Author Topic: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)  (Read 26135 times)

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Online EEVblogTopic starter

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Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« on: December 04, 2020, 09:12:38 am »
Got a new 3kW aircon installed and was surprised to find it just spliced into the existing 20A power point wiring. I didn't think that was legal?
But seems to only take 0.8kW because of the high COP, so maybe legal?
Anyone know the electrical code for sure?
Three existing aircons are installed on two different dedicated fuses in the breaker box.
Just a lazy arse installer?

Just measured the consumption on the highest cooling setting and it takes about 650W to 1kW all up. So I don't think it's technically an issue, just that I didn't think it was legal to hard dire such a thing into a power point wiring?
Also, this bypasses by dedicated aircon power monitoring line on my Solar Analytics system.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2020, 09:20:09 am by EEVblog »
 

Online Ian.M

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2020, 09:19:44 am »
It certainly doesn't look 'kosher'.  I don't think there's any '1st world' jurisdiction where stripping the cable jacket back to outside the junction box would meet code. 
 
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Online EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2020, 09:32:25 am »
Consumption just over 1.1kW on full cooling
 

Online EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2020, 09:36:21 am »
It certainly doesn't look 'kosher'.  I don't think there's any '1st world' jurisdiction where stripping the cable jacket back to outside the junction box would meet code.

Well that's the thing. I'd like to be sure from a local sparky that it doesn't meet code before I complain.
 

Offline Ed.Kloonk

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2020, 09:37:55 am »
Just quickly, wires should be fixed, ie clipped.

Junction boxed should be fixed. Single insulated wires should we protected by sheath or conduit.

Should have an isolator.

Aircons (generally) aren't ticketed to do household power.

The idea is that the fridge mechanic is permitted to service the machine, within the confines of the machine and that's why such plants should have a nearby and compliant isolator switch.


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Online Ian.M

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2020, 09:41:15 am »
Its not a local 'sparkie' you should be talking to as there are far too many who barely passed training and have forgotten much of what they learnt so are basically doing installation work by rote with no real understanding of the code requirements.  You need the opinion of a government 'sparkie' in the code enforcement department.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2020, 09:44:53 am by Ian.M »
 

Online EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2020, 09:44:57 am »
Its not a local 'sparkie' you should be talking to.  You need the opinion of a government 'sparkie' in the code enforcement department.

Yeah, but it would be good to know off the bat if "hell no, that's not up to code" from a local sparky who knows the local regulations.
 

Online Ian.M

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2020, 09:54:25 am »
I think Ed's clued you in to the main points.  Unfortunately your electrical code is behind a paywall, so unless you can get it from a library, or find a bootleg copy to check against Ed's points,  there's little further you can do without the opinion of an official inspector.

However you could get some more opinions from a specialist forum, e.g.
https://www.electriciansforums.net/forums/australian-electrician-advice-forum.171/
« Last Edit: December 04, 2020, 09:59:16 am by Ian.M »
 

Online EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2020, 09:57:25 am »
 

Online Ian.M

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2020, 10:03:12 am »
So post your photos to a new topic there, and when they are horrified, find a code enforcement contact to email them to.  I suspect you are going to need to stop payment and contact your lawyer . . .
 

Offline GlennSprigg

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2020, 10:12:45 am »
Hi Dave.  The 'AS3000' Standards apply Australia wide, not just for N.S.W.  It used to be hard to find, but there's a .PDF now...
https://www.fpvprobuilds.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/AS3000-2018-Clean-Purple-cover.pdf
The normal power cables in homes is 2.5-Sqmm, which can handle about 23-25 Amps, depending on the circumstances.
They SHOULD, however, have installed another breaker/feed, but tapping in to existing cables IS legal, and typical.
HOWEVER, the single-insulation wires exposed from the junction-box IS illegal.
Diagonal of 1x1 square = Root-2. Ok.
Diagonal of 1x1x1 cube = Root-3 !!!  Beautiful !!
 
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Online EEVblogTopic starter

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2020, 10:26:20 am »
So post your photos to a new topic there, and when they are horrified, find a code enforcement contact to email them to.  I suspect you are going to need to stop payment and contact your lawyer . . .

Have posted.
https://www.electriciansforums.net/threads/is-this-aircon-wiring-install-legal.191943/
Lawyer? Are you serious? Why? So I can pay them hundreds of bucks to send a nasty letter  :-DD
 

Offline Someone

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2020, 10:57:11 am »
What used to be waved away as inaccessible areas changed, so that visible single insulation is not kosher. The aircon needs some sort of isolation method local to the plant, supplied by a power point is ok but otherwise needs a proper lockable isolation switch.

If you paid for an install then they're on the hook to get it up to standard. Ask them nicely, then go through fair trading if that fails.
 

Offline GlennSprigg

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2020, 11:26:19 am »
What used to be waved away as inaccessible areas changed, so that visible single insulation is not kosher....

You are right, but your line above reminded me of a few things!!  :)
Yea, ceilings are absolutely considered as 'accessible', for multiple trades, including the home-owners themselves.
But the laws are funny!!  I used to also be responsible for fire-systems in multi-story buildings. They (authorities here), stipulate the
'legal' height of a building as from the 'Floor-Level' of the Top-Most-Occupied-Floor, to the lowest point of egress. This means that
Plant-Rooms above, (and lift motor-rooms) did not count, because... "Anyone up there have technical knowledge regarding safety,
as well as better knowledge than the general public regarding emergency exits etc.".  Basically, it is a 'cop-out' rule for building
owners, otherwise virtually every multi-story building owner here would be in the shit!  |O
Diagonal of 1x1 square = Root-2. Ok.
Diagonal of 1x1x1 cube = Root-3 !!!  Beautiful !!
 
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Offline Someone

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #14 on: December 05, 2020, 12:49:14 am »
What used to be waved away as inaccessible areas changed, so that visible single insulation is not kosher....
You are right, but your line above reminded me of a few things!!  :)
Yea, ceilings are absolutely considered as 'accessible', for multiple trades, including the home-owners themselves.
I'm not convinced the current rules make the demarkation between accessible and non-accessible areas clear enough, when I'm working I don't want to measure the crawl space heights to determine if the installation is touch safe at that point (when blindly reaching around for instance). Trying to protect all the other possible users of a space on the assumption they will do specific things (which may not be obvious to them) is a bit silly. Homeowners happily do plastering work which can expose "inaccessible" areas and they themselves are unlikely to enforce the 50mm clearance restrictions intended to save them.
 

Offline james_s

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #15 on: December 05, 2020, 05:47:13 am »
Surely that junction box isn't legal like that? Here that would be an immediate inspection failure to have exposed inner wires outside of the box, the clamp must be fully on the sheath.
 

Offline Inflex

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2020, 06:51:15 am »
https://www.fpvprobuilds.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/AS3000-2018-Clean-Purple-cover.pdf

Looks like some good reading,  Dean Koontz is going back on the shelf.   Out of curiosity, is there a consolidated/abridged "household wiring" version ?
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Offline jh15

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2020, 08:10:19 am »
No strain relief clamps on sheath? looks like a radio shack box. 'Strailia laws must be lax. Go to library before they are outlawed for sharing books.
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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2020, 09:22:07 am »
also do they have the correct cable gland, that looks like a romex, I hope its not going into a circular gland? You need a romex gland for it.

rush job
 

Offline Ed.Kloonk

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #19 on: December 05, 2020, 10:37:12 am »

rush job

It's a well established part of Sydney consumer culture here for home owners to wait until December to realize the house is too hot and start looking for the cheapest price to install an aircon.

Then they get on the internet and start bitching after it all goes pear-shaped.

 :horse:
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Offline Syntax Error

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #20 on: December 05, 2020, 12:28:04 pm »
That clusterfuk of an installation would be out of code in most national or state jurisdictions. I suspect the 'spur' cable is out of rating for that 20A circuit? And with exposed inners, the junction is no longer double insulated. I assume the screws in the box are tightened?

Not a certified Aussie sparks, but I might expect your AC had an independent circuit starting with an RCBO at the main board?

Back in the day, that box would have a big red DEFECT sticker on, put there by an angry inspector who learned his trade over 30 years. Not a two week course that covers why you should not really strip live cables with your teeth. Think yourself lucky the drongo didn't tag off the lighting circuit.

A rush job should still be a propper job. FAIL  :--
« Last Edit: December 05, 2020, 03:49:54 pm by Syntax Error »
 

Offline Messtechniker

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #21 on: December 05, 2020, 02:09:49 pm »
What a terrible job.

I also don't like the wood material this contraption
is resting on. It's a fire hazard should this be a
permanent installation. :palm:

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Offline SparkyFX

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #22 on: December 05, 2020, 02:10:31 pm »
Check the label closely. It is rated 3kW because it is pumping this amount of heat out of the heat exchanger (into ambient air). Electrically it is rated at 9 Amps.
Would not worry.
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Offline Refrigerator

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #23 on: December 05, 2020, 03:47:03 pm »
IMO that junction box looks dodgy as.
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Offline Labrat101

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Re: Is this Wiring Legal? (NSW)
« Reply #24 on: December 05, 2020, 06:30:24 pm »
Hi All , Dave
I think you should find that Mitsubishi supplied a recommended installation leaflet with your AC.
 Any AC split unit requires that it can be Isolated for service.
Wiring it direct to the Mains without using ether via Plug to socket .
Must have an Isolation switch breaker . This is recommended as standard for all AC units.
 If its Hard wired  and have a fault requiring a service from Mitsubishi under warrantee .
 The service tech will not work on it and your warrantee will be null & void.
 
 I am now retired but I still hold a Full HVAC Licence  upto 800hp .

I would get that cowboy that did that work or Company demand that they send
 A certified Engineer / electrician back and ask to see his licence .
 Edit : it's also good practice that every AC has its own fuse .
« Last Edit: December 05, 2020, 06:44:18 pm by Labrat101 »
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