Author Topic: Tektronix eBay scams (Read 19757 times)

Omicron · « **on:** January 30, 2014, 01:01:19 pm »

Although I've had good experiences buying stuff on eBay for the most part, in the past months I've run into two separate sales that I suspect were attempts at fraud. I've no hard evidence off course, but I decided it would be a good thing to share my experiences. Especially since on both occasions the subject item was a modern Tektronix 4000B series oscilloscope that might entice other members of this forum. These are not the cheapest things around by a long shot!

The first experience I had was with a seller in the UK that put up a DPO4104B for a little under 3000 euro's. As new complete with probes, the whole enchilada. Sound a bit too good to be true? Yep, but the seller offered complete paypal buyer protection so I thought I'd give it a shot and I bought it. Sure enough the item is marked shipped a day after I paid. A week later though and nothing had arrived. I'm in Belgium so shipping from the UK is usually 3 days. Two weeks later, three weeks later..same story. Contacted the seller. I must say that from the get go he was very slow in responding. He claimed he "lost" the receipt he got from the parcel service so no tracking number. Then he claimed the item was "stuck in customs" (I'm pretty sure there is no customs for shipments within the EU). Finally I decided to open a dispute on eBay. Now with the paypal buyer protection program you have a certain deadline for submitting a claim for a refund. Curiously 2 days before this deadline I receive a message from paypal. An e-check was sent to me with a full refund. Yay! Right? Wrong! Turns out an e-check is only definitive a week or so after you receive first notice of it. That didn't sound right to me. So two days later I decided to file a claim anyway. And I was happy to have done so as a week later I got another message from paypal telling me the e-check bounced!! In my opinion this seller had been trying to trick me into not filing a claim before the deadline. I must say though that once I did file the claim Paypal did take good care of me. I made my case and a couple of weeks later I got a full refund! The moral of this story:

- don't trust paypal e-cheques!!
- paypal buyer protection does work, but stick to the deadlines no matter what the seller says or does

The second experience I had was just recently. A seller in Italy put up an auction for a Tektronix MSO4104B, complete with probes etc etc. Even had some serial decode options installed. Starting bid 1000 euro's. Sounds good right? I put in a low bid and basically forgot about it as I never expected to win this auction. Much to my surprise a week later I won the auction for 1500 euro's. What? 1500 euro's for a scope that still sells new for close to 20.000 euro's? What's going on here? There was only one other guy who had bid on this auction. Closer inspection revealed why. Seller has no feedback at all. First auction on eBay. Ok, that can happen right? Everyone needs to start somewhere. But wait...payment...only accepts direct bank transfer. What? No buyer protection whatsoever. This is starting to sound iffy. I really should learn to pay more attention before I bid! And to put the last nail in the coffin: when the seller sends me his bank details it turns out to be a POLISH bank account and address. Huh? This item was being presented as being sold from Italy? Needless to say I haven't paid.

Off course now I have an "unpaid sale" in my ebay account. Anyone knows how to get rid of that? Already contacted eBay customer support and explained my concerns.

Moral of the story: if you see expensive Tektronix equipment being offered for sale within the EU at hard to resist prices: be extra careful! If the seller has no feedback and does not offer you a paypal payment option with full buyer protection: back away!

grumpydoc · « **Reply #1 on:** January 30, 2014, 02:18:59 pm »

If something is too good to be true it probably isn't.

I've seen plenty that were obviously dubious - fortunately only ever got scammed once and it was a low price item.

I know everyone has to start somewhere but I have to confess that I'd be pretty dubious about bidding 1500 euros on an item where the seller has no feedback. Don't Ebay in italy (or Belgium) insist on sellers accepting PayPal?

Often, though, scam sellers actually have good feedback but when you look at it it's for large numbers of small, unrelated items. Then they apparently have several high value items for sale, often at apparently low prices. By the time Ebay or PayPal catch up with them they've pocketed the money and are long gone.

Omicron · « **Reply #2 on:** January 30, 2014, 02:45:22 pm »

Quote from: grumpydoc on January 30, 2014, 02:18:59 pm

Often, though, scam sellers actually have good feedback but when you look at it it's for large numbers of small, unrelated items. Then they apparently have several high value items for sale, often at apparently low prices. By the time Ebay or PayPal catch up with them they've pocketed the money and are long gone.

In fact that described the UK seller in my first story perfectly! I initially trusted him because he had pretty good feedback. But like you said, it was for things like USB serial adapters and second hand hard drives. All cheap stuff.

eBay got back to me by the way. They recommend me not to proceed with the purchase and told me to contact them again if the seller makes a fuss over it. So looks like I'm in the clear.

Fortunately neither affair has cost me any money. The sick part of it is that my first experience actually had me more confident placing bids because pay-pal buyer protection process worked out really well. I bid on this item from my phone and hadn't checked the payment options. Ooops! Lesson learned for next time!

Bored@Work · « **Reply #3 on:** January 30, 2014, 04:32:01 pm »

Quote from: Omicron on January 30, 2014, 02:45:22 pm

and hadn't checked the payment options.

I remember a similar eBay scam. Part of that scam was that the scammer changed the payment options while the auction was already running. I don't know if eBay still allows to change the payment options. If they do you might not have missed anything when bidding.

Stonent · « **Reply #4 on:** January 30, 2014, 05:13:58 pm »

I don't think I've bought anything with a value of more than $100 from eBay.

KJDS · « **Reply #5 on:** January 30, 2014, 05:45:54 pm »

I recently had to make a video of an item to show a customer it really existed after he had a couple of bad experiences, so perhaps there is a phase of it happening.

Quote from: Stonent on January 30, 2014, 05:13:58 pm

I don't think I've bought anything with a value of more than $100 from eBay.

I try and only sell things that are more than £100. I just cannot be bothered picking and packing an item that only costs a few pounds. I'd far rather sell one £1000 item than a hundred £10 items. I've now got my feedback to a state where people can see that have a lot of happy customers buying that sort of item.

rdl · « **Reply #6 on:** January 30, 2014, 06:08:06 pm »

I bought a Tektronix 2247A a few years ago for $240, and a BK 4040 function gen for $200 not long after, both work fine - no problems. Of course, I got ripped off once for $100 before I learned about the time limits for claims.

marshallh · « **Reply #7 on:** January 31, 2014, 06:05:26 am »

If you suspect a scam, copy the main auction image and run it through Google Image search reverse search. Usually you'll find its ripped from some other auction a few weeks prior, or someone's personal site.

retiredcaps · « **Reply #8 on:** January 31, 2014, 07:40:55 am »

Quote from: rdl on January 30, 2014, 06:08:06 pm

Of course, I got ripped off once for $100 before I learned about the time limits for claims.

I made a similar mistake in trusting the seller to wait a few more days when I haven't received the item. Of course, I waited past the ebay resolution date and was left with no recourse. Emails to the seller asking for a refund or help all went unanswered.

Now I know better. I always open an ebay resolution case before the cut off date.

grumpydoc · « **Reply #9 on:** January 31, 2014, 08:15:58 am »

Quote

I made a similar mistake in trusting the seller to wait a few more days when I haven't received the item. Of course, I waited past the ebay resolution date and was left with no recourse. Emails to the seller asking for a refund or help all went unanswered.

Now I know better. I always open an ebay resolution case before the cut off date.

At least Ebay sort-of takes it seriously these days as they knew their act needed cleaning up to compete with the Amazon Marketplace - which seems to be what they're trying to do.

I got scammed for a £30 router back in the days when ebay had something like a £20 "administrative" fee to investigate a case (which was not refunded even if you "won") so it was pretty clear all I could do was take the hit. That got ebay a terrible reputation which still sticks.

Fraser · « **Reply #10 on:** January 31, 2014, 01:02:53 pm »

Ebay has certainly become more risky in terms of scams. I have over 2800 feedback so have been around on ebay a log time and witnessed the change. I have lost count of the number of scams that I have reported that involved stolen images and dodgy payment methods on expensice kit. They keep re-appearing though. Most have used stolen user accounts, so they look legit !

Another nasty development has been the increase in Schill bidding. For those unaware, a seller places an item for auction and a relative, or friend, places bids to push the legitimate bidders higher and higher until the seller is happy with the bid amount. They use relations and friends in an effort to avoid linking back to their address or account. Be very wary of auctions where a mystery bidder keeps bidding small amounts to push you to your Max Bid and then stops bidding just below it. The other trick is to bid a high figure, note the high bidders max bid amount, withraw the high bid, and them re-bid just under the noted amount. I had this happen three times in one auction for a trail-cam. I realised what had been going on and after winning the auction, reported it to ebay as suspicious activity. Ebay investigated, whilst I was on the phone to them, and confirmed that the unusual bidding behaviour was a scam as the bidder was a family member living at the same address as the seller ! Ebay said that they would warn the seller to behave and they refunded me all the money that the schill bidding had cost me (GBP25). Ebay's one error was to provide me with the Schill bidders real name !!!! I wrote to the seller and made him aware that his scam was blown and he was daft to use his mothers ebay account against me. He admitted the scam, stating that the Trail-Cam was worth the money I paid so what was the problem ! He did say sorry though. There are some very 'unusual' people using ebay and their moral compass can be very unreliable !

VK3DRB · « **Reply #11 on:** January 31, 2014, 01:45:51 pm »

Reminds me I got scammed right here in Australia on eBay about 10 years ago. No buyer protection back then.

The username of the scammer was MOTORHOUSE.

He was buying big bulky items COD and getting them all shipped to a bogus post office box in Traralgon. The Post Office was filling up with his bogus purchases. He never paid and the device I sent him was eventually returned to me. I was only $70 out of pocket.

He did this to other people and I was able to contact them. I heard his Telstra email account closed not long after "he" apparently subscribed to about every newspaper, magazine, and porno website on the planet. This happened in the days before junk mail filters and opting out junk sent more junk mail. One of his victims had got revenge. MOTORHOUSE was a moron.

grumpydoc · « **Reply #12 on:** January 31, 2014, 02:45:09 pm »

The only way to sensibly bid on ebay auctions is either to use the ebay proxy bid system and place your maximum bid early on and then ignore the auction until it's finished. Or, even better, use one of the sniping programs. This is better because the act of bidding before the auction is complete only serves to push the price up.

This way you won't pay more than you think an item is worth and because there are fewer bids while the auction is running there is less chance for the shills to get in.

It does turn ebay into (even more) of a sealed bid system but it pretty much amounts to that anyway.

As a seller I list most things buy it now and only auction stuff if I'm really not sure what it will fetch or I'm having a clear-out and just want stuff sold by a specific date.

Fraser · « **Reply #13 on:** January 31, 2014, 03:18:30 pm »

I just remembered another scam that was attempted against me.

I bid on, and won, a brand new Fluke 87 III. The price was mid market so not a barfgain as such.It was boxed and all looked to be in order as the seller had significant and excellent feedback.

The parcel arrived a few days later, intact and all looked fine. Upon opening the 'as new' FLUKE box, I found the Fluke manuals in sealed condition and the cocodile clips in new condition. But no FLUKE or test lads. I contacted the seller and he immediately responded stating that he had personally checked the box contents and wrapped it so it must have been opened in transit and the meter stolen....... the stench of bullsh*t was overwhelming !

I had already done some investigation on the parcel. No evidence of tampering and it was sent by Second Class mail. I weighed the parcel, as received, and then added my other FLUKE 87 to it to find the weight that it should have been at time of posting. Checking Royal Mail 2nd Class prices on-line revealed two anomalies. 1. The postage cost written on the parcel was correct for a weight that DID NOT include the meter or leads. 2. The weight, with a FLUKE meter included, exceeded the maximum 2nd class service weight limit.

I presented these facts to the seller and received an immediate refund but no explanation. You have to be smart to successfully con people, or pick on those with less brains than yourself. This guy was a prize idiot for trying such a poorly prepared con. I reported his behavior to ebay and interestingly he was no longer registered when I checked some weeks later.

There was also the case of an oscilloscope stand that I won. The seller seemed legit, with good feedback. He also sold a Hameg oscilloscope and some other expensive test kit. To cut a long story short the stand never arrived and he claimed it had been lost by the courier. I contacted the winner of the Hameg oscilloscope and he was in the same position as me, no delivery and a claim of courier loss. The seller did refund after a delay to see if the parcel would turn up. I later saw the same items (all of them) being auctioned by a different seller ID. The location and the pictures were all the same though. I contacted the seller and he admitted that he was the same seller I had bought from. He claimed that the items had turned up unexpectedly so he was re-selling them. I walked away. I later saw in his feedback that he had done the same trick on those later auctions as well ! Buyers stating non delivery and delays in refunding etc.

He was either not happy with the prices raised, or was operating his own interest free short term loan service to himself, using ebay buyers money ! He had our money for around 4 weeks before having to refund....cheaper than WONGA.com !

R_G_B_ · « **Reply #14 on:** April 30, 2015, 03:17:47 pm »

is this a scam:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/321740955836?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

image in google search says so.

free_electron · « **Reply #15 on:** April 30, 2015, 03:55:38 pm »

firs ttime seller , requesting to send email before bidding 'otherwise bids will be cabceled'.

this stinks across the galaxy ...

nctnico · « **Reply #16 on:** April 30, 2015, 03:58:07 pm »

Quote from: grumpydoc on January 30, 2014, 02:18:59 pm

If something is too good to be true it probably isn't.

Time for a positive story: A couple of months ago I bought a quite expensive oscilloscope from someone in the Czech Republic with 0 Ebay feedback. I tried to take every precaution I could take so I paid through Paypal using a credit card (double buyer protection!). Fingers crossed and knock on wood every 5 minutes until it arrived. Fortunately the oscilloscope arrived well packed and was completely as it was advertised.

Quote from: R_G_B_ on April 30, 2015, 03:17:47 pm

is this a scam:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/321740955836?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
image in google search says so.

Yes, this is a typical Ebay scam.

at2marty · « **Reply #17 on:** April 30, 2015, 08:10:37 pm »

I have bought and sold quite a few things on Ebay over the years. The only time that I had any problems were from a buyer (I was the seller). My wife had upgraded her Iphone to a newer version, so after wiping all of her data off of the phone I put it for sale on Ebay. If I remember right, it sold for around $100 U.S. + shipping.

About a week after the sale/payment/shipping I got a message from the buyer (written in very poor English) that the phone was "not as described" and that it didn't work properly. He stated that he took it to a repair place that charged him $35 to diagnose it, and they told him that it needed a software upgrade that would cost $80. He stated that the diagnostics and "repair" should be my responsibility, and that he wanted me to refund him the purchase amount, otherwise he would leave negative feedback on the transaction.

Of course, I pointed out to him that the phone worked just fine as shown in the photos that I had posted, and it was being sold AS-IS with no refunds. I offered to refund his money minus the shipping charges if he sent it back to me. He refused and left me negative feedback.

I opened up a dispute with Ebay and presented my case, including photos that I had posted in my ad along with the fact that I had posted in my ad that it was being sold AS-IS with no refunds. I also told them of my offer to refund his money anyway if he sent it back to me, and that he refused.

A couple of weeks later I got a message from Ebay stating that they had received numerous complaints from this particular buyer, had suspended his account and removed the negative feedback from my account.

Howardlong · « **Reply #18 on:** April 30, 2015, 09:20:53 pm »

I wonder what the view is on Craigslist?

There are apparently some pretty reasonable oscilloscope deals going on around here (London, UK)

http://london.craigslist.co.uk/search/sss?sort=rel&query=oscilloscope

Like ebay, many scopes don't come with appropriate probes.

(I now understand why probes often aren't included: as an occasional seller, anecdotally I've found that appropriate probes don't seem to add much to the selling price).

woodchips · « **Reply #19 on:** April 30, 2015, 09:41:11 pm »

Have to agree with the raising a dispute no later than 2 weeks after the sale, takes ages and sellers dragging it out seems quite common, and lucrative.

Also I doubt you will get any joy from the credit card company. Your transaction is with ebay/paypal and NOT the seller. Was an interesting example of this on the radio but dealing with internet contracts, you deal with the middle man, not the service provider.

Bassman59 · « **Reply #20 on:** April 30, 2015, 10:08:52 pm »

Quote from: Howardlong on April 30, 2015, 09:20:53 pm

I wonder what the view is on Craigslist?

There are apparently some pretty reasonable oscilloscope deals going on around here (London, UK)

http://london.craigslist.co.uk/search/sss?sort=rel&query=oscilloscope

Craigslist has the advantage that the buyer and seller exchange cash for the item in person, and as such the buyer can easily inspect the item right in front of the seller so there is no confusion.

Of course many Craiglist buyers will throw low-ball offers at anything that's for sale, or worse, offer something unrelated in trade.

mikeselectricstuff · « **Reply #21 on:** April 30, 2015, 10:31:16 pm »

High value stuff, low feedback (in this case from a no-longer registerd user) = red light .
add Invitation to contact outside of ebay - definite scam

I have seen this item listed at least 3 times from zero/low feedback users
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/221758915742

Howardlong · « **Reply #22 on:** April 30, 2015, 10:32:40 pm »

Quote from: Bassman59 on April 30, 2015, 10:08:52 pm

Quote from: Howardlong on April 30, 2015, 09:20:53 pm
I wonder what the view is on Craigslist?

There are apparently some pretty reasonable oscilloscope deals going on around here (London, UK)

http://london.craigslist.co.uk/search/sss?sort=rel&query=oscilloscope

Craigslist has the advantage that the buyer and seller exchange cash for the item in person, and as such the buyer can easily inspect the item right in front of the seller so there is no confusion.

That's my understanding, but I have no Craigslist experience. What confuses me is why these items are so much less than similar items on ebay. As has been said, if a deal looks too good to be true, etc. but I'd be interested on views if these are genuine?

Bassman59 · « **Reply #23 on:** April 30, 2015, 10:44:07 pm »

Quote from: Howardlong on April 30, 2015, 10:32:40 pm

That's my understanding, but I have no Craigslist experience. What confuses me is why these items are so much less than similar items on ebay. As has been said, if a deal looks too good to be true, etc. but I'd be interested on views if these are genuine?

My wife and I have bought and sold a handful of things on Craigslist. Since the transactions are all in person, they all went smoothly. That seems to be the consensus among my friends, too. Craiglist makes it pretty clear that you should NOT deal with anyone unwilling to meet in person, and they point out various scams that have been tried.

Craigslist is the online equivalent of the newspaper's want ads, or those displays one used to see at the front of a supermarket (fill out a card with item description and phone number and post the card on the display). Basically, it's for folks who want to get rid of stuff.

eBay has gone from being a place where folks could get rid of stuff to being a for-profit operation for many sellers. It is a totally different. It's very easy to scam someone from another continent. Not so much when they're standing across from you.

TopLoser · « **Reply #24 on:** April 30, 2015, 10:51:06 pm »

What if I were to list some new boxed Tek MDO3104 4 channel 1GHz scopes with 3GHz spectrum analyser option plus lifetime trial options for all other options on eBay for silly low prices. Sometimes real 'too good to be true' things are available. You EEV lot all know where they came from so it can happen.

I do admit I'm a gambler though, I like a bit of 'risk/reward' adrenaline!!


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Author Topic: Tektronix eBay scams (Read 19757 times)

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