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| 'Master' and 'slave': Tech terms face scrutiny amid anti-racism efforts |
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| julianhigginson:
--- Quote from: EEVblog on June 22, 2020, 08:40:46 am ---Cite one example of where someone has used master/slave in a technical document context to "bully other people" And even if you could cite a few examples, is that a reason to abandon a standard industry term that has been used and taught for generations? --- End quote --- So do you want one or not? It sounds like there's not much point from your following sentence. Which also seems very much like an appeal to tradition. I'm expecting most of the good direct examples will be American, where I'm not from... Because slavery references are more associated with white supremacism over there than here.... In Australia, our worst white supremacists tend to go for straight out name-calling from what I've seen (not that I directly experience it myself, though, being white) --- Quote ---If it is, then seriously, what's next? And there is always a next. --- End quote --- We've established English is a living language, and all languages slowly change as ideas come and go, and new generations grow up. |
| julianhigginson:
--- Quote from: Zero999 on June 22, 2020, 09:27:15 am ---Lots of words have been used in the past to bully other people, which are not bad words in themselves for example: thick, dumb, backwards etc. It depends on the context. --- End quote --- But who is talking about removing those words from circulation? From what I can see, it's just from a technology context. |
| paulca:
--- Quote from: Simon on June 21, 2020, 08:39:45 am ---Well this is my point. Positive discrimination is still discrimination. I rarely fill in the race box on a form unless it's medical. If you want equality or to make sure you treat people equal then what better than not knowing their race! --- End quote --- Agreed. However, here in Northern Ireland we have the FEC system of monitoring not race, but "community". Aiming to address bias between members of the "Loyalist" community and the "nationalist" communities. You get this form with every job application. It not only asks which race you are, but also which "religion", catholic or protestant you consider yourself from. It includes "None" or "N/A" or "Prefer not to say". However, on ticking those boxes, they are just ignored. They look up your primary school and other records and label you with the community/religion based on that. If you are applying for a job as an Environmental officer for a council and hold two degrees in environmental science and a PHD in the specific area the job is in, but the religion tagged onto you exceeds their quota, they will employ someone else. You have been "positively" discriminated on a label which someone plucked out of thin air, based on historic divisions. The FEC information is supposed to be collected as anonymously as possible, save that a pure ID number, but is supposed to be off limits to access by HR. So you can't even ask if you were discriminated against, they are not legally allowed to tell you. If a company is meant to have at least 25% catholic but only have 15%, they WILL bias the interview and decision. Having working in more than one office handling applications, the anonymity is superficial. One office manager kept a list linking the FEC IDs to the employees names, completely illegally of course. |
| magic:
--- Quote from: tggzzz on June 22, 2020, 08:37:11 am --- --- Quote ---Of course somebody will always bring up the damn Shakespeare. --- End quote --- Er. No. That was a couple of centuries before Shakespeare started writing plays. --- End quote --- Doesn't matter. It wasn't common in recent times, or wasn't nearly as common. I don't recall ever seeing it on Slashdot, for example, and I was reading it for most of the 2000s. I mean common everyday usage, not some ultraliberal nerds discussing politics on some message board somewhere. Usenet is not Internet too, I have never been there either, but fair enough, that hits close. By the way, I tracked down a sample of one (among many) pioneering efforts in this latest wave of gender neutrality, straight from 2011: --- Quote ---The offender, for eir part, should stop offending as soon as ey realizes that the amount of pain eir actions cause is greater than the amount of annoyance it would take to avoid the offending action, even if ey can't understand why it would cause any pain at all. If ey wishes, ey may choose to apologize even though no apology was demanded. --- End quote --- https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/9thqSN8HDLM3LTxK5/offense-versus-harm-minimization Proudly brought to you by the rational-utilitarian-effective-altruism movement :popcorn: |
| nuclearcat:
--- Quote from: julianhigginson on June 22, 2020, 06:58:08 am --- --- Quote from: SilverSolder on June 22, 2020, 03:57:57 am ---Shouldn't we think of something better / more effective to help those people, than changing some words? --- End quote --- Awesome idea. Yes, Lets do it! --- End quote --- I can list you problems that i know very closely, they exist right now, and which i participated (unfortunately cannot share details, as this issue involves standing against organized crime, so i cannot trust random folks over internet, you need to contact those who fight with this publicly). 1)Several exUSSR countries (most are ukrainian and belorussian), Moroccan, Romanian girls are being trafficked in several countries, to work as "dance", "actor", but in fact they are forced to do alcohol drinking, sexual exploitation, often hooked to drugs and etc. Girls being lured by "agencies" and there is no website even to show the truth, what their life will be. I believe just making and promoting website where survivors stories can be published (some are brave enough to do that), and how agencies will ruin their future - will save many girls from this disaster. 2)As i mentioned before, citizens of philipinnes, sri-lanka, ethiopia, bangladesh travelling to arab countries, where their passport is being taken away(read about "kafala") and they are often locked up at homes and being beaten, unable to report anywhere about their suffering, some are so desperate, that they do suicide by jumping from balconies. And they need solutions, including technical ones, for example how those poor souls can report about their suffering. They need more people in western countries talking about this, making pressure to their governments, so western governments pressure on relevant countries to take action in specific cases and ask to improve laws. And every time bored westerners do loud useless stuff, like nonsense about changing words, they are taking away hope of those poor soulds, chance of highlighting their issues, real issues. This is not some "invented sufferers from seeing word slavery". This is people who is being beaten and dying each day, who can be named and there is many such names. I’m even wondering if you will continue the cheap verbal battles defending this useless initiative with the word “slave”, or still try to save real people from slavery. |
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