Tesla Model S, Third Fire

[mrflibble]

I was wondering how many problems and what type of problems there were with cars with combustion engine during the rampup to mass production.

[NiHaoMike]

EVs are a luxury item, consumed pretty much exclusively by some of the wealthiest part of the society. Yet, it is heavily subsidized by the rest of the society, by the middle class and the poor. It is a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich.

That's true of the Tesla (for now), but the Nissan Leaf is pretty much mainstream priced. And to be fair, oil is also subsidized when it shouldn't be.

[nctnico]

I still don't understand why the police in the USA keeps chasing suspects in cars Over here they stop a chase when it is clear the driver is not going to stop. They use their radios to coordinate a natural road block ahead like a traffic jam at which point they catch the suspect(s) without putting other people's life at risk.

Notice that, in this particular case, the crash happened about 10 miles (roughly 16 km) away from where the chase stopped.  So they DID stop pursuing him (though not intentionally -- they stopped because the police car crashed), and he caused that crash anyway.    It was in the grid of Los Angeles city streets, so there were many routes he could have taken; not just one route with one natural road block.

If the police have a known policy of calling off a chase as soon as the pursued vehicle starts going fast, then that provides incentive for the bad guys to flee and put lives in danger.

Like chasing a car is the only way to arrest suspects  Like I typed before: there are other, much smarter, alternatives than just chasing a suspect in a car. If you start chasing someone he/she is going to do stupid things because of the Adrenaline rush. That is what law enforcement should prevent. Let criminals think they got away until the time and place are there to make an arrest. Over here they use centrally controlled traffic lights, cameras along the roads, helicopters and unmarked cars to locate and block in suspects. High speed chases are very uncommon because of the risks associated with them. The key thing is that you don't have to try and catch a criminal within 5 minutes.

[MacAttak]

In this particular case it isn't clear that the suspect wouldn't have been driving that recklessly whether they were being tailed or not.

They continued at suicidal speeds for quite a distance. 10 miles through surface streets (even a relatively wide one like that) is a really long time to keep that kind of speed up.

Along with not wearing a safety belt, it sounds more like a death wish than an attempt to evade authorities. They may have fully expected to die in this act, while getting as much of a rush as possible in the process (and no regard for collateral damage).

[zapta]

... never mind the indisputable benefits to health, the environment and the economy, because there is this tiny sliver of doubt that just maybe climate change models are slightly off let's just carry on spewing shit everywhere until absolute 100% undeniable proof is available

'maybe climate change models are slightly off'  is the understatement  of the year.

[nctnico]

They continued at suicidal speeds for quite a distance. 10 miles through surface streets (even a relatively wide one like that) is a really long time to keep that kind of speed up.

Do some math: at 100Mph it takes only 6 minutes to do 10 miles. If you need to wait for 6 minutes that is a long time but in a stressful situation that amount of time passes 'in a blink of an eye'. Judging from the damage they must have driven even faster.

[zapta]

Imagine your neighbour decides to smear shit all over your home's windows. ...

More ATE?  Mojo Chan, you should know by now that it does not work here.  ;-)

http://www.logicallyfallacious.com/index.php/logical-fallacies/30-appeal-to-extremes

[tjb1]

'maybe climate change models are slightly off'  is the understatement  of the year.

Wow, talk about missing the point 

Imagine your neighbour decides to smear shit all over your home's windows. You ask him to stop and he tells you that because he thinks he found some flaws in climate change models he is just going to carry on decorating your house, because there is no point doing anything unless every scientist in the world agrees with him. That's pretty much the United States' position on pollution.

I find it quite funny the ones on the forum who smear the most fail to list what country they reside in.

[free_electron]

On the subject of fiery vehicular fun, does anyone have a good historical source on fires/splosions (Michael Bay badaboom) in the early days of the combustion engine?

To what purpose? EVs are just as old as cars with a combustion engine.

older ! first 'cars' were electric. There was a famous belgian that set a couple of record with the 'La jamais contente' : First vehicle to hit 100Km/h. And that was a full electric !

[zapta]

older ! first 'cars' were electric. There was a famous belgian that set a couple of record with the 'La jamais contente' : First vehicle to hit 100Km/h. And that was a full electric !

That's a nice looking car

[MacAttak]

In this particular case it isn't clear that the suspect wouldn't have been driving that recklessly whether they were being tailed or not.

Ah, the classic American argument towards carrying on with the status quo. It's the same one used against cleaning up pollution - never mind the indisputable benefits to health, the environment and the economy, because there is this tiny sliver of doubt that just maybe climate change models are slightly off let's just carry on spewing shit everywhere until absolute 100% undeniable proof is available.

Maybe 1 in 100 people will carry on driving like maniacs. Maybe 1 in 10 will. That's still a 90% improvement in safety.

I'm not making a generalization here. I'm saying that in THIS SPECIFIC INSTANCE the guy seemed hell-bent on doing damage and it didn't matter if he was being tailed or not.

I'm not arguing against the policy of the police never engaging in high-speed chases since there is plenty of surveillance technology available to make the arrest more safely and discreetly. I'm simply making an observation that in this instance I don't think it would have mattered either way. He wasn't speeding for the sake of avoiding the law. He was speeding for the sake of speeding.

I fail to see the link you are drawing to pollution and climate change denialism.

[MacAttak]

They continued at suicidal speeds for quite a distance. 10 miles through surface streets (even a relatively wide one like that) is a really long time to keep that kind of speed up.

Do some math: at 100Mph it takes only 6 minutes to do 10 miles. If you need to wait for 6 minutes that is a long time but in a stressful situation that amount of time passes 'in a blink of an eye'. Judging from the damage they must have driven even faster.

I realize that 6 minutes is not a long span of time under usual circumstances. But when we are talking about driving through those particular areas with an average speed in excess of 100 mph, then simply surviving for 6 minutes is amazing in and of itself. These are surface streets in L.A., with frequent intersections and stoplights. He would have had to run through many of them to retain that average speed. This was also about 1:30 on the eve of July 4th. The streets would NOT have been very clear from traffic. The nights of the 3rd and 4th are notoriously dangerous times to be out driving because of the high proportion of drunks on the road.

[tjb1]

I find it quite funny the ones on the forum who smear the most fail to list what country they reside in.

I can't be bothered to change it as I move back and forth. You can't have two so... Anyway, what does it matter? Unless you were planning an ad hominem attack on me it isn't relevant.

Ah well I am pretty sure I can narrow it down to the United Kingdom or surrounding area, to be expected with all your anti-America talk.  Typical bigot that is an expert in all international affairs, lives in a perfect country, and does no wrong.  I find it fascinating how these arm chair experts know the solutions to all of the world problems.

[zapta]

I can't be bothered to change it as I move back and forth. You can't have two so...

Yes, this is a technical limitation.

BTW you can mention it here if you like.

Anyway, what does it matter?

If you are from North Korea for example it will explain your attitude toward  the US.

[nctnico]

I find it quite funny the ones on the forum who smear the most fail to list what country they reside in.

I can't be bothered to change it as I move back and forth. You can't have two so... Anyway, what does it matter? Unless you were planning an ad hominem attack on me it isn't relevant.

Ah well I am pretty sure I can narrow it down to the United Kingdom or surrounding area, to be expected with all your anti-America talk.  Typical bigot that is an expert in all international affairs, lives in a perfect country, and does no wrong.  I find it fascinating how these arm chair experts know the solutions to all of the world problems.

This remark doesn't help your country to climb higher on this list: http://www.statisticbrain.com/countries-with-the-highest-lowest-average-iq/

[dannyf]

countries-with-the-highest-lowest-average-iq/

Anyone believing in IQ cannot have above-average IQ.

[zapta]

This remark doesn't help your country to climb higher on this list: http://www.statisticbrain.com/countries-with-the-highest-lowest-average-iq/

Hmm, a my-country-is-better-than-yours argument. How refreshing.

I appreciate that my countrymen on these forums take the high road and refrain in general from trashing other people countries.

[miguelvp]

It's ok, he might be mad about the game today, maybe it's our fault too.
Not that the Netherlands have any ownership on multinationals or anything and not that it's the number one Edit: one of the top, tax havens for all multinationals. Nah, we are the evil ones everyone knows that

Edit: The only difference is that our puppeteers are more oligarchic than your puppeteers.

[HackedFridgeMagnet]

Please lets not get too nationalistic or too anti this or that nation.
This was actually an interesting topic, maybe we should get back too it.

[tjb1]

I find it quite funny the ones on the forum who smear the most fail to list what country they reside in.

I can't be bothered to change it as I move back and forth. You can't have two so... Anyway, what does it matter? Unless you were planning an ad hominem attack on me it isn't relevant.

Ah well I am pretty sure I can narrow it down to the United Kingdom or surrounding area, to be expected with all your anti-America talk.  Typical bigot that is an expert in all international affairs, lives in a perfect country, and does no wrong.  I find it fascinating how these arm chair experts know the solutions to all of the world problems.

This remark doesn't help your country to climb higher on this list: http://www.statisticbrain.com/countries-with-the-highest-lowest-average-iq/

Oh wow, 4 whole points, better call home about that!

Maybe you should look at the population, the US population is 18.7 times higher than that of the Netherlands as of 2012.  The only other country with a comparable population, although much higher, is China who has an average that is 2 whole points above.

[HackedFridgeMagnet]

This remark doesn't help your country to climb higher on this list: http://www.statisticbrain.com/countries-with-the-highest-lowest-average-iq/

It's ironic that the 'country ' with the top IQ, Hong Kong, isn't even a country.
Go back to school I say.

[zapta]

It's nice that we keep ourselves busy until the next Tesla fire.

[free_electron]

It's nice that we keep ourselves busy until the next Tesla fire.

Yes, because time between gasoline fires it too short to get anything done. In the time you read this another one went woof.

[zapta]

It's nice that we keep ourselves busy until the next Tesla fire.

Yes, because time between gasoline fires it too short to get anything done. In the time you read this another one went woof.

Dog bite man = no news.

[MacAttak]

This was actually an interesting topic, maybe we should get back too it.

Good idea. The stupid personal attacks in this thread are getting far too annoying.

It appears that the driver of that last one actually did die after being kept alive for a few days at Cedar Sinai. I've still not seen anything that gives information about the break-in itself (why weren't the keys in a safe?) nor why he continued to drive the way he did for several miles through urban surface streets after the police stopped pursuing.

http://parklabreanewsbeverlypress.com/news/2014/07/driver-of-stolen-tesla-dies-after-crash-on-la-brea/

Pretty amazing that he didn't die instantly although I don't know how much of that is accreditable to the car's safety construction versus how "lucky" he got when ejected from it. ("lucky" being a relative term of course, since in the end he did indeed die)