Suggestion for building a 2500 sq meter factory

[ali_asadzadeh]

Hi,
Today I managed to buy a 2500 sq meter bare land for building a factory, it's exactly 50 X 50 meter, and they would allow me to build 60% of the area of the land. so I'm here for any suggestions to build a nice factory mainly for the purpose of manufacturing electronic parts, mainly in the industrial category and mainly in the smart grid segment, but I'm open to do other things if they are profitable!

Thanks in advance for your help.

[senso]

A 1500 sq meter factory is tiny(60% of 50x50), its good maybe for the warehouse/storage of a final product assembly factory.. Or for offices.

Have you taken apart even a cheapo wifi enabled "smart" plug and count how many different parts are in there?

[ali_asadzadeh]

A 1500 sq meter factory is tiny(60% of 50x50), its good maybe for the warehouse/storage of a final product assembly factory.. Or for offices.

Have you taken apart even a cheapo wifi enabled "smart" plug and count how many different parts are in there?

suppose that it has about 500 parts, so what? the pick and place and storage for that would not take that huge space, consider 0402 and 0603 parts, a reel which is about 5000 units measures 20cm and the height is under 1cm, besides the factory can be built there can have 3, 4 meter floors. so effectively the space is around 1500 X 3 = 4500 sq meters

[EEVblog]

Are you doing PCB Pick'n'Place yourself? If so, how many lines?
I'd be talking with a PnP machine supplier first to get an idea for how many lines you need and typical sizes and floor areas for that, they will know this.
All PnP you'd want to do in a nice clean office type environment, not a big tall tin roof factory etc.

Is there messy/dirty industrial machining or chemical type stuff to be done? Is so that needs it's own section, maybe with the traditional factory roof and ventilation access to shop air and water etc.

[EEVblog]

besides the factory can be built there can have 3, 4 meter floors. so effectively the space is around 1500 X 3 = 4500 sq meters

If multi-story then you'd likely want at least 3 stories. 1 for offices. 1 for PnP and other electronics assembly. 1 for packaging and shipment and storage (always make it the bottom for good truck pallet access.)

[BravoV]

Hi,
Today I managed to buy a 2500 sq meter bare land for building a factory, ...

..<snip>..

... I'm open to do other things if they are profitable!

So just bought a land, without knowing EXACTLY what are you going to do with it ?

[ali_asadzadeh]

So just bought a land, without knowing EXACTLY what are you going to do with it ?

I won a project and they offered a good land or money, I choose the land, because it's way better, considering it would get capital gain over the years, without doing anything!

If multi-story then you'd likely want at least 3 stories. 1 for offices. 1 for PnP and other electronics assembly. 1 for packaging and shipment and storage (always make it the bottom for good truck pallet access.)

Thanks for the tips

Are you doing PCB Pick'n'Place yourself? If so, how many lines?
I'd be talking with a PnP machine supplier first to get an idea for how many lines you need and typical sizes and floor areas for that, they will know this.
All PnP you'd want to do in a nice clean office type environment, not a big tall tin roof factory etc.

Is there messy/dirty industrial machining or chemical type stuff to be done? Is so that needs it's own section, maybe with the traditional factory roof and ventilation access to shop air and water etc.

First of all, we are small, But I think some how big! I think if we could design and produce and sell something moderate complexity in the order of 100-200 USD and we could sell around 10K units for each yer, we are doing great! so after that we have more money and we can buy additional lands,

I was thinking of having these lines for the future, a small PNP for electronic assembly (1 line for now) I have seen around 4-5 lines in my city,so I think a small line something like a 200-500 sq meter area for that would do the job, I want to have a mechanics line too, it should have 3 and 5 axies CNC, plastic injection machine, a lathe some other mechanical machines, like a wire cut, a spark machine, etc... I think it would need around 1000 sq meter, some test and QC room, some test chambers like big ovens for testing product in 60C for 24 hours, around 200 sq meter, some office area around 200-300 sq meter, there is lot's of space left to fill the void! Also I plan to put solar panels at the roof for managing to produce some parts of the building with the free sun energy,

These are my toughs, of course it's a bare land for now and It needs lot's of money to do all these things, so there is another challenge for me to mange to do these things in the correct order so that I can do it all in under 3-5 years.!

[EEVblog]

So you won a contract and they offered you some land or cash (good choice taking the land I suspect, assuming you have the other cash to make stuff happen), but it sound like you don't really know what you'll be producing? 
What is the contract actually for?
Usually a contract is do produce a known product or service within a given time frame, yet there seems to be no real product yet, and no real time frame apart from your own 3-5 year dream?

[EEVblog]

I was thinking of having these lines for the future, a small PNP for electronic assembly (1 line for now) I have seen around 4-5 lines in my city,so I think a small line something like a 200-500 sq meter area for that would do the job, I want to have a mechanics line too, it should have 3 and 5 axies CNC, plastic injection machine, a lathe some other mechanical machines, like a wire cut, a spark machine, etc... I think it would need around 1000 sq meter, some test and QC room, some test chambers like big ovens for testing product in 60C for 24 hours, around 200 sq meter, some office area around 200-300 sq meter, there is lot's of space left to fill the void! Also I plan to put solar panels at the roof for managing to produce some parts of the building with the free sun energy,

All this plus a building is going to be at least several million USD equivalent, where does that cash come from?

[ali_asadzadeh]

So you won a contract and they offered you some land or cash (good choice taking the land I suspect, assuming you have the other cash to make stuff happen), but it sound like you don't really know what you'll be producing? 
What is the contract actually for?
Usually a contract is do produce a known product or service within a given time frame, yet there seems to be no real product yet, and no real time frame apart from your own 3-5 year dream?

It's for upgrading a protection relay, for the smart grid and the time frame is 18 months.
I have several things in my mind, like panel voltmeters, amp meters, loggers,alarm annunciators, etc...

All this plus a building is going to be at least several million USD equivalent, where does that cash come from?

I agree with you, But when you have no money your brain start to thinks harder!! I'm planing to build some of the things for the mechanics line, like the CNC, actually I have done a 3D CNC before for a customer.but for the PnP and other complex machines I plan to buy them, I think china would have some good candidates in the coming years for us

And I know that building a factory can be done in steps and can be done with paying in mulitple time orders, like paying 10K for 12 months for a machine, but have it right now!

The hole point in here is that I manage to build it as universal as possible, so If things goes bad for one particular product I can switch to others very soon, also I can do things in small qty but many different kinds of products.

[Electro Detective]

All I can say is make sure you don't go cheap on the incoming electricity,
install BIG THICK oversize cabling everywhere,
so work gets done efficiently, instead of dealing with sagging low voltage to weaken or kill machinery,
banging your head later  trying to 'upgrade it' with money you may not have 

and make easy access for incoming and outgoing deliveries,
for less delays, brawling and foul mouthing at the gates 

and good luck 

[EEVblog]

So you won a contract and they offered you some land or cash (good choice taking the land I suspect, assuming you have the other cash to make stuff happen), but it sound like you don't really know what you'll be producing? 
What is the contract actually for?
Usually a contract is do produce a known product or service within a given time frame, yet there seems to be no real product yet, and no real time frame apart from your own 3-5 year dream?

It's for upgrading a protection relay, for the smart grid and the time frame is 18 months.
I have several things in my mind, like panel voltmeters, amp meters, loggers,alarm annunciators, etc...

All this plus a building is going to be at least several million USD equivalent, where does that cash come from?

I agree with you, But when you have no money your brain start to thinks harder!! I'm planing to build some of the things for the mechanics line, like the CNC, actually I have done a 3D CNC before for a customer.but for the PnP and other complex machines I plan to buy them, I think china would have some good candidates in the coming years for us

And I know that building a factory can be done in steps and can be done with paying in mulitple time orders, like paying 10K for 12 months for a machine, but have it right now!

The hole point in here is that I manage to build it as universal as possible, so If things goes bad for one particular product I can switch to others very soon, also I can do things in small qty but many different kinds of products.

Sorry, but this all seems quite strange. Things may be very different in Iran, but in any western country you would have no hope at all of building your own multi-story commercial building and equipping out a full factory like this (the cost is many millions regardless of how you do it) without a huge amount of cash. Either your own cash, or a loan or investment money. You can't "do it in steps".
Like you can't just build a few rooms for now and add-on later, commercial building don't work like that.
Where are you going to get the money from?
What space do you have available in the mean time in order to work on your smart meter contract thing? You can't wait until you build the building obviously...

Also, is this a government contract?

[ali_asadzadeh]

Sorry, but this all seems quite strange. Things may be very different in Iran, but in any western country you would have no hope at all of building your own multi-story commercial building and equipping out a full factory like this (the cost is many millions regardless of how you do it) without a huge amount of cash. Either your own cash, or a loan or investment money. You can't "do it in steps".
Like you can't just build a few rooms for now and add-on later, commercial building don't work like that.
Where are you going to get the money from?
What space do you have available in the mean time in order to work on your smart meter contract thing? You can't wait until you build the building obviously...

Also, is this a government contract?

Every where on this planet is very hard to build your factory, including Iran. I have discussed it a few months ago about how to build my own store. which was quite expensive to finish, Here take a look.

For decoration only if I wanted to do it in normal way it would have cost me a lot, but by doing in smart ways and learning new skills and the right people to help, I got it done about 2-3 times lower the cost.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/designing-my-new-store-do-we-have-3d-models-available/msg2139124/#msg2139124

Where are you going to get the money from?

By doing what I'm already doing right now, and also adding some lower entry cost products to my company products. like panel voltmetere!

What space do you have available in the mean time in order to work on your smart meter contract thing? You can't wait until you build the building obviously...

My store, it's a commercial store and I would use it as a store and a design house.

Where are you going to get the money from?

Selling my own products, selling electronic parts, and by getting the other company product shares!(it's about 25% of the profit of the projects that I have already designed for them)

Also, is this a government contract?

No, it's a private company project,the government is a pitfall in every place on earth, regulations, lack of money, bureaucracy, stupid rules, etc...

you should try to avoid the government as far as you can do that.

[Ampera]

The store looks pretty nice tho.

[Kjelt]

Ok so you have land, money to build the building and the rest has to come in over the coming years?
In that case build the first ground floor for yourself and the other stories of the building as universal as possible so also for offices on 1st floor for instance.
Then start small and rent those first floor offices out to other companies while you grow your own business. Make sure the money keeps flowing to pay the expenses and your startup costs.

[ali_asadzadeh]

Ok so you have land, money to build the building and the rest has to come in over the coming years?
In that case build the first ground floor for yourself and the other stories of the building as universal as possible so also for offices on 1st floor for instance.
Then start small and rent those first floor offices out to other companies while you grow your own business. Make sure the money keeps flowing to pay the expenses and your startup costs.

I have not enough money to build it completely, I should do it step by step, my plan is for 3-5 years.
Thanks, It did not came to my mind, yes, we can rent out to others to have more money to build!

In Iran two things happened that helped me to reach near my dream, first of all, because of sanctions the US dollar has increased a lot, now you can higher people with very little money, also it impacted materials, so the materials cost is low too, if I manage to earn some $ I can build it very faster, for now the cost of building 1 sq meter building is around 200$ and it's insanely cheap compared to other places, also you can higher a good engineer (at least 3-5 years work experience) for around 500$ a month, that's insanely cheap too! so the option are very good for smart people and smart moves

The store looks pretty nice tho.

Thanks

[EEVblog]

The store looks pretty nice tho.

Yeah, looks great!

[EEVblog]

Sorry, but this all seems quite strange. Things may be very different in Iran, but in any western country you would have no hope at all of building your own multi-story commercial building and equipping out a full factory like this (the cost is many millions regardless of how you do it) without a huge amount of cash. Either your own cash, or a loan or investment money. You can't "do it in steps".
Like you can't just build a few rooms for now and add-on later, commercial building don't work like that.
Where are you going to get the money from?
What space do you have available in the mean time in order to work on your smart meter contract thing? You can't wait until you build the building obviously...

Also, is this a government contract?

Every where on this planet is very hard to build your factory, including Iran. I have discussed it a few months ago about how to build my own store. which was quite expensive to finish, Here take a look.

For decoration only if I wanted to do it in normal way it would have cost me a lot, but by doing in smart ways and learning new skills and the right people to help, I got it done about 2-3 times lower the cost.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/designing-my-new-store-do-we-have-3d-models-available/msg2139124/#msg2139124

Where are you going to get the money from?

By doing what I'm already doing right now, and also adding some lower entry cost products to my company products. like panel voltmetere!

What space do you have available in the mean time in order to work on your smart meter contract thing? You can't wait until you build the building obviously...

My store, it's a commercial store and I would use it as a store and a design house.

Where are you going to get the money from?

Selling my own products, selling electronic parts, and by getting the other company product shares!(it's about 25% of the profit of the projects that I have already designed for them)

Also, is this a government contract?

No, it's a private company project,the government is a pitfall in every place on earth, regulations, lack of money, bureaucracy, stupid rules, etc...

you should try to avoid the government as far as you can do that.

Ok, thanks, that's much clearer now.
Sounds like a plan then.
Just be aware that building will suck up a lot of your time though, that's less time you'll be making money.
Is there an option to buildthing else quicker and cheaper on the land and flip it for a profit and then buying a commercial building already build you can just move into?

[ali_asadzadeh]

Ok, thanks, that's much clearer now.
Sounds like a plan then.
Just be aware that building will suck up a lot of your time though, that's less time you'll be making money.
Is there an option to buildthing else quicker and cheaper on the land and flip it for a profit and then buying a commercial building already build you can just move into?

Thanks, It might be, but I do not know, or how to do it. I'm still young, only 37 years old so Maybe I have not enough experience there,

There are some options that came to my mind though!
I have bought the land in an special economic region in Iran which is free for customs and has some certain benefits for foreign investment, also It has huge potentials regarding exporting goods outside of Iran.

If I could find a way to manufacture and sell my current product outside Iran and get some $ and convert it to crypto and put it in here, or could bring the product blue print outside Iran and establish another company and manufacture it in some place like china and sell it world wide,it can be done very quickly in here,then I have huge margin regarding material and building cost and can build it like a king I always think globally and wanted to do things in the globe

[EEVblog]

Ok, thanks, that's much clearer now.
Sounds like a plan then.
Just be aware that building will suck up a lot of your time though, that's less time you'll be making money.
Is there an option to buildthing else quicker and cheaper on the land and flip it for a profit and then buying a commercial building already build you can just move into?

Thanks, It might be, but I do not know, or how to do it. I'm still young, only 37 years old so Maybe I have not enough experience there,

There are some options that came to my mind though!
I have bought the land in an special economic region in Iran which is free for customs and has some certain benefits for foreign investment, also It has huge potentials regarding exporting goods outside of Iran.

If I could find a way to manufacture and sell my current product outside Iran and get some $ and convert it to crypto and put it in here, or could bring the product blue print outside Iran and establish another company and manufacture it in some place like china and sell it world wide,it can be done very quickly in here,then I have huge margin regarding material and building cost and can build it like a king I always think globally and wanted to do things in the globe

Very interesting!
China started a similar thing in Shanghai:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Free-Trade_Zone
When Altium was picking a factory there we had to chose one inside the free trade zone for various logistics reasons.

You could park a caravan on your vacant lot for tax purposes 

[ali_asadzadeh]

Very interesting!
China started a similar thing in Shanghai:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Free-Trade_Zone
When Altium was picking a factory there we had to chose one inside the free trade zone for various logistics reasons.

You could park a caravan on your vacant lot for tax purposes 

I will send progress in this forum for suggestion a head! thanks for the tips.

[soldar]

Very interesting!
China started a similar thing in Shanghai:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai_Free-Trade_Zone
When Altium was picking a factory there we had to chose one inside the free trade zone for various logistics reasons.

Shanghai is pretty new. The mother of all free trade zones is, of course, Shenzhen, started in 1980 next door to Hong Kong. At that time it was all just countryside and fields.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shenzhen_Special_Economic_Zone

Today it is a huge city that rivals in modernity and wealth any western city.
Estimated population is over 20 million.

Search youtube for Shenzhen light show 4K and you will see many videos in high detail.





I first traveled to Shenzhen a bit over 20 years ago and it has been an impressive development.

[chickenHeadKnob]

You havn't mentioned how many employees you expect and how do they get to your factory? Public transit? In North America cheap undeveloped land tends to be on the outskirts of urban areas with poor available public transport, which means you have to supply a parking lot area out of your land allotment. This is also a zoning requirement.

I am all for holding land as an investment, you can make good profits in the right location with the correct timing. However I think you should decouple the fact that you already have a particular plot from the way you design a factory. Design the factory first then trade/sell/buy to get the fitting real estate.

[ali_asadzadeh]

You havn't mentioned how many employees you expect and how do they get to your factory? Public transit? In North America cheap undeveloped land tends to be on the outskirts of urban areas with poor available public transport, which means you have to supply a parking lot area out of your land allotment. This is also a zoning requirement.

I am all for holding land as an investment, you can make good profits in the right location with the correct timing. However I think you should decouple the fact that you already have a particular plot from the way you design a factory. Design the factory first then trade/sell/buy to get the fitting real estate.

It's some how like north America, it's about 30 minutes drive from my home which is around the city center. I think they might have some buses already for general transportation in the morning and in the evening.

[German_EE]

This whole thread doesn't smell right. I know that there are some clever and experienced people on this board but if you have the resources to build and equip a factory then the first step is to get proper commercial advice from professionals, not ask around on a bulletin board.

Also, this is Iran we are talking about. Sanctions? Anyone supplying goods or services to Iran will probably find themselves in a world of hurt thanks to the activities of the US Government. ali_asadzadeh, you're probably a nice guy, but I really do urge everyone to walk away from this one.

[soldar]

  This whole thread doesn't smell right. I know that there are some clever and experienced people on this board but if you have the resources to build and equip a factory then the first step is to get proper commercial advice from professionals, not ask around on a bulletin board.

He was advised to get professional advice in his other thread too and maybe he is doing it but I guess there is no harm in just chatting about it in a forum.

  Also, this is Iran we are talking about. Sanctions? Anyone supplying goods or services to Iran will probably find themselves in a world of hurt thanks to the activities of the US Government. ali_asadzadeh, you're probably a nice guy, but I really do urge everyone to walk away from this one.

Nobody here is supplying goods or services. Were just talking and if the world needs more of something it's talking to people from other cultures.

All my life I've seen many wars started with the premise that "those are bad people, let's attack them before they do it to us" and every time it was BS.

The topic of this thread is completely innocuous and I see no reason to walk away.