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New UK plan "could spell end of throwaway culture" (BBC News)
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MK14:

--- Quote from: TomS_ on March 15, 2020, 07:20:35 am ---
--- Quote from: MK14 on March 11, 2020, 04:56:08 am ---E.g. Rules insisting on having tyre pressure monitoring in cars, means each tyre sensor has a battery (4, one for each wheel), which can cost a small fortune, to get replaced, every e.g. 5 years.

--- End quote ---

Tyre pressure monitoring doesnt have to be done with active sensors in the wheels. It can also be done using existing sensors such as those used for ABS, although I have seen it done with some little doodad boxes that mount somewhere around the wheels.

--- End quote ---

I actually, looked quite extensively into it, some time ago.

Some companies, such as Honda, with their Honda Accord. Have indeed used the wheel speed (ABS) sensors, to check that the tyre pressures are ok. But, unfortunately, it turns out that it has not been that easy or reliable (if I remember correctly), to use that method to check the tyre pressures and/or it was too much effort, as regards the software (I can't remember the details, but it wasn't good news).

The complaints for some vehicles are that the batteries (in many cases, these are NOT replaceable) run out at around the 5 year mark. Some manufacture's, charge (from memory), £500 (or some big amount), to change all 4 tyre pressure sensors. Then in another 5 years time, the same thing will happen.
Some people are furious, that they can't just change the batteries themselves, for a few pounds (e.g. if they took CR2032 etc). You can't just ignore it, because cars in the UK, over 3 years old, have to have annual safety checks (called MOTs), which check that many of the warning lights DON'T turn on (but do, when you cycle the ignition off/on).
That's why I really like the idea of using (potentially maintenance free) ABS wheel speed sensors, but was disappointed, because it seems to be, being phased out.

N.B. I haven't looked into this issue for a while, so maybe the situation has changed.
bd139:

--- Quote from: TomS_ on March 15, 2020, 07:20:35 am ---
--- Quote from: MK14 on March 11, 2020, 04:56:08 am ---E.g. Rules insisting on having tyre pressure monitoring in cars, means each tyre sensor has a battery (4, one for each wheel), which can cost a small fortune, to get replaced, every e.g. 5 years.

--- End quote ---

Tyre pressure monitoring doesnt have to be done with active sensors in the wheels. It can also be done using existing sensors such as those used for ABS, although I have seen it done with some little doodad boxes that mount somewhere around the wheels.

--- End quote ---

The ones on my car use indirect TPMS ie by measuring relative axle rotation.  It does go loopy every 500 or so miles and tell you that you have a flat tyre but it worked very quickly when I did have one. Not much to go wrong on that!
SilverSolder:

--- Quote from: bd139 on March 15, 2020, 09:41:57 am ---
--- Quote from: TomS_ on March 15, 2020, 07:20:35 am ---
--- Quote from: MK14 on March 11, 2020, 04:56:08 am ---E.g. Rules insisting on having tyre pressure monitoring in cars, means each tyre sensor has a battery (4, one for each wheel), which can cost a small fortune, to get replaced, every e.g. 5 years.

--- End quote ---

Tyre pressure monitoring doesnt have to be done with active sensors in the wheels. It can also be done using existing sensors such as those used for ABS, although I have seen it done with some little doodad boxes that mount somewhere around the wheels.

--- End quote ---

The ones on my car use indirect TPMS ie by measuring relative axle rotation.  It does go loopy every 500 or so miles and tell you that you have a flat tyre but it worked very quickly when I did have one. Not much to go wrong on that!

--- End quote ---

I have a car with indirect TPMS as well.   One thing it doesn't work well with, is when all the wheels are low at the same time!   :D
bd139:
That's a good point! I check mine anyway once a month. It's mostly supposed to identify outlying conditions.
tooki:

--- Quote from: AndyC_772 on March 14, 2020, 03:38:43 pm ---My phone+case is already between 2 and 3 times as thick as the phone itself; thinness as a figure of merit has become silly.

--- End quote ---
I agree. I'd rather have a few more mm of thickness in return for 2 or 3 day battery life.


--- Quote from: AndyC_772 on March 14, 2020, 03:38:43 pm ---The number of early deaths due to water ingress through the battery compartment would have to be weighed against the number saved by being (easily) opened and dried straight away. If you can't make a phone competely water tight - and most aren't - the next best thing you can do is make it trivial to remove the battery, open the case, and dry out the PCB immediately. This is something that's possible with a product designed for serviceability, but if your laptop or phone is glued together, forget it.

--- End quote ---
Umm… for years (in the pre-smartphone days), cellphones all had removable batteries, but almost none were waterproofed, and drowned phones were commonplace. A battery compartment allows excellent water ingress to the innards of the phone, but no meaningful access to said drowned innards. (Your argument of opening the case — as in, unscrewing to get into the "no user serviceable parts inside" part of the device — is irrelevant to 99% of people, who have neither the skill nor tools to open small electronics. A waterproof phone is far better for a consumer than a non-waterproofed one that a technician can rescue. What's at issue is customer-facing battery compartments, and those add more water risk than they eliminate.) Remember, consumer electronics companies are designing their products for regular consumers, not for electronics technicians capable of doing water remediation and rework.


--- Quote from: AndyC_772 on March 14, 2020, 03:38:43 pm ---I don't doubt that manufacturers would cry "safety" if compelled to make batteries removable, but that's a reason to come up with a safer form factor for the battery, not to continue designing in obsolescence. If batteries for laptops and power tools can have embedded contacts that are protected from accidental contact, so can phones.

--- End quote ---
Look at the battery connectors on those types of devices: they're gigantic. And the batteries are in gigantic rugged cases. None of that is compatible with a pocketable phone. And as I said, the other big thing about batteries is making it hard for people to get counterfeit or other low-quality aftermarket batteries. This has, at times, been a significant safety issue for camera makers, with aftermarket batteries catching fire and stuff. But people keep their phones on their body. If suddenly, a third of phones out there have questionable batteries inside, this would legitimately result in a LOT more injuries.
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