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Piles of Tesla owners stranded at charge stations abandons their EV's.

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EEVblog:

--- Quote from: tom66 on January 19, 2024, 10:49:04 pm ---I don't follow.  People buy a vehicle to suit their use cases... but they aren't going to drive their car just because it cost a lot of money.  I don't take my car out around the block every night to "get my money's worth".  I bought it in part because I have a long commute, and I prefer EVs, and there are environmental benefits...
--- End quote ---

The overall life cycle environmental benefit is questionabale (and probably un-knowable, there are just too many variable). But they certainly have environmental benefits in local air pollution. We literally call our ICE car the "stinky" because of the exhuast. It's amazing the difference you notice between the EV and the ICE. Just sitting there in idle in the drive way the ICE can fill with exhaust fumes. Yet if you don't own an EV you just don't notice the exhaust as you are used to it.
Also obvious benefits in the energy supply chain infrastructure.
Add in the silent ride, the ability to charge at home (from excess solar in my case for zero cost), and the knowledge that regen breaking isn't wasting energy, there is a lot to like about EV's. But they aren't for everyone, and anyone who pushes them as a universal solution to climate change is an idiot.

nctnico:
Recently I rode along in a Tesla and didn't notice it was particulary silent compared to my own car (a relatively cheap model from Ford / Volvo). The last 20 years decent ICE cars have been made very silent. It depends on the brand though. About 15 years ago I drove a Renault diesel and it was absolutely silent; I recall trying hard to hear the engine rev up but failed. Tire noise is dominant and in that respect EVs aren't different.

tom66:

--- Quote from: nctnico on January 19, 2024, 11:46:20 pm ---Recently I rode along in a Tesla and didn't notice it was particulary silent compared to my own car (a relatively cheap model from Ford / Volvo). The last 20 years decent ICE cars have been made very silent. It depends on the brand though. About 15 years ago I drove a Renault diesel and it was absolutely silent; I recall trying hard to hear the engine rev up but failed. Tire noise is dominant and in that respect EVs aren't different.

--- End quote ---

Teslas are not particularly quiet on the inside at highway speeds, the problem really is that Tesla do not spend as much on NVH as other car manufacturers do (at the same price points at least).  The boss has a Model 3 and the company has a Toyota sedan for occasional business use, I would say the Toyota is quieter on motorways, despite having nigh on 180,000 miles on it and being a diesel.

I've been in a few EVs and ICE cars and I would say on the interior they're pretty close once up to speed. With ICE you still have that low rumble from the engine that is difficult to filter out, but the majority of the noise is from air hitting the body and the tyres.

Around the city though at low speeds the lack of acceleration sound is very nice and makes being stuck in slow moving traffic more pleasant.

tom66:

--- Quote from: EEVblog on January 19, 2024, 11:26:32 pm ---
--- Quote from: tom66 on January 19, 2024, 10:49:04 pm ---I don't follow.  People buy a vehicle to suit their use cases... but they aren't going to drive their car just because it cost a lot of money.  I don't take my car out around the block every night to "get my money's worth".  I bought it in part because I have a long commute, and I prefer EVs, and there are environmental benefits...
--- End quote ---

The overall life cycle environmental benefit is questionabale (and probably un-knowable, there are just too many variable). But they certainly have environmental benefits in local air pollution. We literally call our ICE car the "stinky" because of the exhuast. It's amazing the difference you notice between the EV and the ICE. Just sitting there in idle in the drive way the ICE can fill with exhaust fumes. Yet if you don't own an EV you just don't notice the exhaust as you are used to it.
Also obvious benefits in the energy supply chain infrastructure.
Add in the silent ride, the ability to charge at home (from excess solar in my case for zero cost), and the knowledge that regen breaking isn't wasting energy, there is a lot to like about EV's. But they aren't for everyone, and anyone who pushes them as a universal solution to climate change is an idiot.

--- End quote ---

Ehhhh... Yes they're not a universal solution but they are part of the solution.

We're going to have to reduce the impact that transport has on the climate.  Just speaking about the UK, 24% of emissions are due to transport, of which roughly half of that is passenger cars. So approximately 10% of all CO2 emissions in this country due to cars.  And cars are low hanging fruit as electrification goes... Aircraft aren't going electric any time soon, and whilst it'd be nice to have trains, buses and bicycles everywhere, this country was built around the car, so we're going to be driving cars for some time.

There are obviously impacts from manufacturing EV batteries but most studies show that these extra emissions are 'paid off' well within the useful life of the car.  The UK has a pretty clean electricity grid; average emissions of 250gCO2 per kWh put the per-mile CO2 average of an EV at around 60g per mile.  A petrol car is typically 2.5x-3x ignoring refining and exploration emissions.  If the EV is charged on "off-peak" electricity more often, the fraction it emits falls further.

But I'd be lying if that was my primary reason for getting an EV.  After all I'm just one person and still some 98-99% of people drive combustion cars, so it's really not making any significant difference.  I got an EV because... I wanted an electric car, if that makes any sense?  They are nicer to drive as you say, they seem like a better use of energy (to me it's absurd how much of that precious fossil fuel energy we throw away propelling a car inefficiently) and they don't require anywhere near as much maintenance or care as an ICE car.

fourfathom:
Re: cabin noise, perhaps it's just a BMW thing, but some models were so quiet inside that BMW decided to pipe some engine noise into the cabin.  Customers *wanted* to hear that rumble.  Me, I've only got ICE vehicles, but for my last "road trip" car one of the factors in my choice was cabin noise.  I want a quiet ride!

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