Author Topic: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!  (Read 7286 times)

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Offline RoGeorge

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #50 on: April 12, 2023, 05:10:25 pm »
It seems to mean that 144 domains have already been blocked in Romania by the early March (which is, IIRC, when the eurosoyuz ban on RT came into effect).

edit
Wait, 2021? :o
Either it was banned before the war for some reason or the numbers don't mean what I think they do.
Meh, whatever.

Yes, 2021.  From here I see this:

Offline madires

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #51 on: April 12, 2023, 05:11:03 pm »
This is not traffic shaping, it's blocking, Halcyon, it's censoring.  Don't try to deflect the facts by twisting/stretching/redefining the meaning of words.

Yes, and nobody disputes that. Net neutrality is mostly about traffic shaping, but can also comprise blocking based on your personal definition of net neutrality.
 

Offline RoGeorge

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #52 on: April 12, 2023, 05:14:30 pm »
This is not traffic shaping, it's blocking, Halcyon, it's censoring.  Don't try to deflect the facts by twisting/stretching/redefining the meaning of words.

Yes, and nobody disputes that. Net neutrality is mostly about traffic shaping, but can also comprise blocking based on your personal definition of net neutrality.

As I was saying, one can not assign personal definitions to existing words.  Blocking is not neutrality.

Offline rhbTopic starter

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #53 on: April 12, 2023, 06:49:03 pm »
I am an American with almost 400 years of familial presence.  Censorship is abhorrent and illegal here.  Somewhat constrained by the agenda of the current dominant political faction.

I suspect that the problem stems from a spam or DDoS attack from a block of addresses.  10+ years ago the admins blocked them.  Now no one knows why, but they are terrified of changing anything as they don't understand how it works.
 

Online Monkeh

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #54 on: April 12, 2023, 06:51:47 pm »
I am an American with almost 400 years of familial presence.  Censorship is abhorrent and illegal here.  Somewhat constrained by the agenda of the current dominant political faction.

 :-DD
 

Offline rhbTopic starter

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #55 on: April 12, 2023, 07:02:49 pm »
We had to fight two wars with you to get our point across.  You may think free speech is bonkers, but we take it very seriously.

The fact that free speech is almost non-existent at present is an aberration  which hopefully will be corrected soon.

In theory my political representatives will address the matter.   It'll be interesting if Tom Cotton does anything.  I'm not holding my breathe.

Reg
 

Online Monkeh

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #56 on: April 12, 2023, 07:06:21 pm »
We had to fight two wars with you to get our point across.  You may think free speech is bonkers, but we take it very seriously.

The fact that free speech is almost non-existent at present is an aberration  which hopefully will be corrected soon.

In theory my political representatives will address the matter.   It'll be interesting if Tom Cotton does anything.  I'm not holding my breathe.

Reg

And still you miss your own party censoring books and firing teachers for allowing students to see a statue.
 

Offline rhbTopic starter

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #57 on: April 12, 2023, 07:36:27 pm »
You make more assumptions than are worth addressing.
 

Online Monkeh

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #58 on: April 12, 2023, 08:35:20 pm »
You make more assumptions than are worth addressing.

You started with those. Along with bringing politics into this to begin with.
 

Offline rhbTopic starter

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #59 on: April 12, 2023, 08:49:23 pm »
Censorship is by nature political.
 

Offline magic

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #60 on: April 12, 2023, 09:13:34 pm »
As I was saying, one can not assign personal definitions to existing words.  Blocking is not neutrality.
In practical terms, "net neutrality" is a political movement by Internet business owners, wannabe owners and software drones working for them, fighting against a world where consumer ISPs could extort Internet services for money under threat of deprioritizing their traffic, in order to secure additional revenue which would enable them to sell Internet access to consumers at dumping prices.

The same business owners and worker drones have no problems with reasonable censorship content control, generally.

Hope this helps :-DD
 

Offline RoGeorge

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #61 on: April 12, 2023, 09:25:41 pm »
I know that part, thank you.  Has to do with Internet speed, allegedly.  Has nothing to do with blocking traffic for political reasons, and in the name of some ordinance from 2021 that is nowhere to be found online.

Offline Halcyon

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #62 on: April 12, 2023, 11:07:24 pm »
I consider traffic shaping part of net neutrality as well, some providers will give certain traffic lower priority on it's network (such as torrents) while others don't bother since they recognise it's not up to the provider to determine what traffic is "more important" to their customers. I can see why some providers (like satellite or wireless) might do it, since it's a very finite and shared medium, but there is no real reason to do it on fixed wire connections.

Absolutely! However, it's a bit more complex as we need some traffic engineering for specific purposes. For example, all routing related things (routing protocols and other important stuff) get the highest priority by default, because they are needed to keep the network running. Another example is VoIP which also requires some prioritization for obvious reasons. If you're a carrier/ISP/telco you might have to adhere to SLAs.

This is not traffic shaping, it's blocking, Halcyon, it's censoring.  Don't try to deflect the facts by twisting/stretching/redefining the meaning of words.

I did no such thing. I said shaping was "part of" the definition. Right after I spoke about blocking.

It's not my definition, it's the widely accepted definition.
 

Offline BravoV

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #63 on: April 13, 2023, 02:28:43 am »
This is not traffic shaping, it's blocking, Halcyon, it's censoring.  Don't try to deflect the facts by twisting/stretching/redefining the meaning of words.

Cutting and limiting communication was one of the pillars during Ceausescu regime, here, in Romania, some 30-40 years ago.  West is doing the same now.  I've seen this before.  Wasn't fun, and didn't end well.

I find hard to believe, living under US empire, especially your country as US vassal state, you just realized, now, today that you do not have freedom ?  :scared:

Wow , the brainwashing part must be really-really good in there.

Ceausescu regime was hell, but it was "local hell", and if you think under the US & EU regime is "better" hell ? Then I have a bridge to sell you.  :-DD

Offline madires

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #64 on: April 13, 2023, 11:13:45 am »
Yes, and nobody disputes that. Net neutrality is mostly about traffic shaping, but can also comprise blocking based on your personal definition of net neutrality.

As I was saying, one can not assign personal definitions to existing words.  Blocking is not neutrality.

Bad day? Net neutrality is the opposite of traffic shaping and blocking. And it's not just about the consumer's internet access. There's also a lot of bad blood between some carriers/telcos/ISPs about this topic for more than two decades (peering vs. transit, selling traffic twice).
 

Offline ebastler

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #65 on: April 13, 2023, 07:48:12 pm »
The issue here seems to be site owner incompetence rather than some blocking.

That would be reassuring -- but would also point to massive incompentence of the ISP's technical support staff, who have apparently confirmed the blocking on two separate occasions?
 

Online ataradov

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #66 on: April 13, 2023, 08:06:29 pm »
That would be reassuring -- but would also point to massive incompentence of the ISP's technical support staff, who have apparently confirmed the blocking on two separate occasions?
Yeah, it is both here. ISP is some small time regional ISP that actually takes customer calls and has some delusional "protection" policies.

But the fact that www and non-www domains resolve to different things is purely on the owner.
Alex
 

Offline rhbTopic starter

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #67 on: April 14, 2023, 10:59:04 pm »
Actually I'm guessing my ISP is now much larger.  In my case prepending www has no effect.  Yesterday I got a  3rd call from a"supervisor" who did not even know  what DNS is.  She just claimed they don't block sites despite obvious evidence that they do, but wouldn't let me to speak to anyone who understood how the Interner works.

I'm going to get Starlink.
 

Offline magic

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #68 on: April 15, 2023, 04:00:50 am »
IOW, no one has any idea what's going on and your "obvious evidence" is contrary statements from different representatives of the same company.

tcpdump time? traceroute/tracepath?
 

Offline Infraviolet

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #69 on: April 15, 2023, 04:45:46 pm »
I've often found alternative DNS doesn't help. My ISP was blocking a website about machine tool design as "adult content". A VPN is effective where changing DNS doesn't help. There are some reasonably trustworthy free VPNs for situations where the things you're accessing are blocked but are not something you need to keep secure. That is to say if you're visiting a website which is blocked to view articles or watch videos that's fine, but whether one could trust a free priced VPN if your primary email provider became blocked or your bank's website is another matter.

rhb your ISP's claim "not to block sites" might be true from their perspective, often ISPs are reselling the service of another ISP. Your's might not block anything, but if the company that actually runs the infrastructure they resell is blocking then you'd still hit such blocks unless you VPN around them.
 

Offline rhbTopic starter

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #70 on: April 15, 2023, 07:23:39 pm »
Two "supervisors" said they could see the elegoo.com website.  I asked them what they saw. So a block upstream is implausible.
 

Offline mendip_discovery

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #71 on: April 15, 2023, 07:30:20 pm »
I am sure you have checked but you dont have an ad blocker or firewall app running?

Remember a few weeks back when people were complaining that the forum had ended up on a block list.

I did notice that the www and the root of the domain are different. That may well be a setup issue with shopify or the domain itself. I didn't get any issues going onto the site but I dont mess around with ad blockers and such, found too many of them did odd things to sites.
Motorcyclist, Nerd, and I work in a Calibration Lab :-)
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Offline rdl

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #72 on: April 16, 2023, 12:21:52 am »
It's a bit sketchy of a site with elegoo.com giving a Shopify error page and www.elegoo.com sort of working. It's a pretty horrible place though. I'd for sure not go there without a javascript blocker. I counted over 35 non-elegoo.com scripts attempting to run in the background. That just might be the worst I've ever seen.
 

Offline amyk

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #73 on: April 16, 2023, 09:10:45 am »
Yesterday I got a  3rd call from a"supervisor" who did not even know  what DNS is.
Either it's feigning ignorance, or gross incompetence. How does one get to work for an ISP without knowing what DNS is? :palm:
 

Offline magic

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #74 on: April 16, 2023, 09:12:56 am »
Who would work for minimum wage in some dodgy company's customer support while having any useful knowledge or skill? :-DD
 


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