Author Topic: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.  (Read 13095 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline tom66

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 7336
  • Country: gb
  • Electronics Hobbyist & FPGA/Embedded Systems EE
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #100 on: September 01, 2023, 12:49:27 pm »
My guess is they're dunking all of the cars because even a slightly fire damaged new car is an economic write off and doing that limits the chance of later fires.
 

Offline gnuarm

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2247
  • Country: pr
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #101 on: September 01, 2023, 12:53:03 pm »
The video did provide useful (rather, interesting) info. I had no idea something like that trough would be used. And for what? So the video was, in that respect, not too much of a waste of space.

What useful info?  That tubs of water are used for EV fires?  That should be common knowledge for anyone interested in the issue of fire safety.


Quote
As for the commentary, it's surely better than most in that no-one could ever mistake him for being an expert. Any sensible viewer would turn the sound (and captions) off or just ignore it.

I think you are overrating the public.  He is putting together a video, with lots of negative commentary about EVs.  I'm sure many people think he is stating facts.


Quote
No educated guess then?

Guess at what???


Quote
You know, that's how some things are discovered or invented or figured out, by proposing an idea and having it taken apart. Even if the real purpose doesn't crop up (and, frankly, we likely will never know unless someone involved does an AMA on redit), the idea(s) might find a use in different circumstances.

My educated guess is that there were cars on the ferry, including ICE and EVs.  Some of them caught on fire. 

Anything else is not an educated guess, as I've said before.  Guessing is not educated.  An "educated guess" is just a way of saying BS.
Rick C.  --  Puerto Rico is not a country... It's part of the USA
  - Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
  - Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
 

Offline Ranayna

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 986
  • Country: de
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #102 on: September 01, 2023, 02:15:10 pm »
At least one EV has caught fire after or while it was unloaded, according to a short report i read in the newspaper this morning.
The article did not mention the state of the vehicle or the size of the fire, only that it was quickly extinguished.

Might that be the one they dunked in the video?
 

Offline MTTopic starter

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 1687
  • Country: aq
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #103 on: September 02, 2023, 03:24:01 pm »
Your favorite Aussie bitching about the bathtub, the EV,s the batteries and stinking electric hell!  ;D

 

Offline gnuarm

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2247
  • Country: pr
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #104 on: September 02, 2023, 04:28:47 pm »
Why would anyone want to listen to his drivel?
Rick C.  --  Puerto Rico is not a country... It's part of the USA
  - Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
  - Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
 

Offline nctnico

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 28429
  • Country: nl
    • NCT Developments
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #105 on: September 02, 2023, 05:04:50 pm »
Why would anyone want to listen to his drivel?
I can't think of any good reason so don't ask me.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 
The following users thanked this post: tom66

Offline tom66

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 7336
  • Country: gb
  • Electronics Hobbyist & FPGA/Embedded Systems EE
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #106 on: September 02, 2023, 07:34:11 pm »
Why would anyone want to listen to his drivel?

His whole shtick is to take genuine comments/criticisms of his prior videos, voice them in some kind of silly high pitched voice, and then tear one or two points apart without really looking at the rest of the comment.  No time for him any more - was a shame, used to enjoy John's videos - might watch something he actually understands rather than just fear mongers over.
 

Offline vad

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 518
  • Country: us
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #107 on: September 03, 2023, 03:29:27 am »
Why would anyone want to listen to his drivel?
Because, unlike Sal Mercogliano from 'What’s Going On With Shipping', the former mariner and firefighter, who is described by some members here as a pathetic author with no clue about ship fires, this guy is a true engineer, has a good sense of humor, and speaks a marvelous Aussie accent. You should really listen to him.
 

Offline gnuarm

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2247
  • Country: pr
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #108 on: September 03, 2023, 05:14:08 am »
Why would anyone want to listen to his drivel?
Because, unlike Sal Mercogliano from 'What’s Going On With Shipping', the former mariner and firefighter, who is described by some members here as a pathetic author with no clue about ship fires, this guy is a true engineer, has a good sense of humor, and speaks a marvelous Aussie accent. You should really listen to him.

I absolutely have tried.  But I just can't get past the innuendo and many faceted implications, in the place of actual facts. 

I'm willing to bet, that if someone watched the entire video, they could condense the factual content to less than a minute. 

Why did you mention Sal Mercogliano?  How did he get into the conversation???
Rick C.  --  Puerto Rico is not a country... It's part of the USA
  - Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
  - Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
 

Offline nctnico

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 28429
  • Country: nl
    • NCT Developments
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #109 on: September 03, 2023, 09:16:19 am »
Why would anyone want to listen to his drivel?
Because, unlike Sal Mercogliano from 'What’s Going On With Shipping', the former mariner and firefighter, who is described by some members here as a pathetic author with no clue about ship fires, this guy is a true engineer, has a good sense of humor, and speaks a marvelous Aussie accent. You should really listen to him.
If he where a true engineer, he had a good paying job. But instead he is on Youtube making video with lots of talk and little content. A real engineer sees & hears that right of the bat. I put zero value on John Cadogan's videos.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2023, 09:19:28 am by nctnico »
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 
The following users thanked this post: tom66

Online Psi

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 10385
  • Country: nz
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #110 on: September 03, 2023, 09:21:53 am »
He does raise some valid points from time to time, but he's always taking things people say to an extreme (that they did not intend) just so he can crap all over what they said and make a clickbait/psudo-entertaining video. 

Reminds me of thunderfoot sometimes.

I think his anti-EV stuff is probably hurting EV adoption somewhat.
He's always focusing on the downsides of current battery tech and ignoring that actual goal.
To get the electric vehicle industry up and running and getting all the infrastructure sorted and issues ironed out. Transitioning an electric car from one energy storage source to a newer/better one is dead simple!
Starting up an entire new EV industry has a lot of lag time so it's best to get started now, better/safer batteries are coming.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2023, 09:32:32 am by Psi »
Greek letter 'Psi' (not Pounds per Square Inch)
 

Offline nctnico

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 28429
  • Country: nl
    • NCT Developments
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #111 on: September 03, 2023, 10:13:23 am »
He does raise some valid points from time to time, but he's always taking things people say to an extreme (that they did not intend) just so he can crap all over what they said and make a clickbait/psudo-entertaining video. 

Reminds me of thunderfoot sometimes.

I think his anti-EV stuff is probably hurting EV adoption somewhat.
I don't think so. There is only a tiny fraction of the entire world population watching his videos. Go out on the street and ask random people if they know John's Youtube channel or ever heard about thunderfoot (another Youtuber I put zero value on) and you'll find that nobody knows these channels.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline dietert1

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2473
  • Country: br
    • CADT Homepage
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #112 on: September 03, 2023, 10:32:41 am »
In my opinion the whole story is fake, beginning with the title of this thread.
1) That ship had mainly conventional vehicles plus a small fraction of electrical cars.
2) No details are known why there was a fire nor how it stopped.

I guess somebody pays for confusing and manipulating people. Please stop it.

Regards, Dieter
 

Offline PlainName

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 7509
  • Country: va
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #113 on: September 03, 2023, 11:33:53 am »
Quote
nor how it stopped

Exothermic reaction ran out of therms.
 
The following users thanked this post: karpouzi9

Offline vad

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 518
  • Country: us
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #114 on: September 03, 2023, 01:16:57 pm »
Why did you mention Sal Mercogliano?  How did he get into the conversation???

I thought this was your comment:

This guy is pretty pathetic… He seems to be pretty much an idiot.
 

Offline nctnico

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 28429
  • Country: nl
    • NCT Developments
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #115 on: September 03, 2023, 02:00:45 pm »
Quote
nor how it stopped

Exothermic reaction ran out of therms.
But it is interesting to find out why the car they pulled out of the wreck started to smoke again. I can't think of any mechanism that makes something like that possible with an ICE car which is submerged in water. OTOH with an EV there is stored energy in the battery that doesn't need anything from the outside (like an oxidizer) to be released.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline PlainName

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 7509
  • Country: va
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #116 on: September 03, 2023, 05:28:13 pm »
It started to smoke in the water (assuming that's what was in the trough - I am sure someone will say we can't discuss that without an official analysis). Maybe it was a bit hot when they pulled it out, but they sure didn't look too concerned until it was dumped in the trough. Since the battery would presumably form part of the chassis, I would have thought it would be reasonably waterproof. But perhaps there's a difference between water thrown up from the road and water pretending to be passengers.
 

Offline Bud

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 7276
  • Country: ca
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #117 on: September 03, 2023, 06:02:11 pm »
Which brings an interesting observation: plenty of videos out there on floodings where people drive their cars and trucks half submerged in water. I guess you should not try that with EVs.
Facebook-free life and Rigol-free shack.
 

Offline gnuarm

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2247
  • Country: pr
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #118 on: September 03, 2023, 07:20:41 pm »
Which brings an interesting observation: plenty of videos out there on floodings where people drive their cars and trucks half submerged in water. I guess you should not try that with EVs.

Why?
Rick C.  --  Puerto Rico is not a country... It's part of the USA
  - Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
  - Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
 

Offline tom66

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 7336
  • Country: gb
  • Electronics Hobbyist & FPGA/Embedded Systems EE
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #119 on: September 03, 2023, 09:14:15 pm »
Which brings an interesting observation: plenty of videos out there on floodings where people drive their cars and trucks half submerged in water. I guess you should not try that with EVs.

If anything, an EV is better in water.  The risk is getting the water in the battery pack, but that would only happen if the vehicle was submersed for some time; the packs are sealed generally quite well.  There is no air intake or exhaust on an EV, so as long as the wheels are still on the road, it should be OK from an electrical perspective.

On Tesla packs, water eventually gets into the pack via the rebreathers which equalise pressure in the pack.  This only occurs when the water gets into the cabin, at which point other things are likely broken in the car.

Of course, cars are not boats, and people are notoriously bad at estimating depth.  In general, it's a bad idea to drive through any deep water unless you are absolutely certain of the depth.

https://youtu.be/watch?v=cBYFo6fXPvU
 

Offline nctnico

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 28429
  • Country: nl
    • NCT Developments
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #120 on: September 04, 2023, 08:31:48 pm »
Of course, cars are not boats, and people are notoriously bad at estimating depth.  In general, it's a bad idea to drive through any deep water unless you are absolutely certain of the depth.
Unless it is an Amphicar (recently I've seen one for real!) or a Lada. Back when I just got my driver's license my parents owned a Lada. At some point I was driving on a large parking lot and there was a big pool of water. So I got the idea to drive through it with the car like kids do with a bike. Well, you where right that people suck at gauging depths (actually, you can't see the depth). The water splahed up so high went over the car. Fortunately is was a Lada  >:D I never tried to do something like that ever since.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline gnuarm

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2247
  • Country: pr
Re: Out-of-control EV blaze (thermal runaway) threatens to sink massive RORO ship.
« Reply #121 on: September 04, 2023, 09:05:35 pm »
Of course, cars are not boats, and people are notoriously bad at estimating depth.  In general, it's a bad idea to drive through any deep water unless you are absolutely certain of the depth.
Unless it is an Amphicar (recently I've seen one for real!) or a Lada. Back when I just got my driver's license my parents owned a Lada. At some point I was driving on a large parking lot and there was a big pool of water. So I got the idea to drive through it with the car like kids do with a bike. Well, you where right that people suck at gauging depths (actually, you can't see the depth). The water splahed up so high went over the car. Fortunately is was a Lada  >:D I never tried to do something like that ever since.

The real problem with trying to drive through flood waters, is that it only takes a foot or two and the car will simply float and be carried away.  That is very likely to kill everyone in the car, whether or not the motor keeps running.
Rick C.  --  Puerto Rico is not a country... It's part of the USA
  - Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
  - Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209
 


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf