Author Topic: The anti smartphone revolution  (Read 4666 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline ZuccaTopic starter

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 4611
  • Country: it
  • EE meid in Itali
The anti smartphone revolution
« on: July 26, 2022, 02:36:58 am »
https://odysee.com/@Coldfusion:f/the-anti-smartphone-revolution

Interesting topic that could change the way we consider the interaction between electronics-people.
Can't know what you don't love. St. Augustine
Can't love what you don't know. Zucca
 

Offline Brumby

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 12413
  • Country: au
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #1 on: July 26, 2022, 03:36:28 am »
I started watching that and all I could do was shake and nod my head.  Shake - because of the absurdity of the situation so many have put themselves in ... and nodding because of the realisation that it is both unnecessary and a negative element in living.

I might also point out that the key focus of this is not access to the internet per se, but social media.

Please don't get me wrong, I'm not against social media in principle - it's just that it has taken on a far more invasive and powerful role than is healthy.  In fact, for far too many people, it has become as addictive as any drug could ever be.

Cutting ties to the internet is a step that is a bit further than necessary, IMHO.  Just distance oneself from easy access to social media.  However, I do concede that those who are so enveloped would need to make the "dumb phone" switch ... the temptation would be too great otherwise.

Yes, we live in the "Information Age" - but there IS such a thing as Too Much Information.


To those who may need some encouragement, I offer this thought....  Look into yourself and find out who you are - don't look to others to tell you what they think.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2022, 03:39:22 am by Brumby »
 
The following users thanked this post: Zucca

Offline pcprogrammer

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4670
  • Country: nl
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2022, 05:36:29 am »
I started watching that and all I could do was shake and nod my head.  Shake - because of the absurdity of the situation so many have put themselves in ... and nodding because of the realisation that it is both unnecessary and a negative element in living.

Sort of the same here. The "smart" phone does have it's benefits, but people should learn to use them with moderation. I can see the addiction in it though.

I might also point out that the key focus of this is not access to the internet per se, but social media.

Please don't get me wrong, I'm not against social media in principle - it's just that it has taken on a far more invasive and powerful role than is healthy.  In fact, for far too many people, it has become as addictive as any drug could ever be.

A bit of a problem is that the internet and social media are so intertwined these days, it is hard to separate them. For instance this forum is also a form of social media. Just a bunch of "nerds" grouping together and writing on the internet. (Not a negative intent here, just a remark) And it is indeed addictive. For me at the moment a way to pass time between projects.

Cutting ties to the internet is a step that is a bit further than necessary, IMHO.  Just distance oneself from easy access to social media.  However, I do concede that those who are so enveloped would need to make the "dumb phone" switch ... the temptation would be too great otherwise.

In this modern day world it becomes more and more impossible to cut the ties completely. Just take banking, it is almost all done via the internet. In France the "cheque" is now being phased out, and your smart phone as payment device is creeping in. How long will it be before the debit/credit card is replaced by it completely. Industry, media and society are forcing us into these things. Peer pressure.

So maybe a movement against this is not a bad thing.

Yes, we live in the "Information Age" - but there IS such a thing as Too Much Information.

That is so true. Think about it, people post on facebook or whatever media where they will be at some point in time, and criminals abuse this to break in and rob their houses. :palm:

To those who may need some encouragement, I offer this thought....  Look into yourself and find out who you are - don't look to others to tell you what they think.

Good advise, but very difficult for lots of people.

Offline ZuccaTopic starter

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 4611
  • Country: it
  • EE meid in Itali
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2022, 01:55:24 pm »
Suprising that the new generations are somehow moving away from the 24/7 connected mentality.

Regarding me, oh Lord yes I am a sinner.
Can't know what you don't love. St. Augustine
Can't love what you don't know. Zucca
 

Online voltsandjolts

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 2549
  • Country: gb
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2022, 03:27:46 pm »
Hammer is a useful tool for whacking in nails. But it can also be used to whack your thumb.

Similarly with the smartphone, how you use it is up to you. Use it as a dumb phone if you prefer (strong-willed enough?!).
You don't have to use it for social media and other potentially damaging crap.

Is this forum classed as 'social media'?...cause it's as close as I get.
 
The following users thanked this post: tooki, eugene

Offline eugene

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 497
  • Country: us
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2022, 03:35:05 pm »
Is there irony in the fact that one needs to watch a video (as opposed to reading text) to find out why the author dislikes smartphones?

TBH: I didn't even start the video. Videos are typically too time consuming for me to tolerate.
90% of quoted statistics are fictional
 
The following users thanked this post: Someone, Stray Electron

Offline pcprogrammer

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 4670
  • Country: nl
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2022, 03:58:11 pm »
TBH: I didn't even start the video. Videos are typically too time consuming for me to tolerate.

And apparently, so is typing "THB" instead of "to be honest". But I guess that is also a sign of the times and social media, born by the use of "DUMB" phones with texting.

Sorry that is one of my pet peeves. The very abundant use of abbreviations. Makes reading for a "layman" more difficult.

Offline josuah

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 119
  • Country: fr
    • josuah.net
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #7 on: July 26, 2022, 04:02:08 pm »
What a great opportunity to share the devices that do not turn us into a "notification_queue_event_callback() ".

Inexpensive feature phones:
The advantage is that it permits to test for $0, no fear of yet another purchase to throw in a drawer.

1. Look in your drawers. Buying new devices is fun, but if you were expecting something shiny new, you might have such a phone already home.
2. Used phones. They will be extremely inexpensive and will let you do some sms / voice calls / 4g internet tethering (for using a laptop on the go) / email / occasional photo to send as an SMS attachment,
3. inexpensive phones at the local IT shop, or even supermarket. It could be a deception if the embedded OS is terrible though.

Non-Android/iOS smartphones:

1. Your current phone might work with PostmarketOS or Maemo Leste
2. The Pinephone64 is very inexpensive for a smartphone, and can get about any Linux distribution.

Pocket computer
That permits to have a phone to do what only a phone can do (access GSM and 4G network, phone/sms calls) instead of as much as it could be doing, and a separate pocket computer covering the rest of the features.

1. https://mntre.com/media/reform_md/2022-06-20-introducing-mnt-pocket-reform.html
2. I do not know these device much... help!

Pitfalls:

1. KaiOS is popular for dumbphones, but terrible: it uses HTML + Javascript under the hood with terrible performance, and had an alarming security issue allowing any webpage run shell script, eventually a rootkit
2. Other operating system made for feature phones might be better, or just as bad! Hard to predict before using it for some time.

 
The following users thanked this post: Zucca

Offline ZuccaTopic starter

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 4611
  • Country: it
  • EE meid in Itali
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2022, 04:11:31 pm »
Is there irony in the fact that one needs to watch a video (as opposed to reading text) to find out why the author dislikes smartphones?

it's not youtube.  ::)
Can't know what you don't love. St. Augustine
Can't love what you don't know. Zucca
 

Offline josuah

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 119
  • Country: fr
    • josuah.net
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #9 on: July 26, 2022, 04:23:57 pm »
Looking at a phone from an engineering point of view, what roles could we give to it?

* a complete radio, with antenna, modulator/demodulator, amplifier and whatnot,
* it is battery-powered, which suggests everything here is low-power
* user I/O: speaker, microphone, screen, input device, at least if it is to be operated as a standalone device and not a peripheral
* SIM card I/O
* user I/O (screen, speaker, microphone, buttons) if it is to be operated stand-alone
* firmware gluing all of that together

For test and measurement, some want features like ability to drive the device from a computer. Why did phones even skipped that? Maybe avoiding to make SMS spam too easy? I still want it. :D

In addition to the useful mobile internet tethering (USB, WiFi), and ability to use an external keyboard:
What about a RPC interface for sending SMS or starting calls from a computer keyboard?
Such a device could be added on the lab bench along with the other, to give the lab operator (you, me) ability to place and pick-up phone calls and exchange SMSes.
 

Offline josuah

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 119
  • Country: fr
    • josuah.net
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #10 on: July 26, 2022, 04:31:18 pm »
I think I will stop dreaming by the second I want to communicate to any Whatsapp group used by relatives.

Any kind of system you want to build will need to reach these walled gardens, and these walled garden have rules: Android, iOS, period.
 

Offline PlainName

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 7508
  • Country: va
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #11 on: July 26, 2022, 06:31:06 pm »
Is there irony in the fact that one needs to watch a video (as opposed to reading text) to find out why the author dislikes smartphones?

it's not youtube.  ::)

At least on YouTube there would be subtitles, but here this is nothing. Even if I wanted to spend the time watching I would learn nothing from it.
 

Offline eugene

  • Frequent Contributor
  • **
  • Posts: 497
  • Country: us
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #12 on: July 26, 2022, 07:22:56 pm »
OK, so I took the time to watch the video. I think they honestly portrayed the problem as not originating in the devices themselves, but in the fact that many people become addicted to them. The problem is that some people need help controlling their addiction. Some people need even more help than others.

Personally, I use social media only a tiny bit (1) so I don't feel the effects of addiction, though I do feel empathy for those that do. I think it's obvious that the smart phone isn't nefarious in itself; it's just a natural step in the miniaturization of computers, etc. The problem is not technical, but social, though it may have a technical solution. As a start it might help to simply admit, as a society, that there's a risk and people that feel at risk should look for a solution rather than let it get out of control. If dumb phones help some, then I'm all for it. Doesn't mean I feel the need for one myself.

(1)Posting here, especially in a topic like this counts as using social media. So anyone here that claims to be free from social media is kidding themself.
90% of quoted statistics are fictional
 

Offline PlainName

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 7508
  • Country: va
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #13 on: July 26, 2022, 07:44:02 pm »
Quote
Posting here, especially in a topic like this counts as using social media. So anyone here that claims to be free from
social media is kidding themself.

Pedantically you're right, but practically I think there is a big difference between the likes of this forum and Facebook, which is what is normally meant by 'social media'. There is no timeline here, for a start.
 

Offline SiliconWizard

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 15797
  • Country: fr
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #14 on: July 26, 2022, 07:55:04 pm »
Suprising that the new generations are somehow moving away from the 24/7 connected mentality.

Uh. Are they? I don't think so.
 

Offline Bassman59

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 2501
  • Country: us
  • Yes, I do this for a living
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #15 on: July 26, 2022, 08:02:46 pm »
Quote
Posting here, especially in a topic like this counts as using social media. So anyone here that claims to be free from
social media is kidding themself.

Pedantically you're right, but practically I think there is a big difference between the likes of this forum and Facebook, which is what is normally meant by 'social media'. There is no timeline here, for a start.

Usenet newsgroups were a form of social media.

So, too, were dial-up BBSes.

Hell, even Ham Radio is a social network.
 
The following users thanked this post: newbrain

Offline bd139

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 23099
  • Country: gb
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #16 on: July 26, 2022, 08:10:48 pm »
The problem is not smartphones. It’s addicts. Cutting it out is an extremist position and that’s almost never the solution. People just want attention for being different.

Consider I’m sitting here on a bus which I paid for with my phone, after going out for a meal which was organised on a social network on a phone. I took photos with a phone. I am listening to music with a phone while I’m writing this with a phone.

People are welcome to deprive themselves from the benefits but I’m going to jump in that gap and enjoy the actual real life interactions and leverage that the thing gives me.
 
The following users thanked this post: Ed.Kloonk

Online themadhippy

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3265
  • Country: gb
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #17 on: July 26, 2022, 08:18:07 pm »
Quote
People just want attention for being different.
Or people are anti social and dont want to be at everybody's beck an call 24/7,its also worth getting rid off for the confusion it causes company's and officialdom
 
The following users thanked this post: Ed.Kloonk, bd139

Online voltsandjolts

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 2549
  • Country: gb
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #18 on: July 26, 2022, 08:25:57 pm »
The problem is not smartphones. It’s addicts.

It's kids I worry about though. At such a young age I don't think they have the ability to regulate their own use.
Flame me, but I think kids should not legally be allowed smart phones until they are 14 years (simple mobile with text, OK).
It is absolutely not where they should be learning social skills. It would make classrooms a little more controllable.
The kids are literally cannon fodder for evil advertisers and online bullies, some from their own school.

At the moment, its a free-for-all, a huge social/mental health experiment and we'll find out the results for society in 20 years.

 
The following users thanked this post: bd139

Online themadhippy

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 3265
  • Country: gb
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #19 on: July 26, 2022, 08:32:33 pm »
Quote
but I think kids should not legally be allowed smart phones until they are 14 years (simple mobile with text, OK).
make it 13 so its inline with coppa,not that that seems to apply anymore
 

Offline bd139

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 23099
  • Country: gb
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #20 on: July 26, 2022, 08:41:06 pm »
People should parent their kids. Problem solved  :-D

I have three of the buggers. They read books, draw things and do physical activity still. They all have phones and tablets because it gives them the social advantage they need.

Edit: also honestly they should teach them to use them at school as well. One of my kids schools bans them and it’s a shit show universally. The one that allows them the students do better because they integrate them into the curriculum.

They are tools. Teach a kid to make things with a screwdriver not destroy them.  Same principle.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2022, 08:45:10 pm by bd139 »
 
The following users thanked this post: james_s

Offline abquke

  • Regular Contributor
  • *
  • Posts: 128
  • Country: us
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #21 on: July 26, 2022, 09:35:11 pm »
People should parent their kids. Problem solved  :-D

This.

I tried going back to a not-smart-phone a few times (still have a Nokia 3310 3G redux around here somewhere) but an android phone with no data has done okay for me for all intents and purposes.
 
The following users thanked this post: bd139

Offline SiliconWizard

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 15797
  • Country: fr
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #22 on: July 26, 2022, 10:11:16 pm »
People should parent their kids. Problem solved  :-D

Assuming they're any wiser than their kids. ::)
Not quite certain these days apart from a few exceptions.

(...)
They are tools. Teach a kid to make things with a screwdriver not destroy them.  Same principle.

Should be. But there's a slight difference: a screwdriver never had a chance to turn human societies upside down.

The problem is not quite with the tools anymore, it's the fact human societies are changing paradigms, and they are increasingly becoming "dematerialized", with no sign of the trend reversing.

 
The following users thanked this post: bd139

Offline james_s

  • Super Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 21611
  • Country: us
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #23 on: July 26, 2022, 11:06:26 pm »
I've had a smartphone for nearly a decade now and I've never had a social media app on mine ever. It's an incredibly useful device, it's my camera, GPS navigator, communication device, pocket watch, exercise tracker, tide chart, weather station, grocery list, alarm clock, stopwatch, timer, music player, newspaper, bank terminal, home automation remote, to-do list, reminder, etc. It takes the place of a whole pile of separate gadgets and manual tools on a day to day basis and I always have it with me. If somebody can't figure out how to use it responsibly that says more about them than about the tool.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2022, 11:07:58 pm by james_s »
 
The following users thanked this post: PlainName, Brumby, newbrain, bd139

Online voltsandjolts

  • Supporter
  • ****
  • Posts: 2549
  • Country: gb
Re: The anti smartphone revolution
« Reply #24 on: July 27, 2022, 08:26:31 am »
People should parent their kids. Problem solved  :-D

I agree that may be true, say, 95% of the time but it's an oversimplification of a problem which in some cases has profound and life changing negative consequences. Even with good parenting some kids struggle, in my experience the more insular kids in particular - and I don't mean insular in a negative way, some kids just bottle things up and it's difficult to 'unbottle' it. A kid's smart phone can quickly turn from a useful connection with friends to a source of persecution, and even good parents might struggle to prevent or fix it. The same thing can happen with a computer of course but its much easier to keep an eye on things there.

The suicide rate for 10-14 yo for England & Wales are given here (in Table 5). Thankfully it's low but recent years show an up tick, with double digit deaths occuring for the first time in the years 2017 through 2020 (dataset starts in 1981). Did parenting get worse in those years, or is there another factor? In any case, I sincerely hope the trend recedes.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2022, 08:30:58 am by voltsandjolts »
 


Share me

Digg  Facebook  SlashDot  Delicious  Technorati  Twitter  Google  Yahoo
Smf