Author Topic: PC 4K 43" monitors  (Read 8591 times)

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Offline PlainName

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #50 on: April 20, 2023, 05:22:37 pm »
Why do you need to see the whole screen at once?
I said that you can view neither of sides decently (unless you move the chair). Therefore only middle of it is decently useable, at which point you could just put a normal monitor instead of that and get the same decently viewable area with advantage of being able to put another decently viewable monitor. I'm talking about big ultrawide monitors with height similar to 27-32" 16:9 ones.

Presumably you've tried this for some time? I don't find a problem seeing the sides (although maybe a curved screen might be instructive). With three previous monitors in an L I could angle the side one a bit, but all that does is fix my head position since moving at all would ruin the arrangement.

With my current monitor I often have three Word windows open side-by-side that fill the full width of the screen. The one I am working in is in the middle and the other two are for reference/searching. Don't have a problem treating any of them equally. In some ways it is better than separate monitors because it doesn't extend so far to the sides (that is, it's as if the entire display setup is moved to the middle, but with no bezel to get in the way).

And just to round things off I do actually have another monitor, a tiny 7" 1280x720, which is perched on the top and carries a calendar plus some performance monitoring gadgets. And I use virtual desktops too :)
 

Offline paulcaTopic starter

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #51 on: April 20, 2023, 06:08:16 pm »
As per the photo, I have TWO ultra-wide's SIDE-BY-SIDE.  5 ft across.

You guys are currently on the left of the left.  (No political pun intended).
Right Left is the 4 Access points browser tabs after a routines reboot.

Left Right and Right Right are blank as I didn't turn it back on after the work laptop shut down.  I'm in "Forty what F**king pence a kWh?" protest mode again.

EDIT:

They are not one flat plain.  The acer has a slight curve, but the two sit at about 15* angle.  All I need to do is rotate my head 15* to be aligned center on each.

I struggle more reaching over to use one of two keyboards too often.  Only just now remembered to move "my" keyboard back to centre and stop "craning".
« Last Edit: April 20, 2023, 06:12:57 pm by paulca »
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Online wraper

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #52 on: April 20, 2023, 11:24:35 pm »
As per the photo, I have TWO ultra-wide's SIDE-BY-SIDE.  5 ft across.
You have monitors so small it does not even make sense to buy ultra wide. You pay more for a 'benefit' of having smaller screen height/area with an oddball resolution.
 
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Online wraper

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #53 on: April 20, 2023, 11:41:11 pm »
Also you should not forget that you get about 18% less of actual screen area when comparing 21:9 with 16:9 aspect ratio monitors with the same "screen size" (diagonal) and much worse for screens with even larger aspect ratio.
 
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Offline paulcaTopic starter

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #54 on: April 21, 2023, 07:50:52 am »
I'm not quite sure how you define "small".  5 feet by 2 feet is not a small screen area by anyones measure.

Your second comment would be true if I didn't already accomodate the aspect.  43" 16:9 is about 10cm wider than a 34" ultrawide.  So it should just slot into place.
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Offline rdl

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #55 on: April 21, 2023, 08:27:14 am »
I only use a single monitor. I feel totally out of date. I think if I used a multi-monitor set up I'd like three. A single 16:9 about 27-30 inch in center, flanked by a smaller one on each side, but in portrait mode. The two side monitors in portrait mode would need to match the height of the main center monitor pretty closely. If somebody made a kit like that I might buy it, if the quality was there.


edit: 27-30 not 27-20
« Last Edit: April 21, 2023, 09:19:33 am by rdl »
 

Offline PlainName

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #56 on: April 21, 2023, 09:20:55 am »
Quote
I think if I used a multi-monitor set up I'd like three. A single 16:9 about 27-20 inch in center, flanked by a smaller one on each side, but in portrait mode.

[note: this is not a 43 x 32 comment]

Main issue with that kind of setup is the limit on window height. My driver for going single monitor, as opposed to the three I already had, was the amount of space stuff like ribbons and that can take. A 4K screen gives you those extra pixels so you no longer care so much about window furniture.

Also, I think power use is a bit less then multi-smaller monitors. Not by an awful lot, but every watt helps.

There is a downside if you use virtual desktops. I used to have mine so the main monitor would switch but the side monitor wouldn't, thus I could switch between, say, two desktops on the main monitor but the peripheral monitors would always stay the same. With the single big screen that's not possible - it is one desktop or another. Mitigating that... you can have both desktops showing at the same time :) As I noted above, I resolved it for me by having a tiny satellite monitor to hold non-virtual stuff, but horse for courses.
 

Offline paulcaTopic starter

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #57 on: April 21, 2023, 11:00:33 am »
Technically, you can split inputs Left and Right on most ultrawide's.  If they support PnP PbP or multi source.  The Acer does support side by side, but the last time I went into those menus I did not have a happy experience. :)
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Online wraper

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #58 on: April 21, 2023, 11:25:19 am »
I'm not quite sure how you define "small".  5 feet by 2 feet is not a small screen area by anyones measure.

Your second comment would be true if I didn't already accomodate the aspect.  43" 16:9 is about 10cm wider than a 34" ultrawide.  So it should just slot into place.
Witdh is almost the same two normal 32" 16:9 monitors would take. I don't see a point in these, as they only make internet browsing and working with documents a pain due to vertical pages. If you want narrower image, you can do that on normal monitors too with black bars on top and bottom. 2ft height you claim makes no sense as it implies 5:4 aspect ratio.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2023, 11:28:00 am by wraper »
 

Offline paulcaTopic starter

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #59 on: April 21, 2023, 12:15:25 pm »
They are 32.5"/82.5cm wide, each.  They are not the same width as a 32".  The 43" is only 5 inches wider.

A monitor showing 2 applications "split" fashion each "browser" or app is: 15.5"x13".   It should be 10.5:9. 

Works for me.  The same on 16:9 doesn't work nearly as well, both apps just look tall and skinny at 8:9 aspect.  Eugh.
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Offline paulcaTopic starter

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #60 on: April 21, 2023, 12:18:17 pm »
A side note.  When you get one of those very high aspect films, presented in something stupid like 10:3 ... you can manually resize the movie player window so it spans both monitors and display it at much close to it's actual aspect.

Of course it looks **** because of the bezels and the off centre angles.
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Offline Kjelt

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #61 on: April 23, 2023, 07:31:46 am »
Home and work at home I have worked over four years with a single 43"
Since half a year I have dual USBC monitor setup 43" and 27"

Work: two 24" monitors and if wanted third laptop screen.

I prefer multiple monitors since I can put MSTeams and Outlook in one monitor. There the "social" interrupt occur.
The 43" for coding is wonderfull to have a better code overview but as stated earlier I wouldgo for a smaller screen next time.

The dual 24" at work I think are a bit too small, what I really like is when I have to compare code which has long lines, at that moment I extend the Bcompare window over both monitors so left monitor shows previous code and right monitor the changed code. That is for me a really good experience.
 

Offline PlainName

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #62 on: April 23, 2023, 09:52:24 am »
Quote
I prefer multiple monitors since I can put MSTeams and Outlook in one monitor.

Yeah, that's a good use case for multiples (I put XMPP chat in my tiny 7" for similar reasons). But I'd much rather go your 43+27 than have two 24s :)
 

Offline paulcaTopic starter

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #63 on: April 23, 2023, 10:10:05 am »
Quote
I prefer multiple monitors since I can put MSTeams and Outlook in one monitor.

Yeah, that's a good use case for multiples (I put XMPP chat in my tiny 7" for similar reasons). But I'd much rather go your 43+27 than have two 24s :)

A normal work day for me:

15" laptop with company teams, outlook, admin.
34" ultra wide with customer dev VM full screen, often with an eclipse open w/ 2 side by side code windows AND all the side panes open.
34" ultra wide with my personal stuff... which could also be a VM with an eclipse, or an eclipse + 2 terminals etc.

The only actually issue I have, other than the constantly using the wrong keyboard or mouse for the two systems, is actually losing the mouse.  I use lithium rechargable batteries in my mice and when they go, there is no warning.  1.5V...1.5V  0.0V.  So I get paranoid and keep thinking the mouse is dead, but then I catch it out of the corner of my eye.  I have increased its size and when I remember I use inverse contrast on it.  I have no resorted to googly-eyes yet!
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Offline paulcaTopic starter

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #64 on: April 23, 2023, 10:14:28 am »
I am keeping 1 x 34" Ultrawide.  Just upgrading one to a 43" 16:9. 

I think two browsers is perfectly useful side of by side.
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Offline PlainName

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #65 on: April 23, 2023, 01:03:34 pm »
Quote
The only actually issue I have, other than the constantly using the wrong keyboard or mouse for the two systems

In a similar situation I've used Input Director ( http://www.inputdirector.com/ ) to use a single keyboard mouse with two (or more) systems. Basically, the mouse can move from one system's screen to the neighbouring screen Just Like That and the mouse/keyboard input follows where the mouse is. Works over the network so no special cabling or connections required.

Logitech seem to do something similar with their recent mice/keyboards, but that's restricted to their products. Input Director works with anything. There's a similar one, Synergy, which I tried but don't use. Since it's derived from some open source stuff, there are two version of this:

https://github.com/symless/synergy-core - the open source core part
https://symless.com/synergy - the commercial version
 

Offline paulcaTopic starter

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #66 on: April 23, 2023, 01:42:40 pm »
The tricky part is the work laptop and the rest of the network are firewalled from each other.  That is to protect both ways.
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Offline SiliconWizard

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #67 on: April 23, 2023, 09:30:11 pm »
So you have a 34" monitor and a 43" one next to it? Looks more like a room at the NASA headquarter than a regular desktop. ;D
 

Offline tkamiya

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #68 on: April 23, 2023, 09:48:44 pm »
I've done this with regular size office desk.  Technically, it worked fine.  Low refresh rate didn't bother me.  But, 43" was just too big.  There has to be so much eye movement, after a month or so, I took it down.

I am now using 32" monitors.  One in front me and another to the side.  Side ones are used to "park" stuff that I want it running but not actively using.  Good luck and have fun.
 
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Offline paulcaTopic starter

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #69 on: April 25, 2023, 09:45:24 am »
So the monitor arrived.  All hooked up.  Like always, new monitors always seem too bright and cold to me.  Always happens, no idea why.

Size:  Yes, it's big.  Sitting beside the 21:9 it's a little wider, but the 21:9 appears to occupy about half the height.  A full screen browser look stupid, tiling it in 4 works brilliantly with the less used at the top.

Picture:  No fuzzies or issues with red text that I can see, but I'm not that fussy.  Looks okay gaming too.  There is a very slightly screen-door effect, but I think it's actually some odd filtering and dithering showing up on upscaled content.

HDR:  Meh.  I tried it, can't get it setup to look normal on an SDR desktop so I switched it back off for now.  It honestly looks like it's reducing the SD content's dynamic range making it look washed out, weak in saturation and too bright.  If you take the SD region slider down so it's not too bright it really looks weak, contrastless and virtually no saturation.  If I turn the NVidia "Digital Vibrance" to 0% the screen is black and white.  I think I need to do some reading up on how to set it up properly, for now it's off, which is anything is too vibrant and could use the Digital Vibrance turned down!

It has working speakers which was a pleasant surprise.  It was missing it's remote (stated in the details of the item), but that's just one less unused monitor remote in a box.

The HP Prodesk mini PC does produce 4K@60FPS on it.  However, watching youtube content at 4K fullscreen even if it's upscaling from 1080p and the CPU/GPU starts to get pretty warm.  It will play content fine, but if you start skipping back and forth, full screen, back to desktop, full screen and so on, the GPU will thermal throttle and frame start to get dropped all over the place.  I took it apart, checked, cleaned the fan, reassemled and sealed up an air leak with captan tape between the fan and cooler.  Hopefully it will hold out.  If not, another 8Gb of RAM and I'll swap it with the server box and put a GTX1030 in it.
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Offline paulcaTopic starter

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #70 on: April 25, 2023, 09:51:32 am »
I think I've figured out the "screen door" effect.  I just noticed it only happens in high saturation areas.  I believe it's chroma resampling 4:2:4 or whatever.  I don't think it has 4K Blue pixels or Red or green.  It has substancially less pure color pixels and so in areas of flatter colours you see a screen door effect.

It's tiny, just something you notice and catches you eye from time to time.
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Offline PlainName

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #71 on: April 25, 2023, 11:13:01 am »
Quote
Sitting beside the 21:9 it's a little wider, but the 21:9 appears to occupy about half the height.

Are they similar DPI? That is, could you move the cursor from one to the other without it skipping up or down?
 

Offline paulcaTopic starter

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #72 on: June 05, 2023, 09:52:53 am »
One observation.  The Phillips panel's power efficiency is pathetic.  It's like an old school monitor of 5-10 years ago.  It runs "hot".  The screen itself is warm to the touch, maybe 35-40*C.

Power draw is around 180W!

Austerity mode:  1xWork Laptop.  1xHP Prodesk. 1xSamsung 34" ultrawide == 85-100W.
Sunny day mode: 1xWork Laptop.   1xGaming PC.  1xPhilips 43" 4k = 300-350W.

I've noticed a few oddities on the philips, like horizontal shadowing.  If you have a high contrast line on one side of teh screen and you move it up and down, you can see a shadow move up and down the other side of the screen.  Not a major issue.

The HDR is very difficult to set up and get right.  It's none HDR mode is too bright for me.  However, if I lower the brightness below the default 50% the colours go out of calibration and greys look pink.  Seems it's a bit fiddly to setup right.
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Online wraper

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #73 on: June 05, 2023, 10:03:58 am »
One observation.  The Phillips panel's power efficiency is pathetic.  It's like an old school monitor of 5-10 years ago.  It runs "hot".  The screen itself is warm to the touch, maybe 35-40*C.
Unless you set different monitors to exactly the same (actual) brightness and and if backlight trickery settings enabled (dynamic brightness, local dimming if available) with the same image, such observation is worthless.
Quote
Austerity mode:  1xWork Laptop.  1xHP Prodesk. 1xSamsung 34" ultrawide == 85-100W.
Sunny day mode: 1xWork Laptop.   1xGaming PC.  1xPhilips 43" 4k = 300-350W.
No shit, what should you expect? Screen with more than 2 times larger screen area consuming the same power as smaller one?
« Last Edit: June 05, 2023, 10:08:23 am by wraper »
 

Offline Bicurico

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Re: PC 4K 43" monitors
« Reply #74 on: June 05, 2023, 10:31:22 am »
To whom it might interest:

I now am using an LG 50" 4K TV as my main monitor, together with a second 22" FullHD monitor for more than 2 months.

The experience has been great and I am actually sad, I did not go this route much sooner.

The external 22" monitor is used for Outlook and for remote calls where I need to share my screen. You do not want to share a 4K resolution screen, as the other parties won't be able to read anything on their FulHD (or less) screens.

The other oddities or less good things:

1) The TV does not have a standby mode as we know it from computer monitors, that switch to standby in the absence of a signal. The TV will instead switch to a default screen, complaining there is no signal. It means that I have to switch off the TV when going for lunch or at the end of the day.
2) The TV will notify me every 4h that it will switch off unless a key on the remote is pressed. This is a bit annoying, but on the other hand, it alerts me that I have been sitting for 4h straight and it is time to do a break.
3) The HDR does not work 100% and I think it is a Windows 11 problem. Sometimes, depending if I open i.e. Chrome, the screen will change brightness and colour space. A bit annoying but not that big of a deal. You get used to it.
4) Some applications insist in starting in full screen mode and you need to minimize them/size them according to needs.

The great about using this TV as the main screen:

1) It is literally as if you had 4x 24" FullHD monitors without the frame in the middle. You get so much desktop space, that you never again need to minimize applications. They all fit!
2) Initially I was worried with having 4 apps each in its corner running in FullHD and how much of a deal it was to get them all in their position. After some days, I naturally stopped worrying about that! I just put the window where I need it with the exact size I need it. There is enough space for everything to fit.
3) Some few applications really benefit from running maximized: I develop manuals in Word and being able to see up to 8 readable pages is amazing. The same for huge Excel sheets.
4) I do work (hobby level mainly) with TV related applications and of course it is great to be able to see a 4K video stream in all its glory.
5) I have not played games so much, but the few I tried are much more immersive if you are sitting at about 1m from a 50" screen.

Some further notes:

My previous graphics card did not have enough memory to benefit from 4K resolution for games. You need a good graphics card to really benefit from the screen. I am using a RTX4070TI.
With 60Hz, the screen refresh rate is perfectly OK for me, perhaps gamers or special application require more than that and in that case, t he screen would not be suitable.
The colours are OK in HDR mode,  including red text or text on red background. That was a bit of an issue without HDR active.

Finally:

Sitting in front such a big screen and so close to it (1m), does cause some strain on your eyes. I use the screen always in might mode (reduces blue light) and even so, I notice some strain after long sessions. But: on my previous setup (which I still have next to me), with 2x FullHD + 1x 1280x1024 screen, had the problem that it was becoming difficult to read the screen.

The same goes with my laptop with a second external screen: To read the laptop screen I need to remove the glasses (too close - I am short sighted and with age I no longer can see at short distance through the glasses), but then I cannot read the external screen (too far away). With the 50" TV I can always see everything with glasses.

The other option would be getting progressive glasses, but those just average the problem: you won't see great neither in short nor long distance, plus I would require much bigger and heavier lenses.

When selecting the screen, consider dpi: do not buy a 4K screen with 32": everything will be too small and with windows scaling you enter a whole new world of problems. Consider the ideal FullHD screen size (i.e. 24") and multiply into a 2x2 grid and you reach a 48" screen. Do measure your desk! In store the TV's seem smaller than they really are. I wanted to buy a 55" screen initially, for bigger text size, but such a TV would not fit!

Regards,
Vitor
« Last Edit: June 05, 2023, 10:39:08 am by Bicurico »
 
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