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'Master' and 'slave': Tech terms face scrutiny amid anti-racism efforts
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SilverSolder:

--- Quote from: Nominal Animal on June 22, 2020, 01:55:38 am ---
[...]  in analogous situations (human trafficking) it has been shown to make the situation only worse for the roughly ten million humans living right now in slavery [...]


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Shouldn't we think of something better / more effective to help those people, than changing some words?
nuclearcat:

--- Quote from: Nominal Animal on June 22, 2020, 01:55:38 am ---You mean, any harm you are willing to measure.  I've already mentioned a lot of harm it actually does – in particular, in analogous situations (human trafficking) it has been shown to make the situation only worse for the roughly ten million humans living right now in slavery, because using the term is now considered offensive.

--- End quote ---
Exactly. When, for example, i say that i see with my own eyes how the citizens of some countries (mostly Ethiopia, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Phillipines) are exploited as slaves in the arab countries, there is things need to be done urgently, how to help them, all those busy bees, "wrestlers with words", pretend that they dont see such problems.
Sometimes it is really easy to help at least in something, for example i used google translate and found out what "phrases" in specific languages are used for "bad things" in social networks, hunted such groups and people, and reported in various abuse teams and LE agencies. Saw some positive results. Point is that there is real criminals behind, and you can't brag about it in your twitter, as even you are in safe country (i'm not), you might face real revenge.
Those "brave fighters" have a much more trending topics how they can stay in the spotlight, get attention of media, and all for cheap and absolutely safe for their asses - just by changing a few words in the comments of code or attacking some poor dudes who dare to speak words forbidden in newspeak they are inventing.
And they always have a "very, very important topic" (and totally useless in reality), which is not worth a damn, and about which they instantly forget as soon as it stops trending, not noticing that part of this useless battle tactics, "cancel culture", often leaving smoking ruins behind them in process and this cancerous smoke creating very bad tumors on tech and science.
For example on some scientific subjects it is simply impossible to see unbiased research on racial or gender differences (and they do exist, it's DNA), as they are guaranteed to become victims. Even if you study, for example DNA-related vulnerability of certain races to something unpleasant, like sexually transmitted diseases, you wont get published (or might get cancelled) if it’s at least somehow unpleasant for certain “protected” races. And this is an example of how it can do exactly opposite, harm these races, since just significant part of the medical research will not be published and topics wont be researched.
Or can we find out for sure whether there is harm from hormone replacement therapy at an early age or will be the scientist who publish such study cancelled? I think you know the answer. Same again, leaving trans people more hurt in the end, they might get serious health problems, since no one wants to explore topics for which they can lose a career.
Or how damaging the “CoC (Code of conduct)” that has been imposed on many open source projects, after which many experts are afraid to criticize really stupid ideas, express their opinion, to not to be “cancelled”, to not be declared a witch, and watch how their career burned in flames by neo-inquisitors.
And you can't just stay away and try to be neutral, because now you will be burned too, like this: https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/9hg9to/sage_sharp_claims_top_linux_kernel_developer_theo/
DimitriP:

--- Quote from: SilverSolder on June 22, 2020, 03:57:57 am ---
--- Quote from: Nominal Animal on June 22, 2020, 01:55:38 am ---
[...]  in analogous situations (human trafficking) it has been shown to make the situation only worse for the roughly ten million humans living right now in slavery [...]


--- End quote ---

Shouldn't we think of something better / more effective to help those people, than changing some words?

--- End quote ---

It's the most cost-effective "solution". The leaders that support it get credit, the companies that support it get credit. The people that support it feel useful as being part of  "the change"  without realizing the extent of  their "usefulness".
More on being useful here:   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot

daqq:

--- Quote from: julianhigginson on June 22, 2020, 12:29:57 am ---And the good news is, once the new terms get decided on (people will come to a consensus about what they all want to use) it'll become pretty easy to tell what most people are doing, whether they describe it in old words or new words.

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That's the thing - you do not have consensus - if you need proof of that just look at this thread. There's maybe two or three people who are all for it, a few who are OK either way and the rest a definite nope. In reality you have a very small percentage of loud fringe cases looking for imaginary problems and then screaming their heads off when someone dares disagree with them, instantly branding them racists*. The only seeming of consensus you get is because a few large corporations want to get cheap marketing points for seeming woke and sensitive. For them though it's not about actually being oh so woke (I hate the word), it's about cheap marketing and hoping that they don't get branded racist on twitter by someone who doesn't really understand engineering, but saw the word 'slave' in an application note once it was pointed out to him.

The whole current situation can be summed up that a very small percentage wants to change a century's worth of documentation, accurate language and valid information because someone's (not theirs mind you) feelings might get hurt. The same thing applies to male/female, although that's apparently a way to insult the trans community. Somehow.

* - which cheapens the word greatly.
james_s:

--- Quote from: SilverSolder on June 22, 2020, 03:57:57 am ---Shouldn't we think of something better / more effective to help those people, than changing some words?

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People like a nice easy thing so they can "do something" without actually having to do very much. There are many things that can be done to actually help people and prevent some of the situations people are upset about but the actions that are effective are not easy or fast. I'm reminded of the marches for breast cancer and such, it has never made sense to me, marching around does nothing to fight cancer, everyone is already aware so there's no need to raise awareness, and if you want to raise money why not do something useful/productive and donate the proceeds to an organization that actually researches cancer treatment? It's much simpler to just go join a march though and feel like you're making a difference.
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