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'Master' and 'slave': Tech terms face scrutiny amid anti-racism efforts

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PlainName:

--- Quote from: GlennSprigg on June 22, 2020, 01:40:23 pm ---Weeks?? ago... I 'TRIED' to bring this back to a feeling of 'Peace'...
[...]

--- End quote ---

Mate, no-one will have any idea wtf you're going on about unless you give some indication of what you're replying to. In a thread like this, the post you think your comment follows is probably 20 messages ago by the time you actually post it.

james_s:

--- Quote from: Zero999 on June 22, 2020, 11:51:55 am ---Personally speaking, I don't care that much one way or another. The idea of changing terms because a small minority find them offensive, for no justifiable reason or they think it'll make the world a better place, is daft, but I also doubt it'll result in the slippery slope many fear. If an organisation feels that changing such terms will result in good public relations, then good for them and if someone is paid good money to go through documentation, changing them, again good for them.

Admittedly it does annoy me when wimpy babies get offended by stilly things, but sometimes it's not worth the fight. Choose your battles wisely.

--- End quote ---

It's not so much a slippery slope as it is a treadmill that has been running continuously for quite some time now. It's a slow but steady annoyance, consuming efforts and creating minor but annoying confusion. I'm just tired of change that is purely for the sake of change. Change sucks, it throws off my routine and makes me uncomfortable, if something is going to change I want there to be a tangible benefit.

tggzzz:

--- Quote from: magic on June 22, 2020, 02:26:02 pm ---From the earlier post, which I presume quotes the same Oxford dictionary (or some older edition thereof)


--- Quote ---usage: The word they (with its counterparts them, their, and themselves) as a singular pronoun to refer to a person of unspecified gender has been used since at least the 16th century.[how often?] In the late 20th century, as the traditional use of he to refer to a person of either gender came under scrutiny on the grounds of sexism, this use of they became more common. It is now generally accepted in contexts where it follows an indefinite pronoun such as anyone, no one, someone, or a person, as in anyone can join if they are a resident and each to their own. In other contexts, coming after singular nouns, the use of they is now common, though less widely accepted, especially in formal contexts. Sentences such as ask a friend if they could help are still criticized for being ungrammatical. Nevertheless, in view of the growing acceptance of they and its obvious practical advantages, they is used in this dictionary in many cases where he would have been used formerly. In a more recent development, they is now being used to refer to specific individuals (as in Alex is bringing their laptop). Like the gender-neutral honorific Mx1, the singular they is preferred by some individuals who identify as neither male nor female. See also usage at he and she.
--- End quote ---

Sounds like the points I argue. It used to be obscure, sometimes employed by writers to avoid awkward confusion, more notably revived by SJWs (earlier than I knew about, fair enough), perhaps slowly creeping into everyday language (no idea about that, but it certainly wasn't commonplace in the 2000s) and completely normalized over the last decade to the point where people would be throwing eggs at NYT headquarters if they dared to use "neutral he" anywhere.

--- End quote ---

It was not obscure. It was and is normal everyday use of the English language.

It may have been obscure to those new to English, or those who haven't thought about normal use of English.

magic:
I don't know man, I haven't been seeing it much until 2010 or so. I have been seeing a lot of 'he' and that is mostly gone now.

Today almost everybody is religiously devoted to 'they', and the leftists aren't even afraid of reaching for the highest levels of absurdity.

--- Quote ---Surely a woman shouldn’t be forced to wax testicles if that makes them feel uncomfortable
--- End quote ---

I doubt Shakespeare would have written that :P
I doubt any mainstream media would have published that before the era of Twitter.
Like it or not, Twitter is getting shit done.

julianhigginson:

--- Quote from: nuclearcat on June 22, 2020, 10:02:29 am ---
I can list you problems that i know very closely, they exist right now, and which i participated (unfortunately cannot share details, as this issue involves standing against organized crime, so i cannot trust random folks over internet, you need to contact those who fight with this publicly).
1)Several exUSSR countries (most are ukrainian and belorussian), Moroccan, Romanian girls are being trafficked in several countries, to work as "dance", "actor", but in fact they are forced to do alcohol drinking, sexual exploitation, often hooked to drugs and etc.
Girls being lured by "agencies" and there is no website even to show the truth, what their life will be. I believe just making and promoting website where survivors stories can be published (some are brave enough to do that), and how agencies will ruin their future - will save many girls from this disaster.
2)As i mentioned before, citizens of philipinnes, sri-lanka, ethiopia, bangladesh travelling to arab countries, where their passport is being taken away(read about "kafala") and they are often locked up at homes and being beaten, unable to report anywhere about their suffering, some are so desperate, that they do suicide by jumping from balconies.

And they need solutions, including technical ones, for example how those poor souls can report about their suffering. They need more people in western countries talking about this, making pressure to their governments, so western governments pressure on relevant countries to take action in specific cases and ask to improve laws.

And every time bored westerners do loud useless stuff, like nonsense about changing words, they are taking away hope of those poor soulds, chance of highlighting their issues, real issues.
This is not some "invented sufferers from seeing word slavery". This is people who is being beaten and dying each day, who can be named and there is many such names.
I’m even wondering if you will continue the cheap verbal battles defending this useless initiative with the word “slave”, or still try to save real people from slavery.

--- End quote ---

1) OK, and so how has your own word salad here materially helped anyone trapped in the modern slave industry?

2) and how exactly me does talking about (or actually) changing the use of two words used IN TECHINCAL COMMUNICATIONS CONTEXT make the lives of actual slaves living in slavery any worse?

This is an engineering forum remember, I want real logically linked constructions as answers to 1 and 2, not just empty claims that make you feel righteous, thanks.

I've got a few ideas around how we can materially effect worldwide slavery (completely unrelated to what words might be used to describe communication technology, surprisingly enough!) and each basic situation required probably needs multi-faceted attacks tailored to the actual problems at hand and the root causes supporting each... but it's very off topic for this forum, and even this discussion, so.... feel free to start another discussion on the abolition of modern slavery and I'll jump in.

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