The end (almost) of an era!!

[unknownparticle]

Had a telephone line fault to my house a few days ago, no dial tone, so had to call in Openreach, the UK telephone and broadband infrastructure provider, via my BB provider.
So, yes I do still have a phone landline!  So, the BB provider took the opportunity to pitch for a new contract deal, as they do!  The choice was a new fibre connection, or continue with the snail speed copper.  I was undecided so she sweetened the offer by reducing the fibre below copper, but then mentioned in passing that copper is being phased out and will be obsolete and unavailable in 6 years!!!  This is by virtue of Open Reach network policy.  Now I had no idea that fibre was even available in my area, as it's rural and always at the end of the Q for everything, I can't even find the fibre cabinet and it is fibre to the property so it must be there somewhere!  I was on the Open Reach network update list and have not been er' updated!!
Now you are wondering, what is this fool blathering about!! Good question.  I collect and use old telephones and this means I will no longer be able to use them, as telephone landlines are not included with fibre BB!!
So do I stick it out on copper for the next 6 years and enjoy my old phones for as long as possible, or take the pain and disappointment now and go fibre?!  I know it's not the end of the world but I feel so sad about this, the world is changing too fast for me!!

[MK14]

My understanding is you can get BOTH at the some time, sort of.  Keep the copper (if you still want it), but use the fibre to the cabinet, to get considerably higher broadband speeds, by using a fast provider and suitable box (they should supply for free).
This limits you to around 70Mb/s(download speed)/18Mb/s (upload speed), but that should be fine for many people.

The actual speed depends on the quality of your line and how far away it is from the exchange/boxes/etc.  So may be different/less, it also depends on which provider you choose.
Many seem to refuse to offer, new landline services now, at least according to their adverts.

I.e. The landlines, are becoming increasingly obsolete in the UK.  But there are issues, as you may need to have holes drilled in your home, an engineer needs to enter your home, have stuff rerouted, depending on your internal configurations, power a box of tricks, and have to sort out some other arrangement (£'s equipment plus possible extra monthly £'s fees, for the call services), to get phone lines (equivalents), working again.

Also no local electricity (power cut) = no phones/internet, except mobile phones, when you get the phone lines removed.

On the other hand.  The all fibre (fibre to the home), solution.  Is suppose to be considerably quicker (especially if you pay extra, for the high speed monthly plans), and more reliable (much fewer internet line disconnections/drops).

[unknownparticle]

Thanks, I'll investigate that.
Although fibre is obviously significantly faster, for me that's not so much of an advantage, as my existing copper connection is adequate for my use as I live alone.
The only thing I would be able to do with fibre that I can't do now is stream 4k video.
I suppose Open Reach want to rid themselves of the upkeep on copper lines but I do wonder about elderly people who will probably struggle with this, and I know people who don't have internet and don't want it!!
 

[pcprogrammer]

Here in France I was very pleased when they finally brought fiber to the home. Where I live it is also very rural and I could not even get ADSL because of the distance to the switch was over 8Km, so had to do with satellite internet for a lot of years. The first system was not that great and had a lot of dropouts when it rained, but the second was much better giving reasonable speeds, but long ping times. Not to good for voip, but we got by. Another problem was the monthly data limit.

Now with fiber I have unlimited 1Gbps internet and unlimited mobile phone calls within Europe for less then 50 euro. No "land line" in this case, but am thinking about switching to another provider to get a better deal including a "land line". The latter is just an analog phone port on the modem, with which it should be possible to use old phones.

Very happy with the very fast internet. Can watch Dutch TV over it, download games or other big files like Linux iso's.

Another option for you would be to use voip and a so called gateway to analog. Something like this https://nl.aliexpress.com/item/1005002011261031.html

So just get the fiber internet and look for a voip subscription else where.

[Ground_Loop]

Why is it that no one ever --that I am aware of-- made a black box to connect cell service to building wiring enabling the continued use of land line phones with cell service.

[pcprogrammer]

Of course such things exist. This one is GSM to VOIP https://nl.aliexpress.com/item/1005001494994417.html and I have seen boxes for analog phones too. But you still need to power it yourself, just like your mobile phone. Not like how a land line works, with power from the line itself, to make it work when there is no power in your house.

[jmelson]

Why is it that no one ever --that I am aware of-- made a black box to connect cell service to building wiring enabling the continued use of land line phones with cell service.

My mother in law has a Verizon thing that supports DECT phones, but can also support wired extensions.  We didn't set up the wired connection, as she didn't need it.  The Verizon base station is basically a cell phone with a built-in DECT charger.
Jon

[CatalinaWOW]

I would definitely go for the fiber.  You will find uses for it that you didn't know you had.  And as others have said, it is not difficult to get an interface box that will let you operate your old phones.  You could even set up a small exchange so you can dial different rooms in your house.  Living alone there isn't much use for this feature, but it is an interesting way to use and display your items.

[themadhippy]

The latter is just an analog phone port on the modem, with which it should be possible to use old phones.

Exactly what ive got here,fibre to cabinet,then original phone wire from cabinet to house.Phone only works via the modem,so if the modems off ,no phone.

[IanB]

Why is it that no one ever --that I am aware of-- made a black box to connect cell service to building wiring enabling the continued use of land line phones with cell service.

For the past 20 years I have had cordless phones around the house and my current Panasonic unit connects with Bluetooth to my cell phone, so effectively I have the solution you describe. I can pick up the phone in any room and answer a mobile call or make a mobile call just like a landline. In fact, the Panasonic unit has a "cell phone only" mode for up to two cell phones, so you don't need to plug in a phone line at all.

[IanB]

So do I stick it out on copper for the next 6 years and enjoy my old phones for as long as possible, or take the pain and disappointment now and go fibre?!  I know it's not the end of the world but I feel so sad about this, the world is changing too fast for me!!

The phone company is phasing out copper here too, and doing it by making POTS service expensive and uncompetitive with other options to encourage people to switch.

On the other hand, if you have digital service inside the home the box will have a port to plug a phone into. This will support all modern phones. If you wish to support old phones, I suspect there is some kind of "old phone interface box" available somewhere that can provide the voltages and interface circuitry that old phones need to operate.

[jonpaul]

Bonsoir:

In USA Comcast cable is up to 50..100 M, the newer Motorola cable modems have a VOIP POTS jack.

The cost is $10/line /month vs 40..60 for Frontie POTS copper.

In France we have 100 M fiber, with VOIP POTS line and included French Mobile all for EU30/mo

Jon

[pcprogrammer]

The latter is just an analog phone port on the modem, with which it should be possible to use old phones.

Exactly what ive got here,fibre to cabinet,then original phone wire from cabinet to house.Phone only works via the modem,so if the modems off ,no phone.

The change to fiber is then just a small step, it will just replace the copper. Gives higher speeds and no risk when there is thunder and lightning, at least not via the phone line

[SiliconWizard]

Copper lines are getting deprecated in Europe with varying deadlines. Over here, it's gonna start in 2023. So they won't be selling any new contract for copper lines, but the existing ones will keep working for a couple years depending on the location. The end date (when they'll switch the copper networks off for good) is somwhere between 2025 and 2027 I think.

Of course the issue is that while copper lines were literally everywhere - even the smallest villages - fiber certainly will not.

[pcprogrammer]

Of course the issue is that while copper lines were literally everywhere - even the smallest villages - fiber certainly will not.

Unless you live in the Corrèze

Here just outside the village they even placed a connection box near a small derelict house that will never need it because there is no electricity nearby.

[PaulAm]

In my area (midwest US) the phone company has been deprecating copper for the last 20 years.  Basically, they're letting it rot and fewer techs know how to maintain it.  When I was last using it, line quality was abysmal.

I now live in a rural area and have to depend on an LTE modem for internet, which is not terrible, but not great either.  There are plans underway to run fiber to every residence in my county.  Money has been allocated so that is really going to happen within the next couple years.

There's a story about a local guy (who actually worked as a network engineer) who wanted fiber from the local cable company.  They were going to charge him $30K for the connection, which ticked him off so much he started his own ISP (bought the directional drilling equipment, compressors, etc by scrounging at auctions).  He was so successful he picked up the contract to provide fiber for a significant portion of the county.  That story made the national news

[JohanH]

I've never had a land line. I used an ethernet to VOIP adapter for a couple of years with a regular phone. You can get a number from a VOIP provider on the Internet, set the number in the box (web interface) and plug in any old phone. But check with the VOIP provider if emergency number works!

Now I'm on fiber and there is no more copper here.

[Bicurico]

I have fiber to home with internet (1GBit/200MBit), TV and phone. A SIM is included, too.

This comes with a router that outputs, besides 4 GBit RJ45 output ports, DVB-T encoded digital channels and analog CATV channels for my coaxial TV distribution and it has two connectors for regular phones (but only one is active, as I only have one phone line subscribed).

This means that if your ISP provides you with fiber, you will most certainly get a router that allows to connect your existing TV and Phone installation. This way you continue using your existing phones.

I am, however, unsure if this supports pulse dialing.

[JohanH]

Most VOIP adapters are made for tone dialing. But there are pulse to tone adapters that are supposed to work with VOIP.

[IanB]

Most VOIP adapters are made for tone dialing. But there are pulse to tone adapters that are supposed to work with VOIP.

Not only pulse dialing, but I imagine the big mechanical bell ringers on old phones might need more power to operate them than a modem/router is prepared to provide?

[JohanH]

I had a separate VOIP adapter that was independent from any router and modem. With such an adapter, you provide separate power to your phone. You also have to open the correct VOIP/SIP ports in your Internet router. Such an adapter isn't locked to your ISP, so you could subscribe to any VOIP/SIP provider on the Internet. I don't remember any more the model I used, but it looked similar to this:

https://www.amazon.com/Gateway-Portable-Adapter-Internet-Protocol/dp/B07W7V5Q6Q

[unknownparticle]

Most VOIP adapters are made for tone dialing. But there are pulse to tone adapters that are supposed to work with VOIP.

Not only pulse dialing, but I imagine the big mechanical bell ringers on old phones might need more power to operate them than a modem/router is prepared to provide?

Yes, the on hook voltage is 48 VDC and the ring voltage is 90-130 VAC at 20HZ superimposed on the 48 VDC. 

[andy3055]

I got a Magic Jack which is a VOIP unit. Ported over my old land-line number to it. MJ unit can be taken anywhere when I travel and if an ethernet connection is available,  I am set. This is including overseas! If I don't want to be bothered taking the unit and a regular phone along, I can set up forwarding to my cell phone as well. The cost is just $35 for the unit and yearly cost is only some $35 bucks with no long distance charges at all. Even International rates are minimal.

[rstofer]

Bonsoir:

In USA Comcast cable is up to 50..100 M, the newer Motorola cable modems have a VOIP POTS jack.

The cost is $10/line /month vs 40..60 for Frontie POTS copper.

In France we have 100 M fiber, with VOIP POTS line and included French Mobile all for EU30/mo

Jon

I have Comcast and it comes into the house on coax but fiber must extend to the neighborhood.  In any event, I get 1Gb speed from Ethernet and VoiceOverIP as a telephone jack on the cable modem.  The interface provides everything necessary for any plain old telephone including the 90V ringing.  I use a rotary dial phone just because I can...

Actually, I unplugged the telephone because the sales calls were coming in before I even knew the phone number.  In any event, I plan to stay with AT&T telephone service (which is carried on wire) because it has the superior 911 (emergency) service and that's important when you're really old.

[ferdieCX]

Here we have fiber to the house. The state owned telecom company installed also a router that has jacks to connect 2 POTS phones.
I am using a phone that I bought in the 90's. It dials with tone