Author Topic: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...  (Read 7903 times)

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Offline BravoV

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #200 on: November 07, 2019, 04:15:13 pm »
I was at a grossery store yesterday, paying for my purchases, and there was a guy a couple people  behind me in the line, having the speakerphone turned on on his phone for some reason, and i heard a women screaming on the other end of the call and some little kids crying, and the women frantically screaming "What is going on with this security system!?". The guy kind of tried to calm her down and said "we have to use the app to turn it off".   I thought to myself like  , yeah, i wish you guys luck with your security system.

Poor women screaming louder ... "G'DAMN IT !!! The app says we have not pay the due annual maintenance, and its disabled all access ... "  :-DD

Online bd139

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #201 on: November 07, 2019, 04:34:14 pm »
That's not a security system, that's a poo in an alarm costume :-DD

Good cloud related one I recently encountered. Too loose an IAM configuration allows trendy software to create its own security group rules and expose a 100% unsecured management port on the public internet so it can talk to itself  :palm:. It was there long enough for shodan.io to pick it up as well.
 

Offline Karel

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #202 on: November 09, 2019, 04:50:40 pm »
Not completely the same but related:

Quote
A message appears on your TV: Netflix will no longer be available on this device

[Updated 11/8/19] Netflix has announced that due to technical limitations, as of December 2, 2019, the Netflix streaming service will no longer be
supported on several consumer electronics devices, including some from Samsung. This change will impact select 2010 and 2011 Samsung Smart
TV models that were sold in the U.S. and Canada. Affected devices will receive a notification reflecting this change.

https://www.samsung.com/us/support/troubleshooting/TSG01203568/?CID=afl-ecomm-cjn-cha-092118-52057&cjevent=4c0bfd9a026511ea8052014e0a180512
The difference between theory and practice is less in theory than
the difference between theory and practice in practice.
Expensive tools cannot compensate for lack of experience.
 

Online nctnico

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #203 on: November 09, 2019, 05:57:54 pm »
It is pretty clear to me that the so-called smart TVs are a complete bust. The software simply isn't supported long enough.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 
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Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #204 on: November 09, 2019, 07:03:17 pm »
It is pretty clear to me that the so-called smart TVs are a complete bust. The software simply isn't supported long enough.
You're forced to support the industry though. Finding a decent spec television without the ill-supported smart part is pretty much impossible.
 

Online nctnico

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #205 on: November 09, 2019, 07:24:06 pm »
It is pretty clear to me that the so-called smart TVs are a complete bust. The software simply isn't supported long enough.
You're forced to support the industry though. Finding a decent spec television without the ill-supported smart part is pretty much impossible.
But who needs a television nowadays? Most settop boxes have HDMI out so a PC style monitor will do just fine.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline madires

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #206 on: November 09, 2019, 07:51:07 pm »
It is pretty clear to me that the so-called smart TVs are a complete bust. The software simply isn't supported long enough.
You're forced to support the industry though. Finding a decent spec television without the ill-supported smart part is pretty much impossible.

Fortunately we can use smart TVs without any internet connection. But this may change and we might have to create a login for the manufacturer's cloud for maximizing profit via targeted ads.
 

Offline BravoV

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #207 on: November 09, 2019, 07:57:17 pm »
It is pretty clear to me that the so-called smart TVs are a complete bust. The software simply isn't supported long enough.
You're forced to support the industry though. Finding a decent spec television without the ill-supported smart part is pretty much impossible.
But who needs a television nowadays? Most settop boxes have HDMI out so a PC style monitor will do just fine.

Computer monitors are never made as big as TV, that alone does matter, e.g.: I want to sit lazily on my cozy big long sofa while watching "big" screen from a "distance" thats hanging on the wall.

Online SiliconWizard

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #208 on: November 09, 2019, 08:04:30 pm »
Computer monitors are never made as big as TV, that alone does matter, e.g.: I want to sit lazily on my cozy big long sofa while watching "big" screen from a "distance" thats hanging on the wall.

You can find monitors that are just as big as a TV set. They are unfortunately much more expensive!
 

Offline BravoV

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #209 on: November 09, 2019, 08:06:12 pm »
Computer monitors are never made as big as TV, that alone does matter, e.g.: I want to sit lazily on my cozy big long sofa while watching "big" screen from a "distance" thats hanging on the wall.

You can find monitors that are just as big as a TV set. They are unfortunately much more expensive!

Exactly my point, as not everyone has money growing tree in their garden.  :P

Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #210 on: November 09, 2019, 09:02:55 pm »
You can find monitors that are just as big as a TV set. They are unfortunately much more expensive!
I don't think there are 4K 55" OLED monitors.
 

Online nctnico

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #211 on: November 09, 2019, 09:06:57 pm »
You can find monitors that are just as big as a TV set. They are unfortunately much more expensive!
I don't think there are 4K 55" OLED monitors.
They exist. You could have Googled that yourself ofcourse.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2019, 09:09:34 pm by nctnico »
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #212 on: November 09, 2019, 09:37:49 pm »
They exist. You could have Googled that yourself ofcourse.
I should have counted on some pedant chipping in.  :palm: Those are around the $4000 mark and effectively off the table. Let me supplement myself with the obvious. I don't think there are 4K 55" OLED monitors available within reason.
 
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Online nctnico

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #213 on: November 09, 2019, 09:49:36 pm »
They exist. You could have Googled that yourself ofcourse.
I should have counted on some pedant chipping in.  :palm: Those are around the $4000 mark and effectively off the table. Let me supplement myself with the obvious. I don't think there are 4K 55" OLED monitors available within reason.
Moving goalposts as usual. Like with any type of electronic equipment prices will go down rapidly. 49" TVs and monitors seems to be on par when it comes to price. Logical because the panels are not different.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #214 on: November 09, 2019, 11:22:40 pm »
Moving goalposts as usual. Like with any type of electronic equipment prices will go down rapidly. 49" TVs and monitors seems to be on par when it comes to price. Logical because the panels are not different.
The Goalpost Moving Champion is trying to lecture me. Colour me unimpressed.  :-DD
 
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Offline Red Squirrel

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #215 on: November 10, 2019, 05:58:39 am »
It is pretty clear to me that the so-called smart TVs are a complete bust. The software simply isn't supported long enough.

I hate that most TVs now are smart. This plague is moving to other things like fridges now too.  I don't want that crap.  Especially with the spying it comes with and I presume you're forced to tie it to some account before it even lets you use it.  Wish it was possible to buy just a regular TV.    My TV is old enough that it only has very basic smart features (reading from a USB stick etc) but not looking forward to when it needs to be replaced.

On similar note I hate that lot of misc products now days have an app.  The minute I see that what that tells me is that the product NEEDS this stupid app to work, and in 5-10 years from now will be unusable because they'll have stopped updating the app.  And of course, this app will require you to create an account and be tied to the cloud.  For example my DJI drone is like that.  You can sorta fly it without the app but you lose most of the functionality like being able to record video.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2019, 06:01:37 am by Red Squirrel »
 

Online bd139

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #216 on: November 10, 2019, 09:46:01 am »
Most of the so called smart devices are dumb crap with smart crap strapped on the side. I reckon it’s possible to eviscerate the smart bits at some point. When that full size double smart fridge gets turfed for being software discontinued I’m going to be there to help dispose of it  8)
 

Offline madires

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #217 on: November 10, 2019, 10:57:09 am »
On similar note I hate that lot of misc products now days have an app.  The minute I see that what that tells me is that the product NEEDS this stupid app to work, and in 5-10 years from now will be unusable because they'll have stopped updating the app.  And of course, this app will require you to create an account and be tied to the cloud.  For example my DJI drone is like that.  You can sorta fly it without the app but you lose most of the functionality like being able to record video.

Cloud tethered stuff is another form of planned obsolescence.
 

Online james_s

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #218 on: November 10, 2019, 11:39:30 pm »
Monitors tend to be more expensive than smart TVs because the smart TVs are subsidized by the data they harvest. Anyone who actually connects a smart TV to the internet is a moron.
 

Online SiliconWizard

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #219 on: November 10, 2019, 11:57:59 pm »
Monitors tend to be more expensive than smart TVs because the smart TVs are subsidized by the data they harvest. Anyone who actually connects a smart TV to the internet is a moron.

Well, it's a question of market first - they sell A LOT more TV sets than huge monitors, so you have a large economy of scale, and then there is the acceptable price point, which is obviously not the same. But after that, sure the "added" functionalities are a trap. TV vendors make a lot of money out of all the extra services, just like with many other devices these days... I'm sure the mere fact they would ship the TVs with the Netflix app preinstalled makes them a significant amount of cash per sold TV...

 
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Offline SilverSolder

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #220 on: November 11, 2019, 08:51:34 am »

Watch out for the emergence of a market for "little black boxes" that make cloud tethered devices work by pretending to be whatever cloud service they need to work...

 

Offline BravoV

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #221 on: November 11, 2019, 09:04:39 am »
Just curious, are there chip/IC companies have something similar ? That their product only can be used/developed/trouble-shooting and etc, using their proprietary tool/app that constantly need to be connected ? MCU ? Sensor ? Etc ?
« Last Edit: November 11, 2019, 09:23:41 am by BravoV »
 

Offline Red Squirrel

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #222 on: November 12, 2019, 07:21:21 am »
Most of the so called smart devices are dumb crap with smart crap strapped on the side. I reckon it’s possible to eviscerate the smart bits at some point. When that full size double smart fridge gets turfed for being software discontinued I’m going to be there to help dispose of it  8)

Yeah I imagine for now it's probably not too hard to bypass all the smart stuff, replace everything with an MCU of choice and program it to do whatever it has to do (keep temperature of a fridge for example) and call it a day.  May need to replace certain sensors with ones you buy so you know how to interface with them as theirs could be proprietary with no datasheet available but that's about it.

Eventually though I think they will make it so the stuff is so integrated that it will be a practical rebuild of the entire appliance.  For example they might even use "smart relays" that have logic built in, or even "smart motors" with the logic built right in etc so you can't just replace the control board and keep the other parts in tact as you won't be able to control those parts.   They might even put some "safety" interlocks where if you try to open it it just disables the product for good.   If they get their way and make it illegal they could even get people arrested if it sends a signal out when you try to open it.  Basically they'd make it so when you buy the product you're only buying a license to use it and you're not allowed to open it.  John Deere already does this.     I hope I'm wrong, but I could see it get that way.
 

Online bd139

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #223 on: November 12, 2019, 08:00:31 am »
I’m hoping European warranty legislation will end that crap. It’s quite funny now when you take a 5 year old iPhone into Apple store and ask to exercise the Consumer Rights Act 2015. They actually deal with it. My sister got her iPhone 6 repaired last week.
 

Online SiliconWizard

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Re: Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...
« Reply #224 on: November 12, 2019, 08:35:02 pm »
In the future, there may certainly be an increasing number of products that will REQUIRE an internet connection to function properly (with all the crap you can imagine that comes with it.)
That's already the case with most "IoT" products. Sure this is what they are about, but come on. Do you really need an internet connection to be able to read the temperature inside your house? Because those gadgets are often just bricks if they have no internet connection. This is ridiculous.

So yes, hopefully some basic legislation will prevent the "require" part. For how long, I don't know... because we already see this is tolerated for all the so-called IoT crap. If tomorrow, all the TV sets are qualified as IoT devices, we'll be fucked. Plain and simple.
 


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