Author Topic: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube  (Read 72943 times)

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duskglow

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #25 on: June 25, 2013, 03:58:04 pm »
Sparky, since he believed that stuff was being deleted from forums, he may have believed that doing it in the right place was futile.

I see things from both points of view here, actually.  I see what Chris is trying to do, I also see the point of his detractors.  He gets points for coming here, though.

Have you guys seen the interview with Jimmy's parents?  He took a 13 year old who loved to play with high voltage under his wing - that kid would have probably killed himself.  Now, true, the interview does come across as just a bit self-aggrandizing, but on the other hand, you can see very clearly what he's trying to accomplish, who his target audience is, and the good he's trying to do.  I don't dismiss him that easily.  I do wish there was a little more accessibility, though.

Everyone has personality flaws, though.
 

duskglow

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #26 on: June 25, 2013, 04:08:26 pm »
I respond  ;D
But then again, I'm a nerd that spends my life on forums  :palm:

Yes you do, and that's one reason I interact here and send you stuff.  You built a forum where I feel like I can ask stupid questions and not get flamed for it, so there's a lot of value to that.
 

Offline maglinvinn

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #27 on: June 25, 2013, 04:08:55 pm »
I am a member of the geek group. 

I could i suppose snark the hell out of most any of these posts, but i'm not going to (which is totally against my nature).

Instead, i'll post my experiences with the group, and let it go from there. 

I joined in Feb 2010, and became almost instantly wrapped into the fold.  For my inquisitive mind, it was in fact 'coming home' of my technologically oriented mind.  At the time, if there were more than 4 people at the lab, it was a party, and an important party, cause 4 people were all that'd show up to even those.  It was very small very familiar and in its own right, quite different from what it is today.

To say that the last 3 years has changed the group, and not just the group, but all the people involved in it, is a vast understatement.  I remember going to the old lab, in a run down part of one of the worst cities in my home state to being allowed into the new lab as one of the first people.  Within 5 minutes of signing, i was one of three people tearing up the floor in MDH because frankly, the awesome could not wait until Chris got there from the realator meeting. 

Dig back a little bit, you'll see me throwing down weekends worth of time tearing into the old jank that was the building and generally juggernauting my way through getting things ready for the new hotness.

Prior to that?  You criticize that the group is a YT thing only and first?  You should have seen behind the scenes when it was a basement thing between the old lab and new.  Cramped hardly covers it.  During that time so many things were lost to theft at the old unsecured building.  More money in copper than what i make in a year was among it.  Donated, to build things, to build awesome, and stolen for some meth addict's fix.  Let me tell you, there was a few number of people turned sour when that became obvious.  I spent a lot of nights working till 4 am at the old building with no heat and no lights in order to tear apart (carefully, and cataloging as i went) with the illustrious Mr. Kidwell main demonstrations.  We would spend the days loading when there were people there to help, and the nights carefully dismantling and staging for the next day.  It was not only hard work, but an incredible learning experience.  I know more about electronics and electricy that i ever imagined possible, and well beyond what i would ever need as 'an average joe'.  It led to me getting one of the best paying jobs in my history, rubbing shoulders with people who graduated MIT and showing them how to install custom hardware and software, and me, a college drop out.  You should have seen their faces when i told them that.  That alone makes the hours grinding away at the labs worth it. 

So now, i got a new job, and a new house, and i don't get to spend as much time at the lab.  I'm a footnote in videos, when they work with metal occasionally, due to my own hobbies.  They're taking what i helped tear down and make ready, and are building the most incredible thing i've frankly ever had the joy to be a part of.  I get to the lab once ever couple months, and aside from the hallways being in the same place, nothing is the same.  Its constantly growing and expanding, and what you don't see on youtube, well, you're missing out.

Meanwhile, the investment of time money and reputation that Chris has put in far outweighs anything i could ever do myself.  I can't spend every day at the lab, its an hour drive away and i gotta pay the bills at home, but even if i could, i could not come close to comparing.  There's a certain amount of charisma and sheer willpower that frankly i use as a source of inspiration when i get a little lazy.   You see someone who's overbearing and bossy.  I see someone who is carving a marble statue from a pile of donated scraps.

I'm three years into my membership, and i have no hard feelings about any and all the time put in.  I may not have a lot of physical stuff to show for it, a shrunken quarter... a 10amp variac for a coil i'm building, a few other nicknacks.  I can't show you what is in my mind though.  I can only tell you about it, and i don't do it justice. 

So instead, i challenge you.  Find the time to come to the lab.  i'll take time out of my schedule to meet you there.  I'd say i'd proove you wrong, but frankly, i wouldn't have to do anything as long as you didn't walk in with a blindfold on. 

You say cult and cultish.  I say rolemodel.  I base my judgement on personal experience, and you base yours on fanboy yt'ery. I see someone touring groups of children around science, letting them touch it, see it, and when they show they're safe enough around it, even play with it.  I watched a 12 year old come in and stop all the conversations cold with his knowledge of things radioactive, while his mother stood there as happy as i've seen a person to find people who are not only knowledgable (about the topic AND the safety around it) but willing to take the time to stop building their own dream and help this kid build his.

Did you read that last sentance slowly and carefully?

To slander and assign names to the group based on off hand and second hand information doesn't do anything helpful for anyone.  I see you guys trying to shame someone who is with their teeth somehow pulling a dream out of impossibility to share science on a scale unheard of with anyone with a passionate desire to learn... and the only person you should try to shame are yourselves.  This thread does nothing but ~attempt~ to devalidate the hours and hours spent working hard to share technology with all people of all ages, and all i gotta do is show this video:

  (25 min) me, first hand, doing demo's for kids.  i've been in the boyscouts and i used to have a job teaching 5th graders after school computers programs.  I"ve never had so many kids absolutely attentative when i talked, and ask so many questions.  I didn't feel like i was making a difference.  I was making a difference.  Find me proof that any of the other hackerspaces have such an incredible response by tomorrow's engineers, and you'll have shown me another hackerspace as awesome as the geek group.

  check out the kid at 4:40.  I haven't seen a kid that profoundly interested in science ... ever.  He couldn't figure out to stand or sit, and spent the rest of the time at the front line, asking and getting interested.  We all should have had such an awesome opportunity as kids.
 

Offline SparkyProjects

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #28 on: June 25, 2013, 04:31:18 pm »
  I do wish there was a little more accessibility, though.

TGG couldn't be more accessible, as Chris mentioned above, live shows morning and evening (local time) where people (not just members) can ask Chris questions via IRC, and he will answer them live.
The IRC is populated with all types of people from all over the world.
Many members have control of the internal workings remotely, Mark above for instance can control the cameras, and he's in Austtralia, i also do some behind the scenes work and i'm in the UK.
Personal visitors to the lab (after making sure they are safe) can 'play' with a Kuka KR350 robot for instance.
And of course the forum, and as i said, providing the posts are within normal community guidelines (like it would be here) then the post will not get deleted, we take any suggestion seriously, and if the suggestion is an improvement that can reasonably be made, it will be done.
 

Offline MadManMarkAu

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #29 on: June 25, 2013, 04:55:21 pm »
As far as being a cult...

Demons OUT!  ;D
 

duskglow

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #30 on: June 25, 2013, 05:14:33 pm »
By accessible, I mean...  at least from the official Geek Group videos, I know very little about Chris.  I know he runs the Geek Group and loves doing geek stuff but that's about it.  I don't know him much as a person, and when I sent him some emails (I know he's a busy guy) telling him how I feel about his project (It was positive, almost gushing) I never got a response.  I don't know if he's married, has kids, whatever.  I don't know him as a *person*.

Yes, there's that other channel and I should seek it out and all my questions might be answered, but at least from his Geek Group videos, he's a personality, not a person.  He projects what I see as a very carefully cultivated image.  I much prefer to interact with people.

When I first found the Geek Group, it was actually a somewhat emotional experience for me.  Here, finally, was a group of people who shared some of the same passions I do - taking stuff apart, building stuff, playing with stuff, just being a geek.  But I actually kind of felt rebuffed in some ways, so I moved on.

All that said, I would love to see a partnership between Dave and Chris.  I think Dave serves a niche that Chris does not and cannot - the REALLY IN DEPTH stuff.  Chris can't explain displacement current and charge pumps.  Dave doesn't want to make his career out of doing autopsies of cheap Chinese toys (I'm guessing).  I think it would be a match made in Atheist heaven. :D
« Last Edit: June 25, 2013, 05:21:38 pm by duskglow »
 

Offline SparkyProjects

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #31 on: June 25, 2013, 05:28:43 pm »
When you have a lot of subscribers etc, and consequently loads of messages and emails, and trying to run the group at the same time, it is not always possible to respond to everyone, it could be that your email was put to one side for a future response and forgotten in the madness.
Even Dave admitted in the last blog that he hasn't kept up with one particular topic.
Chris hasn't been on the forum for a while, but anything that is posted and needs his attention I will make sure he sees it.
Personality, yes, he has done radio work in the past, so his presentation experience for official videos matters, but for his personal blog, you get to see more of the real Chris.
Also, he has mellowed a lot, a bit more laid back (except for official work)

In depth autopsies ?
Dave spends a bit of time checking websites to look up things he doesn't know for sure, Chris and the team don't have time for this, they have other work to do, but to many of the members, it's a good insight to how something works.
Dave and Chris have 2 different niches, and it's good to see diversity.
But even this is changing once the lab is open to the public, there will be more interaction with IRC and livestream where members can do the looking up of info during a shoot.

Chris is not married, doesn't have kids, too busy for a start.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2013, 05:33:50 pm by SparkyProjects »
 

duskglow

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #32 on: June 25, 2013, 05:40:21 pm »
To be clear, I wasn't expecting to be his best friend, but a "thanks for your email, I appreciate it" would have gone a long way - and it wouldn't even have had to have been sent by him.  I sent it to the "info" address.  The impression I got was that because I live in Portland and wasn't ready to donate, that they had no time for me.

That's why I suggested a partnership - I know they have two different niches and I don't think either one would be comfortable doing the other's - but a little crossover would be cool to watch.  I could see it going like this:  "Here's a cheap chinese toy with a voltage doubler... How it works is a little indepth, but if you take a look at this video by Dave Jones he explains it in detail"..   or Dave says "This is a bit elementary for me, but Chris over at The Geek Group autopsied something like this, go check it out if you're interested."

 

Offline MadManMarkAu

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #33 on: June 25, 2013, 05:51:40 pm »
I get what you're saying... I've seen this done before with channels like Veritasium, SmarterEveryDay and Numberphile.
 

Offline ChrisBoden

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #34 on: June 25, 2013, 06:13:09 pm »
Dusk, I'm really sorry about that. I do get an insane amount of emails from guys like you, and I do try to reply to them all but it's simply impossible. I don't have an agent or a staff of people who fake my autographs, etc. I try to reach out to everyone at least to say "Hi" and sometimes I just cock it up. Sincerely, I apologize.

The image on the Group official channel is very tight, but it's not much of a personality. I'm a truly terrible actor, so I don't even try. They turn the camera on, edit out the swearing, and we post it. The official channel is the only one with any real editing. The live shows and the blogs are all absolutely factual.

As far as knowing things about me personally, well, what would you like to know? I spend my life in front of a camera or on a stage, and I run a company with other people's money, I don't have any secrets, feel free to ask me anything you wish and I'll be happy to answer it here in front of everyone.

As far as doing a partnership with Dave, I'd be honoured to meet him, or you for that matter. Come on over and say Hi sometime.
 

Offline jamesp15

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #35 on: June 25, 2013, 06:14:45 pm »
I love the IDEA of the Geek Group.

(before reading below, I have only watched a few of the autopsies, not any of the other stuff from there.)
A tiny bit of background on me: In my free time I teach local kids and even adults that live in my area electronics and _proper_ use of tools and all forms of safety, I am very much a supporter of getting people interested and started in these fields. 
I have seriously considered donating money (to TGG) and possibly equipment (getting my employer to and some of my own stuff) in the past, but the whole impression I got from the autopsy videos was more akin to "amateur hour" than something serious.  Which is not something I want to support (along with the seeming attitude that Chris Boden has).

I am probably not the target audience for the channel but I have watched a few of the "teardowns"/"autopsies" they have done, and I walk away with a not so good impression, especially in what they may be trying to "teach".

He seems to have no idea how to use most tools, incorrect techniques and such.   
He seems to have no real basic awareness of how the thing he is about to take apart works in some cases and the constant "oh yeah, i see now" doesn't go a long way to inspire confidence in what he is saying is actually whats happening/being done in the device. (for the crowd that "doesnt know" and is being shown or "taught". )
If you have time to shoot a segment about a given product, you surely have 10 minutes or so to learn the fundamentals or ideas behind how something works before shooting it? 

Or is the "see I am learning as I go!" the whole idea, in which case the channel definitely isn't targeted towards "me".


 

Offline maglinvinn

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #36 on: June 25, 2013, 06:31:19 pm »
The only problem i have with that is that one person can't be expected to know it all.  Instead of say, here at EEV, where all things are electronics, the geek group has a variety of very talented people in different fields, and the space at the lab for those fields, to allow those people to explore and learn, and most importantly share.  The autopsy videos are a very small amount of the videos made by the group.  The woodworking videos are particularly entertaining, even though i don't see myself doing any bowl making.  Meanwhile, iscarr rick is one of the smartest people i know, and just being inthe same space as him has taught me things about machining... the videos only serve as a way to share that with the rest of the world. 

This is kinda like saying that photonic induction is a guy who throws bricks into washers.  What about his HV experiments?  nope.  brick. washer.  hasn't done anything else.

Furthermore, make a suggestion on what videos you'd like to see.  I've seen a number of videos come out simply because someone expressed an interest.
 

duskglow

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #37 on: June 25, 2013, 06:33:18 pm »
jamesp15, I think to be fair to Chris, I don't think he's trying to be the expert.  The Geek Group seems to be about discovery, and it's cool to watch him discover along with his audience.  I don't think he really completely knows what he's doing, but he doesn't have to - that's not the point.  I'll find and link a video that gives a better idea of where he's coming from.  He knows enough to not get killed.  But watching them trying to figure that monitor out was hilarious.

Chris, thanks for the apology, I appreciate it.  If I'm in the Grand Rapids area I'll certainly come around, it would be nice to meet you, if possible.  Thanks for coming by and engaging, even if this is something of a harsh thread.  Engineers can be that way. :)
 

duskglow

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #38 on: June 25, 2013, 06:35:54 pm »


This is a video that I found VERY enlightening - it was the video that gave me an insight into what Chris is really trying to accomplish.  I've seen videos with Jimmy in them - that is a kid that really does need to be reigned in - he'd probably stick a screwdriver into a flyback if someone wasn't there to stop him.  Chris is directing him in a direction that means he'll see his 18th birthday.

This is the video that helped me to understand who his target audience is, why he's doing it, and what he's hoping to accomplish.  At least partly, anyway.   The high production values kind of turned me off, it felt a bit self-aggrandizing, but it was still a good video even in spite of all that.
 

Offline SparkyProjects

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #39 on: June 25, 2013, 07:35:46 pm »
As the video above was an 'Official' video, it had to be presented in a clear way, and answer not just the questions that couple had, but questions other parents may have.
It's reassurance to parents that anyone with little knowledge can be mentored by respected members of the group, even remote members.
About 4 years ago i knew what a Tesla coil was, but wasn't sure about building them, even though i had 'messed about' with burner transformers as part of my job, and now i spend a lot of time taking newbies step by step if needed so they can understand about how it works, and the safety measures involved.
The main target might be young teens, but the secondary target is anyone else, especially the parents of the young teens, so they too can understand what ther child is doing.
 

Offline jamesp15

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #40 on: June 25, 2013, 08:36:17 pm »
I guess that I am just not in the target audience.

I dont expect expert level knowledge or someone to "know it all", but gathering some basic knowledge or research going into the teardown would help with the overall experience IMO.  But I am just some guy on the internet and thats just my opinion.  I know there is more content than the autopsies on there, but they are the only thing that they do that interested me in any way...

The idea behind it all I am all for and help in any way I can with local groups/people on my own time and costs.   I just have issues with their (The Geek Group) implementation of the small  part of it that I see.
 

Offline expertmax1Topic starter

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #41 on: June 25, 2013, 10:32:01 pm »
I knew it ! People from The Geek Group subscribed only to reply to this topic ! Now you see what I mean ?

The Geek Group is a sect, reaching people who are into electronics and science who wants to feel accepted and then they are addicted to the club and they are bossed by Chris, then they don't argue because they love the place.

This is my opinion based on facts that I've seen ! I knew it all along ! Why rant on the EEVBlog ? Because I know this is a free-speech forum, thanks Dave for that !
 

duskglow

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #42 on: June 25, 2013, 10:37:29 pm »
Uhh, we brought them into it, would you expect them not to respond?
 

Offline expertmax1Topic starter

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #43 on: June 25, 2013, 10:47:23 pm »
Uhh, we brought them into it, would you expect them not to respond?

Not necessarily ! Usually people respond when they want to make sure to keep something hidden. This is reverse-psychology.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2013, 10:50:14 pm by expertmax1 »
 

duskglow

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #44 on: June 25, 2013, 10:52:38 pm »
So they responded to hide the fact that they're a "sect"/"cult"?

Dude, I grew up in a real honest to gosh doomsday the-world-is-going-to-end-so-send-us-all-your-money cult.  My cultdar is as finely honed as the soldering blade tip I used today.  This ain't no cult.  Generally, when you're in a group, you try not to piss off the dude who organized the whole thing, that's just normal.  Can Chris be overbearing?  I'm sure.  But that doesn't mean that it's a bunch of brainwashed people running around in fear of getting kicked out of the group.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2013, 10:55:04 pm by duskglow »
 

Offline c4757p

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #45 on: June 25, 2013, 10:56:21 pm »
He responded to participate in a discussion and answer questions about himself. Don't be a prick about it and make him regret it.
No longer active here - try the IRC channel if you just can't be without me :)
 

duskglow

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #46 on: June 25, 2013, 10:59:43 pm »
He responded to participate in a discussion and answer questions about himself. Don't be a prick about it and make him regret it.

No matter what one thinks about him and his group, he does deserve credit for this.  He could have just written this whole forum off and stuck to his, created a thread talking smack about us, and started a feud.
 

Offline expertmax1Topic starter

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #47 on: June 25, 2013, 11:02:36 pm »
This is your opinion, I have my opinion and facts. That's it.
 

Offline tinhead

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #48 on: June 25, 2013, 11:04:20 pm »
The Geek Group

was/is and will stay forever one of the biggest ever "waste of time" crap youtube channels ... unless you in the target group, as said here

This is the video that helped me to understand who his target audience is

i will however not spend any time on that, nor my kids (they have to watch SG-1, SGU and BG series; Nat Geo and Hisotry Channel; these are much more useful than such crap youtube channels)
I don't want to be human! I want to see gamma rays, I want to hear X-rays, and I want to smell dark matter ...
I want to reach out with something other than these prehensile paws and feel the solar wind of a supernova flowing over me.
 

Offline SparkyProjects

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Re: Opinions about "The Geek Group" on YouTube
« Reply #49 on: June 25, 2013, 11:05:04 pm »
I knew it ! People from The Geek Group subscribed only to reply to this topic ! Now you see what I mean ?

The Geek Group is a sect, reaching people who are into electronics and science who wants to feel accepted and then they are addicted to the club and they are bossed by Chris, then they don't argue because they love the place.

This is my opinion based on facts that I've seen ! I knew it all along ! Why rant on the EEVBlog ? Because I know this is a free-speech forum, thanks Dave for that !

You are welcome to have your free speech either in the forum, or in IRC during one of the shows.

Cult:
1.A system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object.
2.A relatively small group of people having religious beliefs or practices regarded by others as strange or sinister.


Not necessarily religious in the usual term, but when you follow someone on Youtube like Dave or anyone else, aren't you in a way worshipping them ?
You follow everything they do, you use their teachings as an exmple of how you will live your life.
If you have a youtube channel etc, don't people follow you too ?

 


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