Author Topic: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!  (Read 7283 times)

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Offline rhbTopic starter

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ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« on: April 11, 2023, 07:49:40 pm »
I have discovered that my ISP is deliberately blocking access to such dubious sites as elegoo.com.

I am currently investigating alternative service as unblocking them was not an option.  They wouldn't tell me why it was blocked even though 2 supervisors confirmed they could reach it, but said they couldn't unblock them and refused to let me speak with anyone who could.

heltec.org is another address I can't reach.  I'd be very interested in what end users in the US are seeing and who their ISPs are.
 .

Reg :-(

 

Online ataradov

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2023, 08:20:07 pm »
Don't use your ISP's DNS server. This is a bad idea on many levels.

I personally use Cloudflare's 1.1.1.1, which is consistently one of the fastest in my location. But there are many other public DNS servers out there.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2023, 08:22:08 pm by ataradov »
Alex
 
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Online abeyer

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2023, 08:20:32 pm »
You should almost always assume that your ISP's DNS service is garbage and use something else, if you aren't already... this is usually going to give a better experience even if you aren't already having problems. That alone is often enough to get around these sort of "blocks" that are sometimes no more than choosing not to resolve the addresses.

VPNs are always an option, too.
 
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Offline rhbTopic starter

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2023, 08:43:07 pm »
The block is being done via Cloudflare.  The replies from 8.8.4.4 (google DNS) resolve to Cloudflare.
Yahoo will accept mail from elegoo.com, but the routing tables forbid opening an http connection.

I *thought* it was accidental until two different customer support supervisors said it was deliberate and not subject to appeal.

Interestingly, if I do a lookup via google I can ping elegoo.com, but cannot open a port 80 connection.

The world is looking more dystopian every day :-(

It's rather scary that *any* IP adress can be blackholed by numerous actors.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2023, 08:46:53 pm by rhb »
 

Online bdunham7

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2023, 08:49:37 pm »
I use Google DNS (8.8.8.8 ) and had the same issue.  Changed to 1.1.1.1 and I was able to access www.elegoo.com.

Hmmm.
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Offline jonpaul

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2023, 08:50:20 pm »
1.use 1.1.1.1, 4.4.4.4,8.8.8.8 DNS
2. VPN
3. most ChiCom sites are monitored by the CCP
j
An Internet Dinosaur...
 
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Offline gamalot

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2023, 08:53:39 pm »
I tried to access elegoo.com and got an error message, but I can access www.elegoo.com without any problem. I am in Australia.
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Online Bud

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2023, 08:54:30 pm »
Jonpaul I cant help but think you drink too much kool-aid.
Facebook-free life and Rigol-free shack.
 
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Online wraper

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2023, 08:58:09 pm »
Yes, use Cloudflare 1.1.1.1 as main and Google 8.8.8.8 or 8.8.4.4 as backup DNS. Too much BS and surveillance when using majority of ISP DNS.
 

Offline madires

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2023, 09:01:25 pm »
host www.elegoo.com
Code: [Select]
[]www.elegoo.com[] is an alias for shops.myshopify.com.
shops.myshopify.com has address 23.227.38.74

host elegoo.com
Code: [Select]
elegoo.com has address 23.227.38.65
elegoo.com has address 104.17.232.29

23.227.38.x is Shopify
104.17.232.29 is Cloudflare

Usually one would point all entries to one platform. This looks weird!

Edit: 23.227.32.0/19 is allocated to Shopify, but 23.227.38.0/23 is routed to Cloudflare.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2023, 09:57:40 pm by madires »
 

Offline rhbTopic starter

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2023, 09:06:06 pm »
I can *ping* it.  But can't connect with a browser using the same address.  www has no effect.

I am stipulating that I won't accept a contract if an installation cannot access the  addesses being blocked and others. blocked.

ALL the submitted addresses are redirected to Cloudflare and require an authentication header.
 

Online SiliconWizard

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2023, 09:14:49 pm »
I've been using OpenDNS for a few years.

But just looked, and it apparently now belongs to Cisco? >:(
 

Online Monkeh

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2023, 09:27:04 pm »
I can *ping* it.  But can't connect with a browser using the same address.  www has no effect.

I am stipulating that I won't accept a contract if an installation cannot access the  addesses being blocked and others. blocked.

ALL the submitted addresses are redirected to Cloudflare and require an authentication header.

I'd be very surprised if an HTTPS connection were intercepted in such a manner.

Wait.. you do connect via HTTPS exclusively when dealing with US ISPs, right?
 

Offline rhbTopic starter

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2023, 09:37:01 pm »
I use http/https unless other forms of interaction are more useful.  I was quite happy with sendmail and ftp.  But your own peer  sendmail instance is long gone and ftp increasingly rare.

I date from when they first allowed commercial entities on ARPANET and the name got changed to the Internet.  At the time I  used Usenet and bang path addresses.

Big question in my mind is who is behind this?
 

Offline themadhippy

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2023, 09:39:14 pm »
So much for " the land of the free"
 

Offline rhbTopic starter

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2023, 09:40:24 pm »


I'd be very surprised if an HTTPS connection were intercepted in such a manner.

Wait.. you do connect via HTTPS exclusively when dealing with US ISPs, right?

Missed a key part of your question.  HTTP/HTTPS is determined by the website.  What appears to be happening is blocking of port 80.  I plan to poke it once I look up the appropriate query to send via telnet.
 

Online Monkeh

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #16 on: April 11, 2023, 09:41:55 pm »


I'd be very surprised if an HTTPS connection were intercepted in such a manner.

Wait.. you do connect via HTTPS exclusively when dealing with US ISPs, right?

Missed a key part of your question.  HTTP/HTTPS is determined by the website.  What appears to be happening is blocking of port 80.  I plan to poke it once I look up the appropriate query to send via telnet.

No, it's determined by what you ask your browser to do. HTTPS does not even use port 80.

Any website which doesn't support HTTPS today is probably not worth visiting, and it likely won't be long before browsers won't allow HTTP by default.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2023, 09:45:15 pm by Monkeh »
 

Online thm_w

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #17 on: April 11, 2023, 09:47:20 pm »
And the ISP in question is?
You tried on another device?
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Offline rhbTopic starter

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #18 on: April 11, 2023, 09:51:13 pm »
So much for " the land of the free"

At least I can't be thrown in jail for using the wrong pronoun, yet.  I intend to take up the issue with my representatives to DC.

ISP is Optimum which apparently bought Suddenlink.  I have *explicit statements from two different support supervisors that it would not be unblocked*.

So I'm shopping Hughes and Starlink.
 

Offline madires

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #19 on: April 11, 2023, 09:51:25 pm »
I've checked BGP: 23.227.38.0/23 is announced by AS13335 which is Cloudflare. So all DNS entries end up at Cloudflare.

heltec.org points to 47.56.130.228 (Alibaba Cloud) and 47.56.0.0/16 is announced by AS45102 (Alibaba).
 

Offline sleemanj

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #20 on: April 11, 2023, 09:54:50 pm »
Which is more likely, your ISP has gone out of their way, setting up special firewall rules and packet inspection in order to block access to an innocuous website of a 3D printer manufacturer, or; the 3D printer manufacturer, or shopify, or cloudflare, automatically blocked access to an IP range which happens to include your IP address because there was an influx of bots from said range.

Occam's Razor. Your ISP almost certainly doesn't care enough about 3D printer manufacturers to go to any lengths to stop you accessing them.

Don't trust what ISP support people tell you, they don't know shit, they just want to get you off the phone.

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Offline ve7xen

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #21 on: April 11, 2023, 10:06:10 pm »
I've been using OpenDNS for a few years.

But just looked, and it apparently now belongs to Cisco? >:(

Since 2015.

If you just want a public resolver with similar security features, try Quad9 that is operated as a Swiss not-for-profit. This (and OpenDNS) don't claim or attempt to give you a pure DNS view though, which if you are anti-blocking-stuff is not what you want.

@rbh: Aside from what your ISP has told you to get you off the phone, what evidence do you have that www.elegoo.com is 'blocked' by them? It seems highly unlikely that your ISP would be blocking anything hosted on CloudFlare or Shopify, and Elegoo is way too niche/small potatoes to attract a specific block. What troubleshooting have you done? What DNS resolution are you getting? What does the error look like? How do you know it's not that your ISP has been blocked by these sites and not the other way around?
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Offline RoGeorge

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #22 on: April 11, 2023, 10:18:09 pm »
I use Google DNS (8.8.8.8 ) and had the same issue.  Changed to 1.1.1.1 and I was able to access www.elegoo.com.

Hmmm.

I've just clicked your link and the elegoo page opened.  Browsing from EU/Romania.  Firefox, Ubuntu 22.04.
Here we have other things blocked by law, i.e holocaust denial or antisemitic content, hate speech, etc.

@rhb
- Usually, http is blocked by Firefox, has to be specifically enabled from about:config variables (do not enforce https or something)
- Disable certificate website verification, unless you do online shopping.
- Don't use Chrome, it has extra "protection", hard to remove.  There are degooglified versions of Chrome, but I didn't try.
- Another one browser to try is Wolf Browser, a Firefox with less call home.
- Tor browser is also good to try, it uses tor network and tunnels the traffic to random output locations, and access the requested webpage from there.  As a result, if you connect a few times, you may catch a connection outside US and escape the censorship.
- Even better, VPN, where you can choose the output point deliberately outside US (as opposed to Tor browser, where the location is at random), but for VPN you'll have to pay a monthly subscription.

I've heard in USA is in preparation some sort of "Patriot Act" but for Internet.  If you access things not allowed by "The Ministry of Truth", $1mil and up to 20 years in jail, and you'll have no rights to question anything.  No idea if this is true or not, I don't follow news, but watch the video linked here:  https://www.eevblog.com/forum/blog/eevblog-tiktok/msg4796921/#msg4796921

Offline rhbTopic starter

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #23 on: April 12, 2023, 12:21:59 am »
At this point I'm just going to get Starlink.  I don't see Musk blocking educational kit vendors.

The present SCOTUS would never allow the sort of censorship you describe if properly presented for a decision.  But the court may only make rulings in response to legal petitions.  This is by design.  If the petitioner presents a flawed argument it will be dismissed with the suggestion that it be reframed if the court feels the subject has merit.  Or with prejudice if they think the basic premise lacks merit.

I'm going to dig and then contact the people who are supposed to represent me.  I am *not* happy and shall be persistent.  And it's perfect grist for the news media.

Reg
 

Online ataradov

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Re: ISP blocking Chinese websites WTF!
« Reply #24 on: April 12, 2023, 12:36:41 am »
Both sites mentioned here work for me with 1.1.1.1 DNS. For elegoo.com, I had to manually go to https://elegoo.com. Withut https, it breaks, but this break is on their side.

The issue here seems to be site owner incompetence rather than some blocking.
Alex
 


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