Author Topic: "Legal advice" regarding Arrow Electronics and UPS  (Read 1022 times)

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Offline TheAmmoniacal

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"Legal advice" regarding Arrow Electronics and UPS
« on: October 18, 2018, 09:21:09 pm »
I made an order with Arrow Electronics (arrow.com) back in early May (2nd), just different components I needed for a project, at a total of $31.67 USD. At checkout I used the "Free worldwide shipping" they advertise, selecting FedEx at $0 USD.

The majority of the order was delivered by FedEx as expected, but the order had been split into two shipments and two molex connectors worth $0.87 arrived with UPS a few days later (~10th of May).

On June 7th I go on a 2 month vacation, as I'm a student living on campus most of the year.

When I get back there's an invoice from UPS asking $35.8 USD in shipping cost and fuel tax, a late payment notice with an added fee AND a final notice from a debt collector company which included "non-legal" (processing) fee and added interest, totaling $78.50 USD. (And yes, that first invoice must have taken ~a month to arrive, I checked by mail box before I left on the 7th of June).

Being pissed off at this "situation" I disputed the invoice with the debt collector, which suspended the case until further notice. At the same time I sent an email to Arrow support explaining the situation, they said they would look into it and fix it - but never received any confirmation. Now two weeks later I receive documents from UPS via the debt collector "proving" that I owe them money and that they will pursue this further (with/against me).

The documents they sent are attached below. The first document is supposed to be a form filled out by Arrow, saying that the recipient is to pay for shipping (anyone know what any of these abbreviations mean?). The second is a document UPS wants Arrow to sign in order to move the debt away from me and over to them.

Getting a large foreign company to sign a "legal"-looking document like this is impossible, and I've yet to hear anything useful from Arrow regarding this case.

I never agreed to any shipping cost, I never agreed to using UPS (I would never have made the order if UPS was the courier, as I've had many conflicts with them before), I feel like this situation is entirely between Arrow and UPS - not me.

I know nobody here can comment on the law and legal system in my country (Norway), but any advice would be helpful. Just pay and get this out of my life? Continue to refuse and risk the escalation to a legal matter, which will inevitably cost me more (even if I "win")?
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Offline Halcyon

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Re: "Legal advice" regarding Arrow Electronics and UPS
« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2018, 09:31:35 pm »
I can only give advice as to what I would personally do in your situation as I don't know the legal implications of doing so in your country.

If you have the items you ordered, then happy days, job done. However consider the following before choosing to pay or not pay the additional shipping invoices.

In Australia (and probably most other countries) have credit reporting agencies. These organisations collect financial information from service providers, banks etc... about your debt and history of paying bills. If you pay a bill late, it impacts negatively on your credit record, pretty simple. However when you sign up to these services, they generally collect a fair amount of ID information about you, such as name, date of birth, driving licence number etc... so that you can be identified.

If all that UPS have is your name and address, it may be the case that they don't have enough to pursue you or report you to a credit reporting agency. In which case, you could ignore it and nothing will probably happen. Even if it is reported on your credit file, you probably have fairly good grounds to dispute the "error" and have it removed.

Also, company debts are "sold" to debt recovery companies who will chase payment to cover the debt. Once that debt is taken over by debt recovery, the original supplier have written off the cost.

If people come knocking at your door, you can always claim that you don't know the person and you just moved in. There is little they can actually do.
 

Offline David Hess

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Re: "Legal advice" regarding Arrow Electronics and UPS
« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2018, 03:56:22 pm »
I had the same problem last week when I placed an order with Arrow expecting the advertised free shipping via FedEx which was confirmed on the invoice.  Instead UPS ground was used.

Update: I forgot that I took a photograph of Arrow's great packaging.  Thermal compound is now considered very hazardous to sea life so I am safe from Jason Mamoa.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2018, 01:58:13 am by David Hess »
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: "Legal advice" regarding Arrow Electronics and UPS
« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2018, 04:04:45 pm »
Quote
I never agreed to any shipping cost, I never agreed to using UPS (I would never have made the order if UPS was the courier, as I've had many conflicts with them before), I feel like this situation is entirely between Arrow and UPS - not me.
Exactly.

You are not UPS's customer.
You have no contractual relationship with them, therefore have no claim against you.
Tell them to refer it to their client (Arrow), and that you will regard any further action as harrassment and will take action accordingly.

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Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: "Legal advice" regarding Arrow Electronics and UPS
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2018, 04:37:02 pm »
Exactly.

You are not UPS's customer.
You have no contractual relationship with them, therefore have no claim against you.
Tell them to refer it to their client (Arrow), and that you will regard any further action as harrassment and will take action accordingly.
They tend to hide behind that fact when they lose items. "You're not our customer!" It only seems fair you get to use it in reverse. Maybe it helps to ask them to reproduce the contract you entered with them. They shouldn't have any.

That being said, these are two large companies with a lot of experience getting unwilling people to pay and who don't care about making your life very difficult. You may want to consider whether peace of mind and being able to deal with Arrow later is worth just paying up. It may not be fair, but some things are worth the price of admission.
 

Offline ebastler

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Re: "Legal advice" regarding Arrow Electronics and UPS
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2018, 04:43:38 pm »
The first document is supposed to be a form filled out by Arrow, saying that the recipient is to pay for shipping (anyone know what any of these abbreviations mean?).

The "F/C" means "freight collect", i.e. the receiver is supposed to pay all charges.
https://www.ups.com/us/en/help-center/billing-payment/international.page

But, as others have stated, yo ucan probably deny responsibility. It's between Arrow and UPS, and you have not asked Arrow to give that order to UPS on your behalf either.
 

Online BravoV

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Re: "Legal advice" regarding Arrow Electronics and UPS
« Reply #6 on: October 19, 2018, 05:05:18 pm »
Wow ... isn't this exactly like thug/gangster extortionist style ?    :palm:

Offline donotdespisethesnake

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Re: "Legal advice" regarding Arrow Electronics and UPS
« Reply #7 on: October 19, 2018, 05:37:12 pm »
When I dealt with Arrow, their service was really lousy. I guess there is a reason why they are offering discounts and special offers.

Sticking the customer with an unexpected large bill for shipping is about as bad as you can get! Sounds like a good case for some social media shaming, they will probably cancel the charges to avoid bad publicity.

In the meantime, the message is clear : avoid Arrow like the plague.
Bob
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Offline jmelson

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Re: "Legal advice" regarding Arrow Electronics and UPS
« Reply #8 on: October 19, 2018, 09:08:54 pm »
Do you have emails or other documents showing the order had "free delivery"?  Does your university have a law school?  You might drop by there and see if anyone wants to do some research on your liability, etc.  I'd start bugging Arrow daily about getting this fixed, sending them copies of supporting documentation.  Possibly sending the documents showing "free delivery" to UPS or their collection agency might also be helpful.

If the collection agency contacts you again, say that the legal counsel at the university is helping you with this.

Jon
 

Offline Halcyon

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Re: "Legal advice" regarding Arrow Electronics and UPS
« Reply #9 on: October 20, 2018, 12:35:28 am »
They tend to hide behind that fact when they lose items. "You're not our customer!" It only seems fair you get to use it in reverse. Maybe it helps to ask them to reproduce the contract you entered with them. They shouldn't have any.

That being said, these are two large companies with a lot of experience getting unwilling people to pay and who don't care about making your life very difficult. You may want to consider whether peace of mind and being able to deal with Arrow later is worth just paying up. It may not be fair, but some things are worth the price of admission.

Absolutely. But even they have their limits. Most countries have strict laws regarding debt collection, particularly regarding harassing/menacing people for money. Even sufficient repeated calls can be regarded as harassment. In these situations, they tend to tread very carefully.

My advice is, play dumb, you don't know what they are talking about, you don't know the person, please go away. :P
 


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