Proof that software as service/cloud based, will never work for long term ...

[bd139]

A way out: http://fossil-scm.org/

Fully distributed. Written by the dude who wrote SQLite.

This is what I use for personal projects. Way less footguns than git as well.

[GeorgeOfTheJungle]

I switched to gitlab the sec I found that M$ had bought github.

[SiliconWizard]

A way out: http://fossil-scm.org/

Fully distributed. Written by the dude who wrote SQLite.

This is what I use for personal projects. Way less footguns than git as well.

Fossil is nice, but way more than just git. OTOH, it's just software. They are not offering any hosting, are they? (I may have missed it.)

The whole point of using github or gitlab is the hosting IMO, not the version control system. There are many VCS solutions out there...

And of course, for public access, you need a "cloud" service of some kind. No way around it. You can always host your own service (to control it), in which case it would probably not be called "cloud". But you get the point. In this thread, we have been discussing many use cases that can perfectly be fulfilled with purely local solutions. Using a "cloud" service when a purely local solution would work is just stupid IMO, yet increasingly common.

But when you need a shared/public access, you'll need servers.
At which point does a server or a bunch of servers start qualifying for being called "cloud"? Is it when the hosted data starts being shuffled around several servers without you knowing? (I guess this could be a simple definition of the "cloud", conveying the very idea that data is made remotely accessible, but from no definite/single point.)

I guess the whole key factor is whether you have full control over the service you're using/sharing, or whether you are OK with delegating the control to some third-party that often has completely different objectives from yours.

[bd139]

You don't need a central control point for Fossil (or git) and don't need hosting. That's just an option.

People still haven't actually worked out DVCS platforms yet. Still stuck in the client-server mindset.

[RoGeorge]

http://fossil-scm.org/

Fully distributed.

Didn't know about it, looks interesting, thanks!   

At a first look, an integrated wiki/doc and other tools like bug tracing looks very appealing, I always missed those with git.  Also, atomic commits sounds very appealing, too.

However, keeping all in some SQL database format instead of plain text makes me very reluctant, but I'll still give it a try.

[bd139]

It’s SQLite underneath it. It’s in your browser, phones, television and computer already

https://sqlite.org/mostdeployed.html

[BravoV]

https://techcrunch.com/2019/07/29/github-ban-sanctioned-countries/

[SiliconWizard]

https://techcrunch.com/2019/07/29/github-ban-sanctioned-countries/

Incredible, although it was to be expected.

So are there absolutely no Windows license in Iran? Really? Wouldn't that be consistent?

[BravoV]

https://techcrunch.com/2019/07/29/github-ban-sanctioned-countries/

Incredible, although it was to be expected.

So are there absolutely no Windows license in Iran? Really? Wouldn't that be consistent?

Well, what I am waiting is for Microsoft's step on how they handle this on their Windows 10 ? Remote lock down ? Invalidate the license even legit ? Etc ?

[GeorgeOfTheJungle]

https://techcrunch.com/2019/07/29/github-ban-sanctioned-countries/

The impact of U.S. trade restrictions is trickling down to the developer community. GitHub,  the world’s largest host of source code, is preventing users in Iran, Syria, Crimea and potentially other sanctioned nations from accessing portions of the service, chief executive of the Microsoft-owned firm said.

Over the weekend, GitHub CEO Nat Friedman wrote on Twitter that like any other “company that does business in the US,” GitHub is required to comply with the U.S. export law. The confirmation comes months after work collaboration service Slack, too, enforced similar restrictions on its platform.

      

[SiliconWizard]

Wasn't github american before MS bought it?

Weren't there no sanction with any of those countries from 2008 to today?
So why would they have to comply just NOW?

[BravoV]

Wasn't github american before MS bought it?

Weren't there no sanction with any of those countries from 2008 to today?
So why would they have to comply just NOW?

Read the 1st post, probably the orange face dude enforces it just recently at all fronts, I guess.

Hint , President Executive Order 13884.

[SiliconWizard]

Uh, yeah. The sanction against Venezuela is recent, but sanctions against Iran for instance, have existed for a long time. They tend to come and go depending on agreements and current administration, but there certainly have been sanctions against Iran before, and they were also fiercely enforced. Even many non-US companies had to ban all business with Iran, due to the nice extraterritoriality factor (for instance, a few years back, Peugeot lost a big chunk of its revenues due to a sudden ban of all sales in Iran). It's nothing new.

I guess github was just way under the radar until it got bought by MS. MS obviously can't be.

An interesting question is what is banned exactly, and what is considered business. Like, in the case of github: we could understand (well, in the presence of the ban) that github could not have customers in Iran. But what about the big fraction of github users that are NOT customers? I guess actually most github users are not actual customers - just users of a free service. I don't have the figures, but I'd be willing to bet that the customers are only a small fraction of all users. So is any "free" user considered a customer, and is using github, even if you never paid a penny to them, considered  doing business with github?

[Rick Law]

Whether Cloud works or not, The Pentagon is jumping in...  Hot news, just hours ago.

Article on Fox Business Network 10/25/2019: "Pentagon hands Microsoft $10B 'war cloud' deal, snubs Amazon"
https://www.foxbusiness.com/technology/pentagon-hands-microsoft-10b-war-cloud-deal-snubs-amazon

[madires]

And Micron offers flash memory with cloud based security: http://investors.micron.com/news-releases/news-release-details/micron-introduces-industrys-first-silicon-based-security-service

[bd139]

Thats a fine example of 2019 thinking. Don't find an existing problem and solve it improving the world in the process, but create a new problem and solve it and we all slip a little further down the road to hell.

[Mr. Scram]

Gitlab has postponed the telemetry plan after people made a ruckus about it.

https://www.zdnet.com/article/gitlab-backs-down-on-planned-telemetry-changes-forced-tracking/

[DimitriP]

Whether Cloud works or not, The Pentagon is jumping in...  Hot news, just hours ago.

Article on Fox Business Network 10/25/2019: "Pentagon hands Microsoft $10B 'war cloud' deal, snubs Amazon"
https://www.foxbusiness.com/technology/pentagon-hands-microsoft-10b-war-cloud-deal-snubs-amazon

Hopefully the password will be something other than Joshua.
and it might need another 10B to "fix it" after it rolls out.
By that time it will be time to upgrade it. Another few $B

[SiliconWizard]

Gitlab has postponed the telemetry plan after people made a ruckus about it.

https://www.zdnet.com/article/gitlab-backs-down-on-planned-telemetry-changes-forced-tracking/

Nice, but they'll do it eventually. They're just waiting for enough users to switch from github to gitlab. Once they are all trapped, they'll switch on the telemetry.

[Bassman59]

Whether Cloud works or not, The Pentagon is jumping in...  Hot news, just hours ago.

Article on Fox Business Network 10/25/2019: "Pentagon hands Microsoft $10B 'war cloud' deal, snubs Amazon"
https://www.foxbusiness.com/technology/pentagon-hands-microsoft-10b-war-cloud-deal-snubs-amazon

Hopefully the password will be something other than Joshua.

HAHAHA!! We found the DVD of that movie for a few bucks and bought it. My son, who's 11, loves it. I showed him some web sites that discuss the IMSAI computer and the terminals. I don't think he quite gets how difficult it was to use computers back then.

I watch it and say, "HEY MATTHEW BRODERICK, that's Ally Sheedy there! Don't be a dumbass!"

[madires]

Good news: https://theblog.adobe.com/adobe-continues-digital-media-access-in-venezuela/
They got a license to continue offering services in Venezuela.

[Mr. Scram]

Nice, but they'll do it eventually. They're just waiting for enough users to switch from github to gitlab. Once they are all trapped, they'll switch on the telemetry.

Or they'll introduce it piecemeal or make some token changes to supposedly address the issues people have with the plan. That's why I used the word "postponed" instead of "cancelled". It's unlikely their motivation suddenly changes but the bad publicity is an issue.

[PlainName]

Stumbled across another example of Microsoft's malicious takedown of applications that work in W7:

http://code52.org/DownmarkerWPF/

Markdown editor thingy and you can see there are download links. The desktop download doesn't work any more (a *.windows.net URL, surprise) but the Microsoft store one does. Go there and at the bottom in the Addition Information section the release date is noted as 2012. That's a while back and you can bet your arse it worked on W7 and XP. Back up the top, System Requirements, only available for Windows 8. And no, you can't fool it.

OK, back to the original and take a look at the source links. Yes, the one to the desktop app works There are also Nightly and Stable links, but try getting 'em

There is no technical reason why this isn't available for W7 any more. It is solely because Microsoft is going round scooping up W7 apps to deliberately kill them off in an attempt to force W10 as the only platform.

[Red Squirrel]

So much for Gitlab being an alternative for Github. It seems they're holding people's work and even operations hostage until they agree with the new terms and conditions. So much for freely and willingly engaging in a contract.

Wait are people seriously putting their projects on sites like that without having any kind of local copy?

[bd139]

Usually something needs to be centralised for access and build support.