Author Topic: Leaking AA and AAA batteries  (Read 22781 times)

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Online Ian.M

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #25 on: May 24, 2016, 02:29:43 pm »
With high drain devices like cameras, the batteries are abused (or nearly so) every time you take a photo.  Its just common sense to take the batteries out if you aren't going to be using it again in the next couple of days.  If there are settings that need the batteries in for them to be kept, put in fresh batteries after powering down at the end of the shoot and use up the partially discharged ones in something else, but then you need to be a bit anal about checking them regularily.
 

Offline Gary350z

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #26 on: May 24, 2016, 07:09:13 pm »
Here are a couple of documents produced for Energizer alkaline and lithium batteries.
http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/alkaline_appman.pdf
http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/lithiuml91l92_appman.pdf

Neither of them make a claim that the batteries will not leak.

Not true.

Here's info for energizer lithiums:

First their playing word games

http://www.energizer.com/about-batteries/battery-leakage

For Advanced lithium - leak proof

http://www.energizer.com/batteries/energizer-advanced-lithium-batteries

For lithium in general - superior leakage resistance

http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/lithiuml91l92_appman.pdf

For lithium Ultimate - leak proof

http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/Lithium%20Intrinsic%20Safety.pdf

For lithium Ultimate - leak proof

http://www.energizer.com/batteries/energizer-ultimate-lithium-batteries

« Last Edit: May 24, 2016, 07:25:29 pm by Gary350z »
 

Offline CatalinaWOW

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #27 on: May 24, 2016, 09:15:13 pm »
Leak proof as two independent words is meaningless.  Like "Waterproof".  A coat that completely sheds water might be termed leakproof, but would be a poor choice to hold water.  A watch that can sustain swimming and scuba diving without any water getting in would be called waterproof, but would fill instantly with water if taken to the bottom of the Marianas trench.

So unless durations, temperatures and a number of other conditions are also specified the term leak proof is essentially meaningless.  (I'm sure these batteries would also fail at the bottom of the Marianas trench).  And even with proper description of the conditions it will only be a statistical measure, as in the literally billions of these things made there will be failures.

The term "leak proof" in dry batteries came into use when they transitioned from Carbon-Zinc with zinc forming the outer shell (except for a cardboard wrapper).  No matter how bad you think these current batteries are, they are golden gems compared to the ones that caused "leak proof" to be a valuable marketing term.
 

Offline bitseeker

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #28 on: May 24, 2016, 11:17:32 pm »
It's just marketing hype. Why? Because Energizer does not claim that the batteries will not leak. What they claim is, "No Leaks. Guaranteed. Or we will replace your device." That's not the same thing.

Duracell makes the same claim, but with more words. "Duracell guarantees its batteries against defects in materials and workmanship. Should any device be damaged due to a battery defect, we will repair or replace it at our option. Leaking battery and damaged device must be provided as proof of claim."

In both cases, the batteries still leak and you can send them your damaged device. They'll repair or replace it, as I've successfully tested. It doesn't change the fact that their batteries still leak. It's just cheaper to repair/replace the few devices that people are willing to go through the trouble to make claims on than to create leakproof batteries.
« Last Edit: May 24, 2016, 11:19:43 pm by bitseeker »
I TEA.
 

Offline Cerebus

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #29 on: May 25, 2016, 01:13:07 am »
It's just cheaper to repair/replace the few devices that people are willing to go through the trouble to make claims on than to create leakproof batteries.

While that's probably true and certainly a commercially sensible approach, the way you have phased it suggests that it might somehow be possible for them to make leakproof batteries and yet they do not. I don't think a genuine 100% never fails leakproof battery that fits existing sizes and has a reasonable capacity is a possibility. It's just outside the envelope of engineering possibility. For a completely novel size and capacity of battery you might engineer a failure rate so close to zero that it's effectively leakproof, but not within the constraints of existing size/capacity combinations.
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Online IanB

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #30 on: May 25, 2016, 01:22:30 am »
I do believe that lithium primaries have effectively 0% chance of leaking. This would be because their internal chemistry does not generate gas bubbles, therefore there is no internal pressure in the cell to expel electrolyte as happens with alkaline cells.
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Offline bitseeker

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #31 on: May 25, 2016, 01:32:40 am »
I don't think a genuine 100% never fails leakproof battery that fits existing sizes and has a reasonable capacity is a possibility. It's just outside the envelope of engineering possibility.

Depends on what's considered a reasonable capacity. Half what they currently squeeze in? I'd be happy with that to have no leaks.

As someone already pointed out, manufacturers have been striving for more capacity, which may be exacerbating the problem. If that is the case, it's kind of a self-inflicted problem for the sake of bigger spec sheet numbers to sell more product.

Anyway, the solution is simple enough. Use a different kind of battery.
I TEA.
 

Offline Robaroni

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #32 on: October 26, 2017, 01:37:05 pm »
I realize this is an old topic but I'm at wits end with these leaking AA and AAA Duracells. Really bad! My wife's short wave radio just sat and so did the Yacht Boy. Countless digital clocks, remotes and the list goes on and on.
I'm going to Energizer lithium's and my trusted Eneloops.
Duracell sent me a coupon for their batteries. Gee thanks!
 

Offline rdl

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #33 on: October 26, 2017, 03:03:57 pm »
Switch to NiMH. That's what I've done. Not much chance of leaking and much cheaper in the long run.
 

Offline mcinque

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #34 on: October 26, 2017, 03:05:45 pm »
Duracell sent me a coupon for their batteries. Gee thanks!
Wow.
It's like if your car crashes because of "no crash tires" and they offer you a coupon to purchase another set of tires. Great.

Switch to NiMH. That's what I've done. Not much chance of leaking and much cheaper in the long run.
NiMH has a lot of self discharge, don't you?
I'm basically still a rookie and because of this, even with the best intentions, I often say bullshits
 

Offline rdl

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #35 on: October 26, 2017, 03:16:16 pm »
NiMH has a lot of self discharge, don't you?

I bought all new, low self-discharge type NiMH ("Eneloop"), and half of the 9 volt I bought are Lithium-ion. The testing I've done so far, there's not enough self discharge to worry about, at least for the first few months.
 

Offline alank2

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #36 on: October 26, 2017, 03:17:03 pm »
Are the US made Duracells any better as far as leaking?
 

Online IanB

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #37 on: October 26, 2017, 03:17:15 pm »
NiMH has a lot of self discharge, don't you?

Not if you use Eneloops. I have left a set of Eneloops in a camera that has been sitting in a drawer for years, and yet the camera worked fine when I picked it up and switched it on after all that time.
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Offline Naguissa

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #38 on: October 26, 2017, 03:18:02 pm »
I use NiMH with very low auto-discharge batteries (rechargable ones).

Problem solved.

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Online IanB

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #39 on: October 26, 2017, 03:24:31 pm »
Are the US made Duracells any better as far as leaking?

IMHO the alkaline cells from major brands with high power claims and a lot of marketing behind them are more prone to leaking. This is because there is a trade-off: if you change the formulation to get more power, you also increase the risk of leaking because the contents of the battery become more unstable and more volatile.

The lowest risk of leaking comes with minor brands that don't make extravagant claims, such as you might get from a dollar store. I have been buying and using Sunbeam brand cells from Dollar Tree (4/1$), and so far I have not seen one leak. They also have plenty of power for things like multimeters or clocks. Other low leak brands seem to be Japanese names like Panasonic, Sony, Fuji.

Also, ironically, the current design of super cheap zinc chloride super heavy duty cells seem very unlikely to leak. Ironically because these were the leaky ones decades ago.
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Offline Robaroni

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #40 on: October 26, 2017, 03:26:31 pm »
The trouble with rechargeable batteries is that they settle to about 1.25V, not enough for some applications, that's why I went to lithiums.
 

Offline Robaroni

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #41 on: October 26, 2017, 03:28:33 pm »
Ian,
Have you had any sitting in clocks or other appliances for years? What's your experience?
 

Offline tooki

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #42 on: October 26, 2017, 04:35:53 pm »
I’ve completely sworn off Duracell for years now: I’ve had more Duracells leak than all the others combined. I now swear by IKEA batteries: they’re cheap and they work great. (They used to say “made for ikea by Varta” on them, but that disappeared a few years ago, no idea who makes them now.)
 

Online SeanB

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #43 on: October 26, 2017, 05:00:49 pm »
Opened up a RS branded multimeter today to check the battery, which expired in 2013. Interesting no name cell there, aside from the RS branding and the small info about a patent number hidden under the terminals.

https://www.google.com/patents/US5691079

Quite an interesting read, and they do seem to last well.
 

Offline fourtytwo42

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #44 on: October 26, 2017, 07:06:25 pm »
Its 32C-35C for more than half the year where I live. I wonder if people in cooler climates have less trouble?
OMG what part of the UK is that ??  Here in chilly Norfolk it never goes above 28 and most of the time 22-24 in summer only!
 

Offline Naguissa

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #45 on: October 26, 2017, 09:02:28 pm »
The trouble with rechargeable batteries is that they settle to about 1.25V, not enough for some applications, that's why I went to lithiums.
Any appliance that doesn't work with at minimum of 1.1 is batteriea eater. Most work until 0.9 or even 0.9. And with RC batteries... well, you can then recharge them....

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Offline Robaroni

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #46 on: October 26, 2017, 09:52:33 pm »
The trouble with rechargeable batteries is that they settle to about 1.25V, not enough for some applications, that's why I went to lithiums.
Any appliance that doesn't work with at minimum of 1.1 is batteriea eater. Most work until 0.9 or even 0.9. And with RC batteries... well, you can then recharge them....

Enviado desde mi Jolla mediante Tapatalk

I have several Atomic clocks that start losing signal at a little over 1.2 volts. Actually when you look at the discharge curves not much is left after 1.2 volts. I think Dave did a video on it somewhere.
 

Online IanB

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #47 on: October 27, 2017, 12:34:27 am »
I have several Atomic clocks that start losing signal at a little over 1.2 volts. Actually when you look at the discharge curves not much is left after 1.2 volts. I think Dave did a video on it somewhere.

I have a LaCrosse atomic clock that gives a low battery indication at about 1.4 volts. It is really annoying. I run it with lithiums, and I have been seriously thinking about making a mains powered battery eliminator for it so I don't have to keep replacing the battery.
I'm not an EE--what am I doing here?
 

Offline CatalinaWOW

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #48 on: October 27, 2017, 04:30:07 am »

I have a LaCrosse atomic clock that gives a low battery indication at about 1.4 volts. It is really annoying. I run it with lithiums, and I have been seriously thinking about making a mains powered battery eliminator for it so I don't have to keep replacing the battery.

Depending on how they monitor voltage it might be easier to jigger the monitor circuit.
 

Offline Robaroni

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Re: Leaking AA and AAA batteries
« Reply #49 on: October 27, 2017, 11:24:55 am »
I have several Atomic clocks that start losing signal at a little over 1.2 volts. Actually when you look at the discharge curves not much is left after 1.2 volts. I think Dave did a video on it somewhere.

I have a LaCrosse atomic clock that gives a low battery indication at about 1.4 volts. It is really annoying. I run it with lithiums, and I have been seriously thinking about making a mains powered battery eliminator for it so I don't have to keep replacing the battery.
Ian,
That's the same brand as mine. The Lithium batteries should last pretty long.
 


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