General > General Technical Chat
Piles of Tesla owners stranded at charge stations abandons their EV's.
nctnico:
1 acre is less than the surface of a soccer field. However, this number likely assumes professional farming using high grade fertilizer and high grade seeds.
Monkeh:
--- Quote from: Dan123456 on January 17, 2024, 11:32:01 pm ---
--- Quote from: tom66 on January 17, 2024, 04:36:44 pm ---
--- Quote from: nctnico on January 17, 2024, 04:06:44 pm ---
--- Quote from: tom66 on January 17, 2024, 03:47:52 pm ---- EV is more sustainable for an itinerant lifestyle (off-the-grid).
--- End quote ---
No. Gasoline cars can run on ethanol which you can make from plants. Same for diesel. For electricity you need some form of generation and batteries. Neither last decades. Keep in mind that there are people driving around in model-T Fords which are over 100 years old. Also, you can't store electricity very long but liquid fuel can be stored much longer so you can drive all year long with an ICE car in case you are living in an area with large seasonal changes in the weather.
--- End quote ---
How large of a field of crops would you need to power one car? I suspect a few solar panels is easier, you only need about 1kW to charge most EVs. Also, not competing between your food and fuel demands is good.
The long term calendar aging of Li-ion batteries is a risk, agreed.
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Surprisingly, the field wouldn’t need to be that big! :)
“Through research performed at Cornell University, we know that 1 acre of land can yield about 7,110 pounds (3,225 kg) of corn, which can be processed into 328 gallons (1240.61 liters) of ethanol. That is about 26.1 pounds (11.84 kg) of corn per gallon.”
https://auto.howstuffworks.com/fuel-efficiency/alternative-fuels/question707.htm
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And if your engine doesn't return the sort of fuel economy expected from a 1970s truck (I'm looking at you, America), that's quite a lot of fuel.
tom66:
--- Quote from: nctnico on January 17, 2024, 08:20:45 pm ---Efficiency is also a point. The German ADAC tested charging efficiency for BEVs from a 230V 16A outlet and measured losses up to 30%.
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Do you have a link to that report? 1.1kW of losses is crazy high for a 3.6kW charger. I measured the loss on my ID.3 at around 350W for a 7.2kW input. I expect it is probably around 200-250W for a 3.6kW input. Most of it is expended on running battery pumps, contactors, computers, fans etc. If the battery heater has to run that's another matter but typically not needed unless well below -10C.
Dan123456:
--- Quote from: nctnico on January 17, 2024, 11:47:27 pm ---1 acre is less than the surface of a soccer field. However, this number likely assumes professional farming using high grade fertilizer and high grade seeds.
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Absolutely agree, my point is the bottom part (~12kg of corn per gallon of fuel) but wanted to keep the whole quote for completeness :)
If I’m in a SHTF situation, I probably only need maybe 20-30 gallons of fuel for my car a year if my house is running off solar :) I’d hardly be road tripping the wastelands :P
Also, again this is in the 20+ year situation where solar panels would have 30+ years of degradation on them :)
In a short term scenario, I would take the EV :)
m98:
--- Quote from: themadhippy on January 17, 2024, 05:01:15 pm ---If the apocalypse involved or caused a large electromagnetic pulse i wouldnt hold much hope of any ev,or any modern vehicle to be much use.
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I wouldn't know where to drive during or after an apocalypse. Realistically, you would get stuck in a giant traffic jam, awaiting anything that happens trapped in your car on a road in the wide, open landscape. Where I live, the escape plan would probably be to grab a knife, a solid pair of boots and . But why are some people making everyday decisions in fear or hope of ending up in Mad-Max?
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