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Mess with your minds: A wind powered craft going faster than a tail wind speed.
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Alex Eisenhut:
Question: do you agree with the three red arrows I added to your diagram?
bdunham7:

--- Quote from: electrodacus on September 03, 2021, 05:27:53 am ---To be honest education of most people seems to have been a waste of time.  Only knowing the formula and not knowing how to apply or what result you should expect is sort of pointless.

--- End quote ---

In your case this is apparent.  Education does not cure stupidity.  What is this 'formula'  you think I applied?


--- Quote ---If you think you are frustrated try to be in my place where almost nobody understand how basic physics works including people teaching others.

--- End quote ---


  :-DD  I'm sure that they don't "understand" it the way you do.  You seem to have adopted 'conservation of energy' as a religion of some sort without comprehending what it means nor understanding where or how to apply it.


--- Quote ---If you want to know if vehicle will increase or decrease in speed you do not need to be concerned with forces just with power.

--- End quote ---

Ok, so imagine your 1kg vehicle is travelling at 4.24m/s and you drive it into an infinitely strong and rigid concrete wall.  Calculate the power that the wall provides to stop the vehicle.


--- Quote ---What if wind speed was 6.24m/s so higher wind speed than vehicle speed ? Based on how you applied the formula this will be a fairly bad thing.

--- End quote ---

A bad thing?  So plug in the numbers to whatever formula you think I used and post the numbers.  How bad can they be?  :palm:
electrodacus:

--- Quote from: Labrat101 on September 03, 2021, 09:55:15 am ---100 years ago we all thought that the Plus & Minus on a battery that electricity flowed . From Plus to Minus 
Every one was happy with this ..  But it was found to be WRONG it goes from Minus to Plus ..   :wtf:  :blah:
Most people now except this as this is what you are told in school / Uni or what ever.
weather right or wrong the world maybe Flat . Depends on your perspective thinking . What you see is not always what is .

 Mother Nature does not have to play by the rules of mea Humans . So what when you see something that you Don't understand your Brain
will try to fit some thing in to stop it blowing a fuse ..
A computer if it does not understand will return ERROR .  No Data . because the Human did not enter it .

Somethings are as is . Appling maths formulators to do quick fix may solve your problem but not be Right solution
Murphy's Law is always true .. Humans will Always Get it round the wrong way.

--- End quote ---

We did not know how the electricity flows as we did not understood what it is and we just chose as a convention a direction. We still use the same convention and that will not affect in any way out ability to predict what happens that is why we still use the old convention.

We also had the wrong impression that earth is flat but we changed that when we found out that is not the case as that makes a big difference unlike the convention for electric current flow.

What you are trying to imply here is wrong. Enough people including me know why this vehicle exceeds wind speed (energy storage) so there is no magic for me. You also do not think there is magic as you apply the formula's wrong and think you have a rational answer but that gets you to wrong predictions like vehicle will never slow down as long as there is wind and that is not the case.
Alex Eisenhut:
Question: Do you agree with the red arrows I added to your diagram?
electrodacus:

--- Quote from: bdunham7 on September 03, 2021, 01:42:11 pm ---  :-DD  I'm sure that they don't "understand" it the way you do.  You seem to have adopted 'conservation of energy' as a religion of some sort without comprehending what it means nor understanding where or how to apply it.

--- End quote ---
I understand perfectly how to apply it. If you have 10W for propulsion and your propulsion is 70% efficient you will get 7W worth of thrust no matter if your vehicle drives at 2m/s or 4m/s or any other speed if you apply this 7W worth of thrust for one second the vehicle kinetic energy will increase by 7Ws (7 Joules if you prefer).
And if you apply a break of 10W for one second then your vehicle will have lost 10Ws worth of kinetic energy no matter if speed was 2m/s or 10m/s
So is clear that braking (that to English police) to generate power and then use that for accelerating the vehicle will result in a reduced kinetic energy and that will mean reduced speed as mass of the vehicle has no reason to change.



--- Quote from: bdunham7 on September 03, 2021, 01:42:11 pm ---Ok, so imagine your 1kg vehicle is travelling at 4.24m/s and you drive it into an infinitely strong and rigid concrete wall.  Calculate the power that the wall provides to stop the vehicle.

--- End quote ---
Wrong way of asking the question as there is not enough data to be able to answer that. The question that can easily be answered with the amount of data available is calculate the energy the vehicle acted against the wall and that is fairly simple since we know the vehicle speed and mass we can calculate the kinetic energy of the vehicle 9Ws and so since before hitting the wall vehicle had that and after the wall that will be zero (assuming non elastic collision) then it will be 9Ws.


--- Quote from: bdunham7 on September 03, 2021, 01:42:11 pm ---A bad thing?  So plug in the numbers to whatever formula you think I used and post the numbers.  How bad can they be?  :palm:

--- End quote ---

Your formula is not wrong it the way you interpret the result that is wrong.  You say since there is higher force it means vehicle will accelerate in a certain direction when that is wrong as the force you refer to is force acting against the propeller or against the wheel not against the body of the vehicle.
Force at the wheel is not the same with force on the body when the wheels are acting against two isolated mediums.

The result and conclusion of your force and speed formula needs to be exactly the same as my results using Power and energy.
Is clear to see that using power instead of speed and force has lower chances of making mistakes. As my conclusions are correct and yours (all of you) are wrong.
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