SciFi movies and pathetic misconceptions of tech failing for the story line.

[BrianHG]

SciFi movies and pathetic misconceptions of tech failing for the story line.

I just dont know what to say, just that it's getting bad.
The last 2 scifi's I watched has what they called 'EMP' blasts to knock out everything electric.

Hun, even old non-electronic diesel engines.
Where somehow the fire of the fuel is killed, yet when a vehicle crashes filled with fuel, there fuel explodes.
Even basic non-led flash-light cant work?

Can anyone point me to any good SciFi series which don't make such stupid mistakes?
I just want to sit and watch something where I don't get pissed through the roof for the most basic simple stupid grievances for story line.
Even future SciFis like Star Trek or The Expanse have at many times more acceptable premise than some of the crappy stupidity I have seen recently.

[AVGresponding]

The Expanse wasn't bad (I've only watched the first 3 seasons, so no spoilers please xD), though the slingshot manouver the Rocinante did with Jupiter's moons annoyed me because it would have taken weeks to perform for real, not 20 minutes or whatever it was.

Have you watched Farscape? A lot of people get put off (as was I, initially) by the Henson connection, but once you get going it's really good, and the animatronics were first rate, and often look better than even the best modern CGI.

I'm currently watching Andromeda; this is only for real sci-fi-aholics, as it's pretty poor, by and large, definitely B grade.

If you can handle classic low budget sci-fi from the last century, try Blake's 7, or Logan's Run (the series).

[TimFox]

There are some 1950s movies that are not bad on future predictions.
A good example:  "Destination Moon", based on a Heinlein novel, including his belief that the private sector should handle space exploration.
Reasonable technical stuff, including using an oxygen tank for emergency propulsion of an astronaut in his spacesuit.
The expedition has to blast off in defiance of a court order.
In a bad example, whose name I cannot remember, I remember a spaceship travelling to Mars where the astronauts smoke in the main lounge.

[CatalinaWOW]

Why would you expect accuracy in the movie industry when so much of the general public and particularly the media generators are just completely ignorant of science.

In the last week in US news media I have heard the following two statements, delivered without a hint of confusion.

1.  The sandwich has been a daytime staple for Americans for centuries.  (America, (the intended shorthand for the USA with apologies to other Americans) can barely claim centuries, and the sandwich is of comparable age, invented in England and hardly widespread at the beginning).

2.  xxx crime has been a problem in our county for 80 decades. 

Similar gaffes are so common they pass without notice and people who are equally ignorant even cite them as justification for whatever weird thought has recently come to mind.

[BrianHG]

The Expanse wasn't bad (I've only watched the first 3 seasons, so no spoilers please xD), though the slingshot manouver the Rocinante did with Jupiter's moons annoyed me because it would have taken weeks to perform for real, not 20 minutes or whatever it was.

Have you watched Farscape? A lot of people get put off (as was I, initially) by the Henson connection, but once you get going it's really good, and the animatronics were first rate, and often look better than even the best modern CGI.

I'm currently watching Andromeda; this is only for real sci-fi-aholics, as it's pretty poor, by and large, definitely B grade.

If you can handle classic low budget sci-fi from the last century, try Blake's 7, or Logan's Run (the series).

Yes, I enjoyed Farscape, and yes you need to sit patiently through season 1 for that show, but it is worth it just to see everything else.  (Many good SciFis seem to have a 'not sure yet exactly how to do this show' season 1.)
Last year, I re-watched it, but finally the HD version of it.

The Expanse was also good.

I never watched Andromeda, maybe I need to do a 1-2 day non stop on that one.
I saw all of Logan's Run when I was a kid.  I'll also have to take a look at Blake's 7.

I know the difficulty in trying to get a proper HD version of Babylon 5 as all the CGI scenes were done in NTSC, but it would be nice.  (And not the BS Youtube HD upsampled ones as they are worse than the European PAL 16:9 DVD version where all the non CGI scenes we really high quality modern film transfers (twice as good as the so called Youtube 1080p AI upscales which are blurry) while the CGI was poorly but de-interlaced and sometimes zoomed in instead of left in 4:3 as they should have been.

[tggzzz]

I'll also have to take a look at Blake's 7.

Plot line: a group of random political prisoners steal the most powerful fighter spaceship in the galaxy. Later they find an omniscient computer. Each episode they still manage to get themselves into scrapes with vastly inferior opposition forces.

The final series ending was memorably good, though.

[RJSV]

   I was just, last night, shuffling around in my robe / bunny slippers, and mumbling some semi-coherent rabid:
   "Ohh LOOK! at that screen!". (As 'Tech Tablet' screen displayed, like data and stuff).
   "And LOOK!, smart kid will save us all, look at him work that screen..." (! HACK!).
(sarcasm).

   "That busy screen, man, it's gotta be some super-tech, superscreen...and that young kid will...
Save us all, by super-hack the Tech Screen".

Roommates didn't appreciate, the analysis...

[RJSV]

(I think they were watching 'The Ark'.

[coppercone2]

I think a EMP blast would fry the glow plugs on a diesel engine it was very powerful. Some engines might rely on them, I think it depends also what fuel you have, I thought some fuels need higher temps to get going, so a electrical heater may be necessary. 

https://gemstatediesel.com/what-diesel-drivers-should-know-about-glow-plugs/

https://www.quora.com/Will-a-diesel-engine-run-without-glow-plugs

[AVGresponding]

Glow plugs require a lot of current. I would guess you'd have to be so close to the origin of the EMP for that to be a problem, that it would be the least of your problems. Remember the inverse-square rule. Also bear in mind the P in EMP; it's a pulse, and not continuous*. Most simple electrical devices (filament lamps, motors, relays/solenoids, primary/secondary cells, glow plugs and other heating elements) would almost certainly be untroubled (as long as they aren't grid connected and active at the time of the EMP), though things like power and telephone lines are, because they are so big; effectively they have a huge "detection" area.

EMP is probably mostly effective against infrastructure rather than individual vehicles/devices.


*There's three parts to a nuclear triggered EMP, E1, E2, and E3, in descending order of strength. E1 is a nanosecond event, E2 is ~1us-1s, and E3 can last from seconds to minutes, it's the "ringing" of the Earth's magnetic field as it recovers.

[coppercone2]

well at least something is there, you never know what methods they have of focusing it or making a stronger field or whatever. If you are arguing about the EM properties of naquadria or something, its pointless. we dont have something strong enough is ALOT better then steam engine failed for electrical reasons.

He never said what show it was.

out of spec unmaintained leaky compression diesel engine failure to start because of glow plug failure due to scifi technology is OK, but if it was a thriller movie, about references existing technology, then its most likely a fail. But that would not be scifi, that would be action/thriller/war.

[mendip_discovery]

Blake's 7 is very good. It was the poor cousin to Dr Who and used some of the same quarries for the alien planets. There are jokes about the wobbly sets etc but on the whole it's got some great plot lines. It's a shame Paul Darrow past away as he was trying to bring a new version into life.

As a brit I have to recomend Red Dwarf. Science no so much but there is some clever filming. They solve who the man on the grassy knowl was. Episodes such as Back to Reality where before its time.

[Monkeh]

How much sci do you want in your fi? If the show focuses on the technology, it's going to have gaping holes in it. If you just want a few elements to provide a scenario, however..

I'm currently watching Andromeda; this is only for real sci-fi-aholics, as it's pretty poor, by and large, definitely B grade.

A show which existed solely to pay Kevin Sorbo. Had its moments, though.

I think a EMP blast would fry the glow plugs on a diesel engine it was very powerful.

Glow plugs are a low voltage extremely high temperature resistive heater. No, they're not going to die from an EMP small enough to not liquify parts of the vehicle.

[CatalinaWOW]

Glow plugs? EMP?  This is exactly the sort of technical weakness that prevails everywhere.

In a forum like this I think it is more laziness than ignorance.  Most here have the facts at hand to analyze it, but actual analysis is difficult and therefore none is done.

But at its heart it is simple.  EMP is not magic, it is EM energy.  It obeys inverse square laws of attenuation (except where guided by atmosphere or wire).  And whether something dies or not depends on how many joules it takes to kill it.  Static sensitive ICs require tiny fractions of a joule and are susceptible.   Incandescent ight bulbs and glow plugs are not.  LED bulbs somewhere between, but they are designed to survive some fairly impressive 'normal' surges on the power lines.  There are exceptions.  A long transmission line oriented properly to the direction of propagation of the EMP can build a large surge, in an effect similar to a traveling wave tube.  Even robust devices connected will be killed.  But that surge will be dissipated as it goes through substations and the like (killing equipment in the process of course) so downstream equipment may well survive and folks on lines not unfortunately oriented won't be affected.

A major EMP attack would have major effects on a country, but it wouldn't kill everything in sight.

[RJSV]

   Maybe, in an EMP post-attack situation, folks might temporarily switch, backwards, to more primitive and therefore robust vehicles!  Like a fleet of old old VW bus and mini-bugs that feature 'Containing NO sensitive electronics'. 
Ditto for vintage radios, on vac tubes.  That stuff could be very popular, during the 15 years or so, required to piece the (broke) world back together...
...and start or restart electronics micros.

[AVGresponding]

In a post-apocalyptic situation, I would take great pleasure in destroying all the hippy/hipster VW rustporters, and the hippies/hipsters with them. It wouldn't be difficult.

[tpowell1830]

SciFi movies and pathetic misconceptions of tech failing for the story line.

I just dont know what to say, just that it's getting bad.
The last 2 scifi's I watched has what they called 'EMP' blasts to knock out everything electric.

Hun, even old non-electronic diesel engines.
Where somehow the fire of the fuel is killed, yet when a vehicle crashes filled with fuel, there fuel explodes.
Even basic non-led flash-light cant work?

Can anyone point me to any good SciFi series which don't make such stupid mistakes?
I just want to sit and watch something where I don't get pissed through the roof for the most basic simple stupid grievances for story line.
Even future SciFis like Star Trek or The Expanse have at many times more acceptable premise than some of the crappy stupidity I have seen recently.

I like my scifi with a bunch of action, sometimes to the point where I ignore the science. My favorite TV series to date is Stargate SG1. The later episodes were hit or miss but I still enjoyed the action.
What I don't like about the TV/Movie industry is that they group creature features and horror with scifi.
I just started watching Andromeda and I am on season 3. It has its moments...

[coppercone2]

and if the glow plug battery is connected to a battery charger that is connected to a electrical grid then it could destroy the glow plugs or wiring or explode the battery

[tggzzz]

Blake's 7 is very good. It was the poor cousin to Dr Who and used some of the same quarries for the alien planets. There are jokes about the wobbly sets etc but on the whole it's got some great plot lines. It's a shame Paul Darrow past away as he was trying to bring a new version into life.

As a brit I have to recomend Red Dwarf. Science no so much but there is some clever filming. They solve who the man on the grassy knowl was. Episodes such as Back to Reality where before its time.

Those quarries were in every programme! ISTR reading that they were within a magic distance of London such that the crew did not have to be paid for travelling.

Red Dwarf was, at its best, very good. Certainly better than Blakes 7.

I will sheepishly admitting liking the first couple of series of Blakes 7 at the time, but the defect I mentioned caused me to become rather disenchanted.

[BrianHG]

How much sci do you want in your fi? If the show focuses on the technology, it's going to have gaping holes in it. If you just want a few elements to provide a scenario, however..

I'm currently watching Andromeda; this is only for real sci-fi-aholics, as it's pretty poor, by and large, definitely B grade.

A show which existed solely to pay Kevin Sorbo. Had its moments, though.

I think a EMP blast would fry the glow plugs on a diesel engine it was very powerful.

Glow plugs are a low voltage extremely high temperature resistive heater. No, they're not going to die from an EMP small enough to not liquify parts of the vehicle.

Now, don't go into EMP pulses strong enough to fry the neurons in our brains as such strength would effect the orbits of the electrons within our biology.

It's like saying your EMP are strong enough for all replacement uninstalled stove heating element sitting on a store shelf who happen to be over a few feet in length will all vaporize.

Yes, with ease, any EMP strong enough to fry most long length wiring to HV distribution transformers will also fry the CMOS gates in an IC with the tiniest length of exposed wiring, but not vaporize the blunt wiring itself.

Also, not all old-fashioned diesel engines or generators use glow plugs.

I can imagine an EMP being strong enough to weld the inner coil windings of a spark plug ignition coil as it may act like a sensitive antenna coil, nothing electronic, just the old fashioned type you see which has a cap and a magnet off the motor's flywheel on a cheap 2-stroke engine.

[BrianHG]

and if the glow plug battery is connected to a battery charger that is connected to a electrical grid then it could destroy the glow plugs or wiring or explode the battery

No, the most likely scenario is the charger's transformer may fry itself, but secondly what will happen either way is the charger's diodes will fry to a short, shorting out the battery, thus making the wiring between charger and battery slowly burn up so long as there is enough charge in said battery to do so and there is no fusing between the battery and charger's bridge diodes.

[vk6zgo]

Blake's 7 is very good. It was the poor cousin to Dr Who and used some of the same quarries for the alien planets. There are jokes about the wobbly sets etc but on the whole it's got some great plot lines. It's a shame Paul Darrow past away as he was trying to bring a new version into life.

As a brit I have to recomend Red Dwarf. Science no so much but there is some clever filming. They solve who the man on the grassy knowl was. Episodes such as Back to Reality where before its time.

Those quarries were in every programme! ISTR reading that they were within a magic distance of London such that the crew did not have to be paid for travelling.

Red Dwarf was, at its best, very good. Certainly better than Blakes 7.

I will sheepishly admitting liking the first couple of series of Blakes 7 at the time, but the defect I mentioned caused me to become rather disenchanted.

I remember those quarries well!

In a 1960s episode of "Dr Who", they were the stamping ground of some of the cheapest aliens I have ever seen on that series, & they got pretty cheap! (Remember the "Dalek Supreme", who had an Eveready magnetlite sticking out of his "forehead" where normal ones have that strange appendage that looks a bit like a "party favour"?).

Anyhow, the dear old Beeb must have spent all their budget, as the aforesaid aliens looked uncannily like cupboards with several legs, one of which folded out to zap unsuspecting passersby.

It wasn't just Dr Who, though, the BBC also had a show starring Ray Barrett as a "troubleshooter" for the "Mogul" oil company.
The quarries stood in for the Middle East, & various other places, including in one memorable episode where it was supposed to be Outback Australia.
In it, Ray, or someone else (can't remember) was close to death in the "trackless wastes" because they "hadn't taken their salt tablets".
Ray, who was an Australian could have told them it was bollocks, as most people get enough salt in their diet.

Quite honestly, the Brits produced some seriously dire programmes back in those days, although they steadfastly believed they made the "best programmes" in the World.

[vk6zgo]

"Jericho" was full of blunders---not really "tech", but just plain old general knowledge.
It was supposed to be set in a rural community, but the characters gave no indication of the kind of knowledge widespread in such communities.

In one egregious example, a group of "heroes", told that the hospital EPP was running out of fuel, set out to salvage "gasoline" from cars immobilised by an EMP.

To this end, they grabbed a flat tray truck, found a large plastic tank somewhere, & headed off.
Why plastic? ---Their explanation was to avoid an explosion due to static electricity.

Well pardon me, "Mr big city scriptwriter", but this "ole country boy" has only seen "gasoline" transported in large steel tanks or in what we, in Oz call "44 gallon" drums, & plastic is well known for the possibility of static discharges.

"But wait---there's more!" as they say in TV ads,
When they get enough "gas", they very deftly pour it into the sump of the EPP.

Of course, EEPs are very unlikely to run off "gasoline", as they are almost universally diesel units, & rural areas are "awash" with diesel fuel, so going around milking random car tanks would not have been necessary, even had they got the fuel type right.

A farmer isn't going to drive his huge new tractor into town every time he needs to "fill up", so farms will have bulk supplies, even ignoring that in the tanks of their newer "high tech" equipment, supposedly immobilised by EMP.

Another source would be the large tanks in the locomotive/s drawing the stranded train, which was visited to salvage food, dunny paper, & whatever, in an earlier episode.

[jonovid]

the BBC screenplay known as Dr Who has lost something in recent years. too many new Doctors,  the big 2018 retcon in the name of political correctness.
all have taken their toll on the once beloved show,  with its cheesy aliens. in 2022 most i know no longer watch the show.
the Daleks have an odd pedigree- IMO  going back to the 1960s with what looks like an old louvered studio light housing for a head. industrial warning lights for eyes/ ears.
high voltage bowling ball type insulator for a nose , paint rollers for arms / guns and a rubber bumper-bace that looks familiar as the motor & chassis of carnival dodgem-bumper car.
most of this was seen at that time in black-&-white in Australia, so we failed to notice.

one of the 1970s star trek characters had a circular automotive engine air filter for sunglasses.

[sleemanj]

The only thing Doctor Who lost was a good show runner, thankfully Chibs has been ditched and we can hopefully get back to some good Doctor Who episodes, I mean, David Tennant coming back, how bad can it be.  Jodi would have been a good doctor, if the stories hadn't been trash.

Stargate Universe is my preference of that franchise, much less episodic, much more character driven, much more interesting premise instead of just "fight this week's baddies" all the time.

The first season of Upload is fun (bit of a stretch to call it science fiction, but if we are including Doctor Who...).

Ascencion mini series I loved for an interesting treatment of a Generation Ship/Ark idea, sadly only got one series so the story was unfinished but it's still worth it.  I wish there were more series about generation ships.

Dark Matter, is hit and miss, but had a lot going for it, except the whole space samurai thing, which I heartily hated.

Undone, not scifi except for being unstuck in time, but a nice series, and the rotoscope style animation is great.

Star Trek Prodigy is perhaps my favourite of the Trek universe (but Enterprise I'm partial to also), despite appearances, it's not a show just for kids. 

"Earth 2" is going back a way, but I think it's a great series, another one cut short (but thankfully since apparently the early plans for series 2 were.. not good, to jazz it up for the unwashed masses)