick test. So in this way Arduino ecosystem contributes to "professional" market too.


--- Quote from: FriedMule on June 20, 2021, 05:40:17 pm ---Some of you have talked about the price, please forgive me but I do not think most of us is considering if our project costs $10 and could be solved by a $1 nano Arduino. Do we not build electronic for the share fun and challenge without thinking "gee I could get a pro solution for $1.99 at Walmart? :-)

--- End quote ---
In most of my hobby projects I consider economic side of things, even if it is just a one off. I may use more expensive components, because I may not care for one off, but I always consider if there is a possible substitution. It is just a good practice.


--- Quote from: FriedMule on June 20, 2021, 05:40:17 pm ---What do you think of those who is realistic toward a 100% noob and says "if you want to make a blinker do you need to learn to solder, design your PCB, find the right components, expect it not to work and start all over again! It's easier if you just take an Arduino."?

--- End quote ---
They are realistic and it is a good advice.

Investing in learning something deeply only makes sense if you already know that this is something you want to do professionally. 

Most of "professionals" here started with electronics kits with pre-made PCBs. And that was not much of a creative thing and did not require a lot of understanding, but nobody was on their ass saying that they should source all the components and make the PCB themselves.

Just like with some AM radio kit, with Arduino there is a lot to be learned from assembling the thing from readily made components and experimenting/debugging it.
james_s:

--- Quote from: madires on June 20, 2021, 11:38:53 am ---Some started with solderless electronics science kits. It's not important how you start, it's about getting bitten by the electronics bug. Maybe a kid just wants to blink an LED for fun and won't get bitten. If bitten, the kid will start asking about how things work. Then you got the chance to explain astable multivibrators.

--- End quote ---

I started with those, the kind with the springy connectors and components mounted on a cardboard frame. From there I went to solderless breadboards and then soldering point to point on protoboards. Often I would (and still do) prototype something on a breadboard and then make a PCB and build the permanent circuit on that. For microcontroller projects I regularly prototype on an Arduino and then make a custom board for the finished project. Sometimes for a one-off I'll just solder the Arduino Nano clone to a protoboard and call it good, it works, it's cheap, and the prototype is the only one I'll ever need so why bother to make a custom PCB? Either way almost every project requires some custom discrete circuitry to work, every microcontroller requires a power source, decoupling, transistors or other devices for driving outputs, signal conditioning on inputs, etc.
FriedMule:
A breadboard, point to point or even home edged PCB's is really a joy to make and lol inside a box is it not even visible for anybody if you stopped there. :-)
But nothing compares to a well-designed PCB you have got made, got soldered and is just working.

I think if one as a hobbyist is considering if buy or DIY is cheapest, even up to $100 is that person forgetting it will always be cheaper to buy. If DIY, do you have to calculate in all your gear, time, components, board production, consumables, electricity, space you pay rent for and a lot more. Electronic one offs at home can always only remain an expense, just like painting, sowing, photography and all these hobbies.

My concern about the MCU may be due to seeing woodworking change so much and the hobby going from an art in manual skills to 3D drawing and "push print"
In the start did you have to know how a saw works, keep your hand plane chisels sharp, later did the bandsaw, table saw and surface planer and made everything easier. After that did the CNC arrive and everything changed to sitting behind a monitor, drawing in 3D and get the computer to cut it for you.
MCU is also behind the monitor and press upload.

Knitting can be done behind a monitor, woodworking, electronic, sculpturing and a lot more, it just takes something away, do I think. :-)
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