General > General Technical Chat
superfast (too fast?) electric scooters
thm_w:
--- Quote from: Zero999 on April 27, 2023, 09:15:14 am ---That's the whole point: to limit the speed to what an average person can sustain for a decent period of time on an ordinary bike.
--- End quote ---
I can't find the justification for the laws but, it could also be a direct safety consideration. Above X speed injuries will be much worse.
But my point was it varies based on region. We've got UK 25km/h, Canada 32km/h, USA 32-45km/h. Is the UK one "right"?
25km/h on a flat road, is only 115W of output power. Its a bit hard to see that the average person can only output 115W for 1hr. But if you include sedentary individuals, you could be right.
Someone:
--- Quote from: thm_w on April 27, 2023, 11:25:32 pm ---
--- Quote from: Zero999 on April 27, 2023, 09:15:14 am ---That's the whole point: to limit the speed to what an average person can sustain for a decent period of time on an ordinary bike.
--- End quote ---
I can't find the justification for the laws but, it could also be a direct safety consideration. Above X speed injuries will be much worse.
But my point was it varies based on region. We've got UK 25km/h, Canada 32km/h, USA 32-45km/h. Is the UK one "right"?
25km/h on a flat road, is only 115W of output power. Its a bit hard to see that the average person can only output 115W for 1hr. But if you include sedentary individuals, you could be right.
--- End quote ---
"average" person is below that figure, while self selecting "fit" people would come in around there:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_power
Even young healthy males have trouble meeting 150W for an hour and that's operating to exhaustion:
"Effects of Differing Pedalling Speeds on the Power-Duration Relationship of High Intensity Cycle Ergometry." McNaughton & Thomas 1996
(people cycling for transport generally don't arrive unable to function)
Zero999:
--- Quote from: thm_w on April 27, 2023, 11:25:32 pm ---
--- Quote from: Zero999 on April 27, 2023, 09:15:14 am ---That's the whole point: to limit the speed to what an average person can sustain for a decent period of time on an ordinary bike.
--- End quote ---
I can't find the justification for the laws but, it could also be a direct safety consideration. Above X speed injuries will be much worse.
But my point was it varies based on region. We've got UK 25km/h, Canada 32km/h, USA 32-45km/h. Is the UK one "right"?
--- End quote ---
The same could be said about anything.
I think 25kmph was decided based on the fact it's the most common speed for a typical cyclist and what most other road users will expect someone on a bike to be doing. I do notice when I'm cycling fast, I get more people pulling out in front of me, overtaking dangerously and cutting me up, because they tend to underestimate my speed.
--- Quote ---25km/h on a flat road, is only 115W of output power. Its a bit hard to see that the average person can only output 115W for 1hr. But if you include sedentary individuals, you could be right.
--- End quote ---
Around 100W is considered typical for an average person, with moderate effort, not a fit person, let alone athlete.
langwadt:
--- Quote from: Zero999 on April 28, 2023, 12:00:56 pm ---
--- Quote from: thm_w on April 27, 2023, 11:25:32 pm ---
--- Quote from: Zero999 on April 27, 2023, 09:15:14 am ---That's the whole point: to limit the speed to what an average person can sustain for a decent period of time on an ordinary bike.
--- End quote ---
I can't find the justification for the laws but, it could also be a direct safety consideration. Above X speed injuries will be much worse.
But my point was it varies based on region. We've got UK 25km/h, Canada 32km/h, USA 32-45km/h. Is the UK one "right"?
--- End quote ---
The same could be said about anything.
I think 25kmph was decided based on the fact it's the most common speed for a typical cyclist and what most other road users will expect someone on a bike to be doing. I do notice when I'm cycling fast, I get more people pulling out in front of me, overtaking dangerously and cutting me up, because they tend to underestimate my speed.
--- Quote ---25km/h on a flat road, is only 115W of output power. Its a bit hard to see that the average person can only output 115W for 1hr. But if you include sedentary individuals, you could be right.
--- End quote ---
Around 100W is considered typical for an average person, with moderate effort, not a fit person, let alone athlete.
--- End quote ---
this is for cyclists
https://www.cyclinganalytics.com/blog/2018/06/how-does-your-cycling-power-output-compare
Zero999:
--- Quote from: langwadt on April 28, 2023, 12:20:18 pm ---
--- Quote from: Zero999 on April 28, 2023, 12:00:56 pm ---
--- Quote from: thm_w on April 27, 2023, 11:25:32 pm ---
--- Quote from: Zero999 on April 27, 2023, 09:15:14 am ---That's the whole point: to limit the speed to what an average person can sustain for a decent period of time on an ordinary bike.
--- End quote ---
I can't find the justification for the laws but, it could also be a direct safety consideration. Above X speed injuries will be much worse.
But my point was it varies based on region. We've got UK 25km/h, Canada 32km/h, USA 32-45km/h. Is the UK one "right"?
--- End quote ---
The same could be said about anything.
I think 25kmph was decided based on the fact it's the most common speed for a typical cyclist and what most other road users will expect someone on a bike to be doing. I do notice when I'm cycling fast, I get more people pulling out in front of me, overtaking dangerously and cutting me up, because they tend to underestimate my speed.
--- Quote ---25km/h on a flat road, is only 115W of output power. Its a bit hard to see that the average person can only output 115W for 1hr. But if you include sedentary individuals, you could be right.
--- End quote ---
Around 100W is considered typical for an average person, with moderate effort, not a fit person, let alone athlete.
--- End quote ---
this is for cyclists
https://www.cyclinganalytics.com/blog/2018/06/how-does-your-cycling-power-output-compare
--- End quote ---
That's not representative of the average population, but keen cyclists.
--- Quote ---It’s worth saying a few words about Cycling Analytics users, because they aren’t a perfectly random sampling of cyclists or people overall. The best term that I can think of is that Cycling Analytics users are “serious cyclists”. All the data here comes from people with power meters, and about half of Cycling Analytics users race regularly.
--- End quote ---
The average power output for a group of working age people, 16 to 70, split 50/50 male/female will be much lower and I'm also talking about moderate effort, not pushing hard at it.
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