General > General Technical Chat
Moore's Law Continues
<< < (4/5) > >>
mawyatt:

--- Quote from: TimFox on October 31, 2023, 04:11:20 pm ---
--- Quote from: Someone on October 31, 2023, 06:39:35 am ---
--- Quote from: TimFox on October 30, 2023, 09:27:34 pm ---There are lots of other practical problems with charged-particle optics, especially aberrations, but electron microscopes had achieved spatial resolution better than 1 nm more than 50 years ago.
--- End quote ---
Imaging resolution /= machining resolution. 10nm feature size is pretty tough on a FIB and as above, veeeeerrrryyyyy sssssllllllooooowwwwwwwwww.

--- End quote ---

< 1 nm resolution was obtained in scanning transmission electron microscopes (STEM) around 1970, which is a similar problem to machining resolution.

--- End quote ---

Isn't that "Tunneling" rather than Transmission?

Recall IBM used a similar scanning "probe" technique to spell IBM with individual Xeon atoms!!

https://cen.acs.org/analytical-chemistry/imaging/30-years-moving-atoms-scanning/97/i44

Best,
coppice:

--- Quote from: mawyatt on October 31, 2023, 11:49:10 pm ---
--- Quote from: TimFox on October 31, 2023, 04:11:20 pm ---
--- Quote from: Someone on October 31, 2023, 06:39:35 am ---
--- Quote from: TimFox on October 30, 2023, 09:27:34 pm ---There are lots of other practical problems with charged-particle optics, especially aberrations, but electron microscopes had achieved spatial resolution better than 1 nm more than 50 years ago.
--- End quote ---
Imaging resolution /= machining resolution. 10nm feature size is pretty tough on a FIB and as above, veeeeerrrryyyyy sssssllllllooooowwwwwwwwww.

--- End quote ---

< 1 nm resolution was obtained in scanning transmission electron microscopes (STEM) around 1970, which is a similar problem to machining resolution.

--- End quote ---

Isn't that "Tunneling" rather than Transmission?

Recall IBM used a similar scanning "probe" technique to spell IBM with individual Xeon atoms!!

https://cen.acs.org/analytical-chemistry/imaging/30-years-moving-atoms-scanning/97/i44

Best,

--- End quote ---
STEM - scanning tunnelling electron microscope. Maybe he mistyped.
Someone:

--- Quote from: TimFox on October 31, 2023, 10:55:53 pm ---
--- Quote from: Someone on October 31, 2023, 10:53:37 pm ---
--- Quote from: TimFox on October 31, 2023, 04:11:20 pm ---
--- Quote from: Someone on October 31, 2023, 06:39:35 am ---
--- Quote from: TimFox on October 30, 2023, 09:27:34 pm ---There are lots of other practical problems with charged-particle optics, especially aberrations, but electron microscopes had achieved spatial resolution better than 1 nm more than 50 years ago.
--- End quote ---
Imaging resolution /= machining resolution. 10nm feature size is pretty tough on a FIB and as above, veeeeerrrryyyyy sssssllllllooooowwwwwwwwww.
--- End quote ---
< 1 nm resolution was obtained in scanning transmission electron microscopes (STEM) around 1970, which is a similar problem to machining resolution.
--- End quote ---
Restating what you already said doesnt add much if anything. You might think they are similar, but care to share references to single digit nm machining ? Like with lithography the actual resolution achievable is variable depending on the design geometry and not able to be summed up as a single readily comparable number.

--- End quote ---
Don't be a jerk.  I was clarifying my earlier statement.  I was near the lab that achieved that resolution with an STEM, but I am unfamiliar with nm machining.
--- End quote ---
So what did you add?
50 years ago vs 1970's
better than 1 nm vs < 1 nm

At least we now know you are unfamiliar with machining.
TimFox:
As I stated in my post, I was referring to the Scanning Transmission Electron Microscope, which pre-dates the tunneling microscope (developed in 1981).
It is an example of how fine a focus could be achieved with a 100 keV electron beam over 50 years ago.
mawyatt:
Interesting was only aware of the Tunneling version!!

Best,
Navigation
Message Index
Next page
Previous page
There was an error while thanking
Thanking...

Go to full version
Powered by SMFPacks Advanced Attachments Uploader Mod