Tesla Cybertruck

[tom66]

I really hope it doesn't come to the UK/EU.

We have enough problems with people driving ridiculously oversized vehicles and killing pedestrians and cyclists in avoidable accidents.  Not to mention small roads, cramped car parks... seeing someone maneuver this around a normal multistory car park would be a sight.

The SUV was a cursed invention, I really wish it had never been a thing.  Massive trucks like these as personal vehicles is just taking that to the next, most ridiculous level.

[langwadt]

Door handles? Where? Only inside?
How do firefighters open it if you're injured or unconscious?

Break the window.
It may be a surprise for you but in modern cars doors get automatically locked when driving. So outer handle is absolutely useless unless it gets automatically unlocked after the accident, and it likely won't if crash was serious or car does not have post accident unlocking feature.

Most modern cars will detect when an accident is happening, and while for a human that's an incomprehensible short time, for the electronics, servos, and motors that's an eternity to still do things. Some modern cars will do things like activate the brakes, tilt seats away from the side, tension the seat-belts before there's even an impact, pull away the steering wheel column, etc. So I wouldn't be surprised if unlocking the doors and trunk is part of such a system.

I think it was Jaguar that showed a hood that lifted when it detected a collision, to comply with the pedestrian safety regulations requiring a minimum of 3 inches of space between the hood and hard points like engine and suspension

Locked doors might be a way to make sure the doors don't open during an accident compromising the passenger compartment, if so you wouldn't want them unlocking until after the accident

[langwadt]

I really hope it doesn't come to the UK/EU.

We have enough problems with people driving ridiculously oversized vehicles and killing pedestrians and cyclists in avoidable accidents.  Not to mention small roads, cramped car parks... seeing someone maneuver this around a normal multistory car park would be a sight.

The SUV was a cursed invention, I really wish it had never been a thing.  Massive trucks like these as personal vehicles is just taking that to the next, most ridiculous level.

hasn't "Pedestrian Detection and Collision Mitigation Systems" with automatic braking not become mandatory yet?, I know it's been proposed so it won't be long

[Benta]

Drive by wire, for instance, allowing to tailor the steering ratio depending to speed.

This has been tried before, and does not work. The reason should be obvious to anyone that's ever driven a vehicle. The closest to variable steering that actually works is the various 4WS systems the Japanese manufacturers used in the 1980s-1990s. Curiously they don't bother any more.

Strange statement and wrong.
My 2005 BMW 330i (E90) had active steering and it worked perfectly, I enjoyed it. The 5-series had it even earlier. It's a standard option not only offered by BMW (I think, didn't check other brands).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_steering

[Benta]

I really hope it doesn't come to the UK/EU.

We have enough problems with people driving ridiculously oversized vehicles and killing pedestrians and cyclists in avoidable accidents.  Not to mention small roads, cramped car parks... seeing someone maneuver this around a normal multistory car park would be a sight.

The SUV was a cursed invention, I really wish it had never been a thing.  Massive trucks like these as personal vehicles is just taking that to the next, most ridiculous level.

Well, you Brits brought the SUV over here with the Range Rover, the ultimate accessory for suburban housewives.

In the US, the parking slots/lots are big enough.

[andre_teprom]

I checked out that video, and you're right, it's pretty mind-blowing how innovative the Cybertruck's engineering is. Tesla definitely shook things up in the automotive world. It's like they rewrote the rules. Traditional automakers do seem to be lagging behind in the EV game.

[tom66]

Drive by wire, for instance, allowing to tailor the steering ratio depending to speed.

This has been tried before, and does not work. The reason should be obvious to anyone that's ever driven a vehicle. The closest to variable steering that actually works is the various 4WS systems the Japanese manufacturers used in the 1980s-1990s. Curiously they don't bother any more.

It's literally used by Nissan in some of their vehicles.  There's a redundant clutch which activates if power is lost or there is a fault with the system providing a mechanical override, but in normal use the steering is entirely electronic.  Combined with variable resistance on the wheel you could create quite a realistic feel whilst gaining the benefits of truly adaptive steering.  That said, I can't quite get over the idea of having no mechanical linkage, I don't trust the redundant system quite enough.  And ordinary electric power steering is perfectly sufficient IMO, I've never thought that this would improve things, just make them more expensive if anything went wrong!

hasn't "Pedestrian Detection and Collision Mitigation Systems" with automatic braking not become mandatory yet?, I know it's been proposed so it won't be long

Yes, these systems exist, I am pretty sure my car has this system:
https://youtu.be/watch?v=0P7M8PvG0Pc&t=2m37s

However such systems are not infallable, they cannot detect all pedestrians, cyclists etc.  Adding more mass will always mean any accident that does happen is more severe. The focus should be on reducing vehicle size and weight where possible.  Especially on reducing bonnet height, as that strongly defines the severity of an accident:  if you hit a pedestrian with a lower-down car like a Golf, they're much more likely to impact their head on the windscreen, which is less likely to be fatal than with an SUV where head impacts tend to be on bodywork.

Obviously, some people need larger vehicles, such as those with wheelchairs, elderly/infirm people, and those who use their vehicle as part of their profession.  But SUVs (and trucks) are primarily marketed towards people as a vanity purchase*, and the average occupancy of an SUV barely exceeds that of a smaller car. Cybertruck is even worse, though the statistic in the US for pickup trucks is something like only 30% of people use their pickup bed more than once per year, it's crazy.

*Like for instance, the ridiculous SUV ads like these: https://youtu.be/watch?v=0ITLWCfxmLc  ... yeah, the majority of the time, this vehicle is gonna be sitting in traffic, like the rest of us.

[NiHaoMike]

I think the steering by wire is interesting and I suspect part of the reason they are using it is because they have proven it to be safe. I remember issues about cars using electronics for the throttle and the fears that arose from it. So time will tell if its going to be an issue.

I'm curious to know what sort of redundancy features that has. I presume there's already a lot of redundancy for the self driving feature, so the only real addition would be redundant sensors for the driver input. There's already at least 2 battery systems (3 if the main one is a pair of 400V sections) so that's solved for power redundancy.

[wraper]

Drive by wire, for instance, allowing to tailor the steering ratio depending to speed.

This has been tried before, and does not work. The reason should be obvious to anyone that's ever driven a vehicle. The closest to variable steering that actually works is the various 4WS systems the Japanese manufacturers used in the 1980s-1990s. Curiously they don't bother any more.

Strange statement and wrong.
My 2005 BMW 330i (E90) had active steering and it worked perfectly, I enjoyed it. The 5-series had it even earlier. It's a standard option not only offered by BMW (I think, didn't check other brands).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_steering

Steer by wire is not the same as active steering at all.  Also Cybertuck turns both front and rear wheels. Rear wheels actually turn in different direction depending on speed.

[langwadt]

Drive by wire, for instance, allowing to tailor the steering ratio depending to speed.

This has been tried before, and does not work. The reason should be obvious to anyone that's ever driven a vehicle. The closest to variable steering that actually works is the various 4WS systems the Japanese manufacturers used in the 1980s-1990s. Curiously they don't bother any more.

Strange statement and wrong.
My 2005 BMW 330i (E90) had active steering and it worked perfectly, I enjoyed it. The 5-series had it even earlier. It's a standard option not only offered by BMW (I think, didn't check other brands).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_steering

Steer by wire is not the same as active steering at all.  Also Cybertuck turns both front and rear wheels. Rear wheels actually turn in different direction depending on speed.

Honda Prelude had four wheel steering 35 years ago

[wraper]

Steer by wire is not the same as active steering at all.  Also Cybertuck turns both front and rear wheels. Rear wheels actually turn in different direction depending on speed.

Honda Prelude had four wheel steering 35 years ago

Did it do the same as what I wrote? At low speed Cybertruck rear wheels turn up to 10^o in opposite direction from front wheels. At high speed they turn up to 2^o in the same direction as front wheels.

[Benta]

Drive by wire, for instance, allowing to tailor the steering ratio depending to speed.

This has been tried before, and does not work. The reason should be obvious to anyone that's ever driven a vehicle. The closest to variable steering that actually works is the various 4WS systems the Japanese manufacturers used in the 1980s-1990s. Curiously they don't bother any more.

Strange statement and wrong.
My 2005 BMW 330i (E90) had active steering and it worked perfectly, I enjoyed it. The 5-series had it even earlier. It's a standard option not only offered by BMW (I think, didn't check other brands).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_steering

Steer by wire is not the same as active steering at all.  Also Cybertuck turns both front and rear wheels. Rear wheels actually turn in different direction depending on speed.

I never said it was. Please read what I responded to. Which was:
"The closest to variable steering that actually works is the various 4WS systems..." which is nonsense.
Drive-by-wire is something else (and something I'd never want, but that's a different subject).

[bdunham7]

Did it do the same as what I wrote? At low speed Cybertruck rear wheels turn up to 10^o in opposite direction from front wheels. At high speed they turn up to 2^o in the same direction as front wheels.

Yes, the Prelude 4WS went both ways.  It was also completely mechanical and didn't have 10 degrees of authority (I think it was 5 or 6), but yes it shortened the turning radius in parking lots as well as improved lane change maneuvers.  My Mitsubishi 3000GT VR4 also had 4WS, but it only worked same-direction and at higher speeds.

[wraper]

I found a video where it does some weird oscillation on rear wheels when changing steering direction.

[HalFET]

I really hope it doesn't come to the UK/EU.

We have enough problems with people driving ridiculously oversized vehicles and killing pedestrians and cyclists in avoidable accidents.  Not to mention small roads, cramped car parks... seeing someone maneuver this around a normal multistory car park would be a sight.

The SUV was a cursed invention, I really wish it had never been a thing.  Massive trucks like these as personal vehicles is just taking that to the next, most ridiculous level.

hasn't "Pedestrian Detection and Collision Mitigation Systems" with automatic braking not become mandatory yet?, I know it's been proposed so it won't be long

In most of Europe, yes, I believe that was part of the same package that made a reverse camera mandatory.

[Dan123456]

Steer by wire is not the same as active steering at all.  Also Cybertuck turns both front and rear wheels. Rear wheels actually turn in different direction depending on speed.

Honda Prelude had four wheel steering 35 years ago

Did it do the same as what I wrote? At low speed Cybertruck rear wheels turn up to 10^o in opposite direction from front wheels. At high speed they turn up to 2^o in the same direction as front wheels.

The R32 Nissan skyline has rear wheel steering apparently up to 10 degrees. And it was released in 1989.

“Nissan were great advocates of four-wheel steering and started with hydraulic HICAS systems which could turn the rear wheels up to 10 degrees in either direction.”

https://www.carthrottle.com/news/ins-and-outs-four-wheel-steering

[julianhigginson]

Windows are high strength but not bulletproof. You can certainly break them with right tools (some sharp pointy thing made of very hard material).

soooo... if a cybertruck is crashed and locked and you need to get someone unconscious out of it, you can hit it with another cybertruck!

[Benta]

It won't come to the EU (or UK, Switzerland etc.).
It's simply too heavy (3.5 tons), which requires that the driver needs a license for driving trucks.
When driving a truck, you're not allowed private use or transport of passengers, so your friend or wife needs to be an employee.
Also the speed limit for trucks is 80 km/h (50 mph).

I can't think of a more unattractive packet for a potential buyer, ignoring the price.

[magic]

You have never seen a truck in your life, have you?
3.5t is the maximum gross weight for normal license.

[wraper]

It won't come to the EU (or UK, Switzerland etc.).
It's simply too heavy (3.5 tons), which requires that the driver needs a license for driving trucks.
When driving a truck, you're not allowed private use or transport of passengers, so your friend or wife needs to be an employee.
Also the speed limit for trucks is 80 km/h (50 mph).

I can't think of a more unattractive packet for a potential buyer, ignoring the price.

B category drivers license allows maximum authorised mass up to 3.5 metric tons. Cybertruck in Cyberbeast version weights 3.1 ton and regular AWD weights 3 tons. In theory they could pass it as 3.5 ton maximum mass if artificially limit its payload spec. Also EU is in process of bumping the limit to 4250kg for alternatively-fuelled vehicles which would bring it below the limit as is.

[SiliconWizard]

Beyond the weight, it's hard to really see a market for this in Europe. Time will tell.
But the weight itself raises questions (especially considering that the EU is going to raise the bar, as wraper mentioned) in terms of efficiency.

[Circlotron]

Here's a video of a full-frontal crash demonstrating 'too much' crumple zone.

I actually had one of those. If you read the development story on them they were an immensely strong and durable car. Built to tolerate some of the worst Australian outback roads. Some time ago I did a bit of searching regarding that video. That particular car had several hundred kilograms of sandbags in the boot as well as a number of cuts to the bodywork in strategic places to ensure it folded up in a dramatic way, which it did. Rest assured, proper version of that car were nothing like in that video.

[wraper]

I actually had one of those. If you read the development story on them they were an immensely strong and durable car. Built to tolerate some of the worst Australian outback roads. Some time ago I did a bit of searching regarding that video. That particular car had several hundred kilograms of sandbags in the boot as well as a number of cuts to the bodywork in strategic places to ensure it folded up in a dramatic way, which it did. Rest assured, proper version of that car were nothing like in that video.

The only thing I could find is mention of 300kg of sandbags, nothing about altered body whatsoever.

[Benta]

You have never seen a truck in your life, have you?
3.5t is the maximum gross weight for normal license.

Are you unable to read? Otherwise your comments makes zero sense.

[Benta]

Also EU is in process of bumping the limit to 4250kg for alternatively-fuelled vehicles which would bring it below the limit as is.

Interesting, I hadn't heard of that one.
Can you provide a link?