Author Topic: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......  (Read 63224 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline EEVblog

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 29875
  • Country: au
    • EEVblog
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #125 on: July 03, 2011, 10:16:08 pm »
I have no problem at all, to write the all story in detail, but we are out of topic all ready,
and if Dave gives the OK, I will do it .   

This is a free and open forum, you can write whatever you like (within reason).

Dave.
 

Offline EEVblog

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 29875
  • Country: au
    • EEVblog
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #126 on: July 03, 2011, 10:28:46 pm »
Thought this thread was about Maths?

No, the thread is about religion.
The very first post is a video parody of the recent Miss USA contest where they asked the contestants if evolution should be be taught in schools. IIRC, only two of the girls had firm views that it should, and once of those girls won the contest.
Many say it's her answer to that question that got her the title.

Dave.
 

Offline Mechatrommer

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 9125
  • Country: my
  • reassessing directives...
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #127 on: July 03, 2011, 11:05:13 pm »
Physicist rely on mathematician to model universe. but our mathematics is incomplete, so what? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6del's_incompleteness_theorems
if something can select, how cant it be intelligent? if something is intelligent, how cant it exist?
 

Offline Kiriakos-GR

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Banned!
  • Posts: 3525
  • Country: gr
  • User is banned.
    • Honda AX-1 rebuild
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #128 on: July 03, 2011, 11:39:29 pm »
I have no problem at all, to write the all story in detail, but we are out of topic all ready,
and if Dave gives the OK, I will do it .   

This is a free and open forum, you can write whatever you like (within reason).

Dave.

Since when the miracles contain reason ?   ;)
Miracles belong to the sphere of the paradox or to the unorthodox, for the common mind.

Any way I will prepare the text , and I will post it soon ..   
 
 

Offline ndictu

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 210
  • Country: sk
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #129 on: July 03, 2011, 11:50:44 pm »
Any way I will prepare the text , and I will post it soon ..   

I'm looking forward to that, although anecdotes are not evidence.
 

Offline Kiriakos-GR

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Banned!
  • Posts: 3525
  • Country: gr
  • User is banned.
    • Honda AX-1 rebuild
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #130 on: July 04, 2011, 12:14:29 am »
Any way I will prepare the text , and I will post it soon ..   

I'm looking forward to that, although anecdotes are not evidence.

For your information you will not get any evidence that you can use it in any way.
Anecdotes are made up stuff, that was made so to serve a purpose,
mostly to amuse or cause fear to the small children.
And so do not expect to read in my text, about small green people with antennas in their heads.
 

 

Offline ndictu

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 210
  • Country: sk
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #131 on: July 04, 2011, 10:17:31 am »
No, anecdote is a story about something that happened, or at least the presenter insists it happened. And it is not evidence, simple like that.

If you tell me your story it won't be a evidence of god, the same way if I tell you a story how I was abducted by aliens it won't be an evidence of aliens.

For some reason many people would mark the first one as a miracle, and the second one as a delusion of a batshit crazy person. But from a scientific view they have the exact same credibility. None.

BTW, isn't faith based on ... well faith? If you have evidence that would mean it's not faith anymore.
 

Offline Kiriakos-GR

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Banned!
  • Posts: 3525
  • Country: gr
  • User is banned.
    • Honda AX-1 rebuild
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #132 on: July 04, 2011, 12:11:20 pm »
BTW, isn't faith based on ... well faith? If you have evidence that would mean it's not faith anymore.

For this question, you should ask Thomas.  ;)
 

Offline Mechatrommer

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 9125
  • Country: my
  • reassessing directives...
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #133 on: July 04, 2011, 03:27:27 pm »
Even 100 people told you the same story, i bet you still will not believe, and you hope you'll see it with your own eyes. in my reply #117 {page 8}, i've provided a link of scientific proof in accordance/tally with the "old writing" i've found sometime ago. No matter how much evidence you hear, you will not satisfy with denial that you ask and challenge to see the Face of God, which is not gonna happen which i described the reason why in a way as much as understandable as possible by a layman but logical imho thought earlier, ie hell need to be operated, and my "assumption" is we are just God's Experiment. But i accepted that, we are like circuit boards that the Maker can do whatever He want, as i said you like it or not. but thats just maybe my devil imagination, beyond my domain/power, beyond the writing of the Book. But remember you have a choice, God embedded "good" and "bad" inside us. Thats why people argue, human is imperfect being, just because of that.

Here's some quotes from "Old Writing" that scientist proofs found later to be true. But as usual, you will not believe it and try to find another reason to deny it. Because your heart still not opened up, you say its because of "Natural Selection", but the truth is the "Supreme Being" still not allow it to... heh! do i sound like a preach? :P from scientist way of saying, its measurement problem, we are not there yet, not even close!

1) How to cheat light years of travel may lie inside blackholes and wormholes... or stairways
   (Al-Maarij 70:3-4) - The Ascending Stairways

2) Big Crunch will occur in form of space folding. The known and proven "Big Bang" onced termed 1000+ years ago as "The First Creation" will occur again. Who can prove it? None! i guess.
   (Al-Anbiya' 21:104) - The Prophets

3) Disbeliever want example? a very good one! Mosquito! why Natural Selection didnt perish mosquitos from earth? they are so damned annoying! there are many more example/proofs mentioned somewhere else for disbelievers who still dont believe, even some of them are proven scientifically
   (Al-Baqarah 2:26) - The (Female) Cow

4) The beginning of Fetus once lifeless, and then at some point (go google, i'm not sure how many weeks) will become life, born and dead again when old, and then what to not believe?
   (Al-Baqarah 2:28) - The (Female) Cow

5) The God (or the old man writer?) make fun of physicist who try to find the truth. You can look as deep as you want into space or atom, you will find another mystery until your sight (brain) fatigue. isnt it like that? since Galileo and before? or after till now?
   (Al-Mulk - 67:3-4) - The Sovereignty

6) THIS is the very basis of Darwin Theory and hence the basis of "Godless Ideology" - a dialog that angel knew human cause destruction, because once before the first man Adam, human was created and lived on earth until destruction/Armageddon. scientists/archeologists proved they are ape like shape dated long before Adam. Perharps they are who lived with dinasours.
   (Al-Baqarah 2:30) - The (Female) Cow

7) and lastly, we (Jinn/ghost included) can travel to Heaven using scientific/practical means, but only with strength (knowledges, resources and tools etc) AND allowance/admittance from God.
   (Ar-Rahman 55:33) - The Beneficient

Remember these writing dated 1000++ years ago (if you care to search) where people still live with stick and fire. and the story tells that the origin of the content is from a man who cannot read. You may say they are from the lost Atlantis of advance tech knowledge, but where are they? why not a single trace of their advance technology has been found? could have been eaten by dinasours? or armageddon?
You may read it as scientific material for study, dont treat it as religious book to avoid bias. You may pick which one you prefer, they are scattered (and sometime grouped) within chapters:

1) History of mankind (past and future) and creation
2) The science and Math (as mentioned above and in link #117) but dont expect you will find fancy terms such as blackhole, big bang or electron. you have to translate the old terms.
3) The moral! Guide to Aetheist?!
4) and then, the crappy afterlife, Heaven, 7th dimension, talking snake/cow etc. and not the least, the threat of Hell! :P

You may laugh and skip when it comes to God's promise/threat/story in afterlife. but when you come across something strange and un-understandable, you may think twice, it may lead you/scientist to the next description of uni/multiverse/atom creation. Some say its the AoE of life, no hard math in there, and also can be a good bedtime/horror story ;) :P

You prefer someone to prove if its true, some have been proven, accidentally. the burden has been taken. now, its your turn to find even a single mistake (proven to be wrong) in that "old writing". and its guaranteed what you read is the original content the same as 1000+ years ago when its first written/passed down, not a single alphabet added or missing! so they said (and its in the book). I'd love to hear prove/disprove as well from fellow Christians (Bible)

Sorry if this one is too long. I'm not preach, just a normal guy who love and enjoy to experimenting and doing evil things. But it is written in the book that it is believers duty to spread the words, esp to who have not reach the "Teaching/Lesson" (and esp when it comes/involving to dumb stories relating to God, Nonexistency, Darwinian etc) so i'm obligue and tempted to post this long story FWIW. Bear in mind its not by force (how could i?), but it is up to you to believe or not. and i dont have a "slightest" care (or pity) if you dont! as long as you are not me. We live in Free World here, if indeed its truly "Free" that i can walk naked (and stroke! :D) as i like :P ps: please note stroking and walking naked is forbidden in the Teaching, except in emergency case and condition :P
if something can select, how cant it be intelligent? if something is intelligent, how cant it exist?
 

Offline baljemmett

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 666
  • Country: gb
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #134 on: July 04, 2011, 03:41:22 pm »
3) Disbeliever want example? a very good one! Mosquito! why Natural Selection didnt perish mosquitos from earth? they are so damned annoying! there are many more example/proofs mentioned somewhere else for disbelievers who still dont believe, even some of them are proven scientifically

That...  doesn't even make sense, never mind being 'proof' of anything.  Why would mosquitos die out through natural selection?  You've got the mechanism exactly backwards, plus appear to be looking at it from the point of view of selecting for traits we want...
 

Offline Mechatrommer

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 9125
  • Country: my
  • reassessing directives...
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #135 on: July 04, 2011, 03:51:02 pm »
That...  doesn't even make sense, never mind being 'proof' of anything.  Why would mosquitos die out through natural selection?  You've got the mechanism exactly backwards, plus appear to be looking at it from the point of view of selecting for traits we want...
my view could be wrong. i'm just a simple human. but if darwinian theory of evolution is right. why there is a large gap of missing part in history? why our grand grand father never told us that his grand grand father told that his grand grand father looks like an ape? or fighting the dinasours? why jesus face look alot charming than i am? why x-men still not on sight? will human extinct, because of cancer? because cancer cells are more dominant in the law of "natural selection"? etc etc.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2011, 04:03:27 pm by Mechatrommer »
if something can select, how cant it be intelligent? if something is intelligent, how cant it exist?
 

Offline Hypernova

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 654
  • Country: tw
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #136 on: July 04, 2011, 04:31:44 pm »
"why there is a large gap of missing part in history?"
Cause we haven't found then YET, archeology is not CSI on TV.

"why our grand grand father never told us that his grand grand father told that his grand grand father looks like an ape?"
Language during the stone age aren't exactly as capable as what we have today, and think of how much knowledge was lost to the ages even though the people of old resorted to carving them on stone.

"fighting the dinasours?"
Might want to brush up a little on paleontology.

"why jesus face look alot charming than i am?"
Cause it is an important ($$$) painting so the artist did his best?

"why x-men still not on sight?"
Cause it's a comic, and evolution does not work like that.

"will human extinct, because of cancer? because cancer cells are more dominant in the law of "natural selection"? etc etc.
Most illness do not kill us until we are old enough to produce offspring's, it is actually counter productive to kill your host which is why the amount of symbiotic microbes around our biosphere outnumber the harmful ones by several orders of magnitude.

The biggest difference between science and religion besides I-can-say-any-shit-I-want-if-I-can-back-it-up is that science readily admit that it is incomplete but improves day by day (the attackers love to say"but science STILL can't" ;) ), whereas with a religion you get "fundamentalists" that try to hug the long outdated books.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2011, 04:33:21 pm by Hypernova »
 

Offline ndictu

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 210
  • Country: sk
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #137 on: July 04, 2011, 05:59:25 pm »
my view could be wrong. i'm just a simple human. but if darwinian theory of evolution is right. why there is a large gap of missing part in history? why our grand grand father never told us that his grand grand father told that his grand grand father looks like an ape? or fighting the dinasours? why jesus face look alot charming than i am? why x-men still not on sight? will human extinct, because of cancer? because cancer cells are more dominant in the law of "natural selection"? etc etc.

Oh for the love of flying spaghetti monster. Yes, it is wrong. Very wrong.

1) There isn't a gap. This is the oldest argument in the book. There is evidence (fossils etc) of many many evolutionary steps. You people always pick two and ask "where is the missing link? and when they do find it (not that it is important or that they are looking for that specifically, but whatever) you now have 2 gaps and you ask the same question. Most animals aren't fossilized. They were eaten by other animals and bacteria, not leaving much behind.

2) Ignoring the fact that there was no language and good communication back then, the process is very very slow. Your parents are different than you, but not by much so you don't care. Everyone along the way saw their parents and their kids like the same, but there was always a tiny difference. It took ages before it accumulated into something you notice.

3) Evolution, or more precisely, natural selection doesn't work like that. There is no best, and there isn't an obvious goal. (If there was, it would certainly not be xmen). Genes do not care about you. The only thing that matters is what can replicate more. If there is a mutation that somehow makes that individual produce more offspring, it'll dominate and get widespread. I'm not an expert on this and therefore any explanation I can come up with won't do this justice. Please, do yourself a favor and go read something else then religious text. I can recommend Richard Dawkins' Selfish Gene.

4) Cancer thing, as explained by Hypernova is irrelevant to your genes. You don't see many young people, or kids, dying from cancer. Why not? Because if they do their "bad" DNA doesn't get replicated, and only those that are "immune" to this reproduce. For all natural selection cares, your head might explode once you got enough offspring. You are just a container for DNA that tries it's best to get copied and then it just doesn't care. There are animals that die, or get eaten by their partner, after sex. Doesn't seem like the best evolution? But it is, for the genes. Once there is offspring the carrier is useless. (Of course, there could be more offspring later, but let's not complicate things right now. Read the book)

5) Even if 100 people told me, no I would not believe. You realize that there are probably thousands of people that claim they have been abducted by aliens right? Why don't you believe them? There are millions of people that believe in a different god, or gods. What's wrong with their stories?

6) I'm not even going to read the excepts from the books. You realize you are basing your entire world view and beliefs on some book, and then you argue with me using that book. It's a circular logic. If I write a book like that, bury it for a few centuries and then people will believe in that "because it's in the book" and people say "but you can't prove that, it's bullshit" and they say "no it isn't, see, it's in the book". Does that sound like a good logic to you?

Quote
No matter how much evidence you hear, you will not satisfy with denia

No, you haven't presented evidence. Anecdotes aren't evidence. Book can't be evidence of itself. There isn't a single peace of real, hard, scientific, repeatable and peer reviewed evidence in favor of religion.

But that quote is exactly what you are doing. Reality filter. There is so much evidence against you I could spend my entire life writing it here and I would die before I could cover a reasonable amount.



I'm getting quite tired of this thread. If you want, you should read The God Delusion or any similar book. Don't stop, don't reject it. For a day forget about religion, give the book a shot and see. There is so much wonderful stuff in science that bible and similar religious texts seem like the essays kids write in the first grade. It's up to you if you decide to give it a try or stay where you are, rejecting every word against it.
 

Offline Rufus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2094
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #138 on: July 04, 2011, 06:03:50 pm »
But it is written in the book that it is believers duty to spread the words

When there is no evidence to support a belief the word of believers is all you have. That is why a duty to spread the word is a strong feature of almost all religions.
 

Offline ndictu

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 210
  • Country: sk
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #139 on: July 04, 2011, 06:46:00 pm »
I was just going through google reader and today's SMBC comic is on topic so here it is:

http://www.smbc-comics.com/index.php?db=comics&id=2296#comic
 

Offline Mechatrommer

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 9125
  • Country: my
  • reassessing directives...
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #140 on: July 04, 2011, 07:22:20 pm »
"fighting the dinasours?", Might want to brush up a little on paleontology.
http://www.answersingenesis.org/articles/nab/human-and-dino-fossils-together
if there's no gap in history, i believe there should be no need to decypher the cryptic writing on stones and caves. everything should be smoothly translated in whatever means of revolutions, stones->animal skin->paper->hardisk.

you should read The God Delusion or any similar book. Don't stop, don't reject it. For a day forget about religion, give the book a shot and see.
any link to full content? for the sake of information sharing. (attach here or PM) i can see from wiki it is sold 2 millions copies!

i dare to argue because it is not my words (challenge of god in 4th edition). when i cannot answer i'll refer to holy book (god). when aethist cannot answer, they refer to "God Delusion"? which is clearly written by a man? from my limited wiki reading, he discussed morality originates from man, religion is not needed. that is from his survey? did he survey criminals? did he discussed when the first morality exists? did he explained why criminals, violence, corruption/bribery in politics happened? is homosexual and nudism which gain popularity be moraled? and again... link please? i need the full text if its truly for the good of mankind, not profit and try to create another "godless" religion. i've provided the free link to one of holy book for free.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2011, 08:34:12 pm by Mechatrommer »
if something can select, how cant it be intelligent? if something is intelligent, how cant it exist?
 

Offline ndictu

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 210
  • Country: sk
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #141 on: July 04, 2011, 07:42:00 pm »
Yes, books tend to sell copies. I'm not going to provide you with an illegal copy, but if you want I'm sure you could find it yourself.

But don't forget that you will go to hell for stealing it. :)
 

Offline Mechatrommer

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 9125
  • Country: my
  • reassessing directives...
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #142 on: July 04, 2011, 08:37:38 pm »
But don't forget that you will go to hell for stealing it. :)
some people say stealing (or modern words pirating) is a moraled behaviour? :o or whats worst can it be? a big blank full stop when i died? and i'm sure you are not going to hell for providing me one ;)
« Last Edit: July 04, 2011, 08:50:48 pm by Mechatrommer »
if something can select, how cant it be intelligent? if something is intelligent, how cant it exist?
 

Offline Zero999

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 13109
  • Country: gb
  • 0999
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #143 on: July 04, 2011, 08:53:49 pm »
But don't forget that you will go to hell for stealing it. :)
some people say stealing (or modern words pirating) is a moraled behaviour? :o or whats worst can it be? a big blank full stop when i died? and i'm sure you are not going to hell for providing me one ;)

Visit your local library if you don't want to download it. To be honest, I don't see much difference between the two. You borrow the book from the library and read it, the author gets nothing other than what the library paid for it in the first place. You download it and read it, the author gets nothing other than what the person who scanned it paid for it. The main difference is when you download it there won't be others who can't borrow it while you're reading it. The only harmful thing is, everyone downloading books will cause the libraries to close.

As far as I'm concerned the most compelling evidence in favour of evolution are the experiments we humans have done by breeding animals over the milliner. Look at how different one breed of dog is to the next and it doesn't take much imagination to see how nature can go from the dinosaurs to humans over 68 million years, given that there's less than 15,000 years between even the most distinct breeds. A more striking example are sheep which are now a distinct species in their own right as they can no longer produce fertile offspring with their wild ancestors.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2011, 09:17:56 pm by Hero999 »
 

Offline gregariz

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 547
  • Country: us
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #144 on: July 04, 2011, 08:54:29 pm »
I don't necessarily have a problem with the concept of 'God' as I simply do not know. The problem I have with ideas that are based on various 'books' is that at the time of their writing the vast majority of people in the middle east (and elsewhere) were illiterate. Not being able to read or write they were forced to repeat stories by word of mouth which lead in the end to 'chanting' their ideas in order to remember them. In the end someone wrote it into books. I'm not confident that this mechanism captured many of the original events because by the time a message has been recounted by a few people its often a vastly different message from the original. Imaging doing that over a widespread area over decades or centuries. Kind of like the lost city of Atlantis - that was supposed to be this all powerful civilization - we don't know if it was made up or not. Some people believe it but they don't even know where it was - how can something that was so important be believed today with such an unreliable information system as word of mouth. The only thing you can really say is that since the books were written people have been brainwashed in a consistent way.

If there really is a god I trust that one day he will decide to come back and give his message on prime time TV. That way we can record it properly.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2011, 09:01:41 pm by gregariz »
 

Offline Rufus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2094
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #145 on: July 04, 2011, 08:55:26 pm »
I was just going through google reader and today's SMBC comic is on topic so here it is:

http://www.smbc-comics.com/index.php?db=comics&id=2296#comic

Lol. In the 1992 the church of England decided to have a vote on allowing the ordination of women priests, something they had been debating for 17 years. It was passed with the narrowest of margins.

I asked a friend why they didn't just ask God if he wanted women priests. The friend said they did and God told half of them he wanted women priests and the other half he didn't.
 

Offline Rufus

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2094
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #146 on: July 04, 2011, 09:02:48 pm »
The only harmful thing is, everyone downloading books will cause the libraries to close.

Nope, everyone downloading (copying) books for free would mean most authors wouldn't bother writing them and we wouldn't have any books (far fewer anyway). That is the point of copyright it is for the benefit of the readers not the authors. The way copyright has been twisted out of all recognition by vested interests and dumb/corrupt politicians you could be forgiven for not realising that.
 

Offline Zero999

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 13109
  • Country: gb
  • 0999
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #147 on: July 04, 2011, 09:16:14 pm »
Nope, everyone downloading (copying) books for free would mean most authors wouldn't bother writing them and we wouldn't have any books (far fewer anyway). That is the point of copyright it is for the benefit of the readers not the authors. The way copyright has been twisted out of all recognition by vested interests and dumb/corrupt politicians you could be forgiven for not realising that.
No because not everyone will just download books, people will still buy them. I have a both a real and a virtual copy of The Art of Electronics and will probably buy the third edition too. Especially if I find a place to download it and enjoy reading it a lot, I'd be even more motivated to buy it than I would've been without that opportunity.

Still, I don't see how borrowing a book from the library or second hand store is worse for the author than downloading it.


 

Offline Kiriakos-GR

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Banned!
  • Posts: 3525
  • Country: gr
  • User is banned.
    • Honda AX-1 rebuild
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #148 on: July 04, 2011, 09:23:39 pm »
Sorry people a long story is coming up.  :)

All that I can do for you is to use some colors on the dialogs,
and separate some how the chapters by bold marks. 

This is a story, my own story, which I call it as miracle, and personally I believe that it is.

They had pass several years of that Friday (before the Sunday of Easter), that we celebrate the resurrection of Jesus,
In our Christian Orthodox Church.

At the dawn of this Friday (Easter week) at about 4:30 to 5:30am two thieves’, and probably drug dealers, dived out of my store,
my poor little horse,  one 250CC Honda motorcycle, which it was not shining and it was not at its best condition.

When I realize what happened few hours later, that I got weak up, I lost the world under of my feet.
It was and is the only wheels that I own. 

The words are very poor to describe my feelings at that time,
but the most major idea in my head was that what happened to me was an major injustice.

I did notify the Police about the stolen motorcycle,  and even made an public announcement from a local FM  radio station.
My message .. my tone of voice … was like a fire, in just 10 hours since the  public announcement in the radio,
All the 20 highway patrol officers in my city they were aware of what to look for.
Some of them were aware about me.
Because I was use to travel with my dog on the motorcycle (it was standing on the fuel tank) and we was a true spectacle,
Lots of laughs and teasing, when I was waiting for the green light at the traffic lights.
And so I was easily recognizable from local patrol officers (On two wheels). 
This is how the Friday ended.

In the beginning of Saturday, many friends of my came to me, so to offer to me their own wheels,
So to have my chance to search in some places around the City, that usually the thieves’,
They bring there the stolen motorcycles, so to grab the useful parts, and then discard the leftovers.
Nop , no luck , nothing found there too.
This is how the Saturday morning ended.

At the Saturday 24:00 or Sunday 00:01 , we celebrate the resurrection of Jesus.
And so Sunday & Monday, they are two days of national celebration.
Nothing moves, nothing happens.

Tuesday, was another dead day for me, I could not think, I could not work,
I was just sad and silent all day long.
At the afternoon I took the decision, to visit one small near by church and ask for help.
This church is part of an orphanage, which my own father had grown up in it, because his parents had died at 1940 (German occupation).
My own father, before he dies, he had share with me one story of how he recovered his own lost wedding ring, by asking for help in this specific church.

On Wednesday I am getting to the church at 10:00am, the church was open but empty,
I am starting my own monolog with the God, a silent one, but from inside of my I was screaming.
It was a scream with out voice, and I was pointing out that this was a major injustice for me.
How in earth the God let something like that to happen on to a person like me, who truly never did anything bad in to another human.
And I demanded the help of God, by clearly saying, that if I did not get his help, I would never ever visit his home again. 
Some people they challenge God daily, I did this challenge only once so far, and I was in the age of 36 years old.   
 
Same day 10:30 I am back to my shop, and I am starting to repair one fax machine of a customer,
So to make something productive, and keep my mind busy.

( Gentlemen start your watches, and count the time!! )

At 11:00 am one good friend of my Jim, came in my shop so to check on me and say hi.
And we had a dialog.

Jim: How are you?
Kiriakos:  I feel like shit.
Jim: Do you have any ideas about places to look for the motorcycle. 
Kiriakos:  Yes I have the felling that the motorcycle is dropped somewhere in between of our own city in the high way that drives to Larisa  ( Near by city 60Km away )
Jim:  Hmm ok, I have a work to do, I will come back later on, so to check on you and have a coffee.

Remark : My own friend he is a constructor who installs plaster boards,
this specific day, he came to me by driving his huge closed van capable to load plaster boards of 2m high x 5 meters long. (Yes it was empty when he came)

Back to the story:
My own friend did about 10 steps out of my shop and returned back in.   
Jim:  get ready we are going to Larisa now.
Kiriakos:  Now?
Jim:   Yes now.

The time was 11:15 am and we did start traveling to Larisa , with the large van.
The travel time it is about 50 min.

In the car we had the radio on, and we has not saying much,
until Jim made the key question, when we had cover the half of the distance:
Jim: Kiriako do you really believe that we will found the motorcycle in Larisa?
Kiriakos: Jim would you believe me if I told you, that right now in this car,
We are not just two people but three?
He smiled on me, and he did not make another question.

At the 90% of the distance I started to feel fear, because I started to realize what we were doing.
We were heading in one city of 200.000 people, a truly huge area to cover even with the help of a helicopter!!
Not to say that even if it was parked in a public place on the sidewalk, you could possibly need weeks so to find it.

 We arrived at the entrance of the city at 12:00 am.
And he stops the car, so to talk its other, of what we will do next.

 Jim:   I had an coworker living in Larisa, we has very good friends,
And we had cooperated in one big project that took months.
But I wanted to find his business card so to invite him in my marriage,
And I couldn’t find it …
Let me check at the front compartment of the van.


Remark : He does find the business card !!
He makes the phone call, and the mobile phone number was still the same after 12 years !!
 
Jim:   Hi friend we have lost a motorcycle, do you have any tips about places in Larisa with reputation about such matters.
Jim – Friend : yes there is an area in the city called as  XXXX  , and as second a small village near by called as XXXX. 
Jim:   Kiriakos what do you say?
Kiriakos:  We will go in the city.
Jim:   No problem I know this location, and I can drive us there even with my eyes closed.

At  12:05 am we start moving again by heading to this location in the city,
The target was a known square park at the middle of this area.

At 12:10 am we arrive in the area, and actually we were in front of one cross road, with just two directions (left or right).
Jim: Kiriakos this is it … area XXXX ..   
Jim:  now what?

Kiriakos:  Jim I will show you the way and you will just turn the car.
Jim:  Here is what we will do.
I will watch the left sidewalk as we move,
And you will watch the right sidewalk.

Kiriakos: No Jim, I will show you the way, and you will just turn the car.
Jim:  Ok let’s do it by your own way, where you want me to turn? 
Kiriakos:  Turn right Jim.

After the right turn, the van did 20 meters, and it was had to turn left,
there was not any other way.

Time : 12:15 am 

The van made the turn to the left, and at our left hand it was one coffee shop with Pool tables (Billiards),
It had a face of 10 meters long, and after the end of it and under the sidewalk, was my motorcycle parked on it !!

The van was moving and I screamed “ That’s my motorcycle “  I opened the door and jumped out of the moving van.


The poor Jim, stopped the car at the middle of the street and started to scream I DO NOT BELIEVE IT  repeat ably.
He did that about five times, then parked the van, and came to me shocked and lost …
He grabbed me and droved me away from the motorcycle …

Jim :  Kiriakos take a big breath and lets call the local police authorities, so to help us, and give them the opportunity,
about arresting the thieves’, or to find who did it.


And we did just that, we did call the special police authority about such matters, and they arrived with a civil car no markings. 
We were 50 meters away of the parked motorcycle, waiting with the Police about 2 hours, but no one showed up.

About me, I was crying and laughing with in two minutes interval, all those two hours that we were in the police car,
waiting for some one to show up.

The special police officers they decided to interrupt the watch,
And they said that we can take the motorcycle, I had all the papers and even the keys,
and we just should follow them at the police station, as they had to do a bit of paper work,
about this case.

The new problem was that the thief, he had lock the rear wheel with a disk brake lock !!
And there was no way to drive the motorcycle back home !!
I did learned something new even from the thieves’, they trust more the disk brake lock,
among other methods.

And so we DID load the LOCKED motorcycle in to the HUGE van,
and after the shortcut that we did about visiting the local police department,
we took the way back from LARISA to our own city.

And let’s do the math.
The motorcycle was stolen for five days !!
Wednesday 10:00 am at the church
10:30 back to my shop
11:00  Jim shows up with the huge van.
11:05  Staring to travel
12:10  Arrival and the phone call to the old friend ( Lost business card -12 years unchanged mobile number)
12:15  I was in front of my motorcycle !!

The sum is that I had my motorcycle back in 120 minutes, after getting out of the church.

Do not ask me why in my dialogs with Jim, I was acted like giving to him,
directions to follow, like commanding him in a way.
I do not know what happened, it was my own voice, but my reactions, or the way that I use the words was not my.
But I had no intention to think of my own, by using my logic to all this.
The only logic description that I could use, so to describe why I acted that way,
Is that I just left my self free, free to be used as receiver.

Every time that I read this story I get tears in my eyes.
It’s too much the all thing, so to be called as coincidence, or to be called as wild luck,
or what ever other, than a true miracle.


As smaller in size, but still a miracle,
was for me the help that Dave offered to me about the 87V story.
And the happy end that this story got.

And as another mini miracle it could be the fact that I got chosen by Agilent,
so to participate, in their DMM review program.

I believe that small miracles happens every day,
and they happen to us with the help of God,
but mostly because we love its other ( In a way ).

We can become small Gods, by helping its other,
And in true difficult situations, you have the right to ask for help from our own father above.   
He does listen if you know what numbers to dial.

I was and before an positive thinking Christian,
and I am still now, but I had stopped wondering if there is a God out there.

My proof is in the picture of my own web site about the restoration of my motorcycle.
Is the picture called as “ Before “ this was the stolen and found motorcycle.
Currently there are 40.000 witnesses of my miracle on the web counter,
but they do not know it.  LOL   
 
http://dhost.info/ax1/
« Last Edit: July 04, 2011, 09:25:43 pm by Kiriakos-GR »
 

Offline Mechatrommer

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 9125
  • Country: my
  • reassessing directives...
Re: remember math yeah, it was just a theory right ?.......
« Reply #149 on: July 04, 2011, 09:28:57 pm »
how can something that was so important be believed today with such an unreliable information system as word of mouth. The only thing you can really say is that since the books were written people have been brainwashed in a consistent way.
there are Hafeez in Islamic dictionary, even until now. Since prophet and most friends were illiterate, they used to memorized full content of it and be tested for competency annually, usually in the month of Ramadhan, it took many years that way after the prophet died. But since many Hafeez died during Crusades - Christian Islam War the ruler, or Caliphate make initiative to make it in writing. So thats the first written version. and later some ammendment in writing style to make reading easier to non-arabic literate people, but still maintaining alphabet count, only addition of dash at the top and bottom of alphabet, full stop and verse numbering which do not count in content "checksum". arabic writing (original language) is maintained even in translated version of the holy book. another history for that.

If there really is a god I trust that one day he will decide to come back and give his message on prime time TV. That way we can record it properly.
small armageddon are demonstrated in small scale of floods, earth quakes, small meteorite and they are mostly well recorded, but thats not it (denial) to some people's definition albeit of no way of human power of controlling it. but when the big armageddon happen, not a single piece of paper can record that, this explained gap in history, scientists/archeologists are searching for the past big armageddon, they found proofs in ice/soil sediments (big flood and big volcano sulphur trace) etc, i used to watch that in national geographic, you may find it in the net i think.

you can never find such text as "godless literature" in our library. i've never found aethist (or even jews) in my country, we are all religious population islam, christian, buddha live in harmony
if something can select, how cant it be intelligent? if something is intelligent, how cant it exist?
 


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf