General > General Technical Chat
The EU is enforcing USB-C on portable devices
<< < (81/111) > >>
SilverSolder:

--- Quote from: tooki on September 10, 2022, 12:39:34 pm ---
--- Quote from: SilverSolder on September 09, 2022, 11:42:50 pm ---
--- Quote from: tooki on September 08, 2022, 05:52:20 pm ---[...]
I'm not saying that locking it down is always the right answer. But I can absolutely understand why companies do it.

--- End quote ---

Why doesn't the same thinking apply to laptops, or car batteries, or lantern/torch batteries, etc. etc. etc.?   Historically, we are used to be able to replace batteries with any brand we like, in most products.   It seems a stretch to argue that there is any benefit to the consumer for overpaying for wear parts such as batteries, ports, etc.

--- End quote ---
I’d say ubiquity of phones, and risk: we use the highest-density, most unstable lithium batteries in phones due to size and weight. It’s easy to make a lithium cell that’s more robust and can tolerate more abuse, but that makes them hold less energy and makes them physically larger due to armoring. (Like in cylindrical cells or battery packs with hard shells.)

The original manufacturer can carefully design a product around a temperamental lipo battery. Third parties may get it right, but many won’t.

With that said, I don’t think the other products you mention are actually good counterexamples.

Until modern purely-electric cars, car batteries have been simple lead acid affairs, where nothing bad is likely to happen if the battery goes bad. (And in modern all-electric cars, the lithium battery packs are locked down.)
Lantern batteries are historically, again, not lithium rechargeables, but alkaline or carbon zinc cells, again not hazardous. Rechargeable flashlights often don’t have removable batteries.

Laptop batteries generally have been locked down. Third parties either carefully rebuilt original ones, or reverse-engineered the authentication.

--- End quote ---


Are there any examples at all of commercial policies that you would consider to be profiteering, or are you willing to always give them the benefit of any faint doubt?

Do you see nothing wrong with Dymo putting chips in their labels to prevent customers buying labels from third parties, for example?

tooki:
I wouldn’t use the word “wrong” in the sense of it being immoral, I just think it’s stupid and annoying, such that I won’t buy their product. “Bad” yes, “wrong” no. Same with printer ink, Juicero pods, and many other things.

Where “wrong” in the sense of immoral does apply, IMHO, is things like medication, such as the $600 epi-pens, $1500/month Truvada (HIV-preventing pill that costs pennies to make), and in general, healthcare and education as profit centers.

Every single example I was discussing in this thread is safety-related. And to repeat what I said: I never said safety/liability is the SOLE factor. That would be naive.

But it’s equally naive to think that ALL companies ONLY consider profit maximization in their decisions to the exclusion of all else. There are many competing factors and motivations: legal, image, reputation, competition, short term vs long term profit vs market share growth vs profit share growth vs stock price growth, company culture and values, and many more I’m sure.

It’s frustrating that every time someone (be it me or someone else) brings up the fact that business decisions aren’t usually as black-and-white, good-vs-evil as they’re made out to be, people attack or dismiss us as being naive, stupid, or ill-informed, when frankly, it’s usually them who are ill-informed or narrow-minded.
PlainName:

--- Quote from: tooki on September 11, 2022, 04:54:47 pm ---But it’s equally naive to think that ALL companies ONLY consider profit maximization in their decisions to the exclusion of all else.

--- End quote ---

I know you qualify that with 'of all else' but how does it square with:


--- Quote from: tooki on August 09, 2022, 11:39:28 am ---But as a publicly traded company, making money is their primary goal, as is literally required by law.

--- End quote ---
JPortici:
I have asked for a new laptop at work. Current one is 6 years old, one USB port has failed, another is starting to fail and in any case it's an old system, my couple years  newer intel nuc runs laps around it.
I've looked at some catalogs.
All have USB C ports, one dedicated to charging. Some also have a regular ("legacy" as in "it can use the older brick wall charger") charging port.
The port dedicated to charging is indicated with a lightning with an arrow symbol, pretty easy to understand. The symbol changes with the manufacturer but you get it, it's obvious.

From the list i chose the laptop that had most "conventional" ports, as i need to be connected to ethernet at times, and two-three usb gadgets.
Obviously i could use a docking station or a port expander. As a matter of fact, when i'm at my desk the laptop is connected to a dock and everything is connected to the dock. But when the laptop is on my lap, things better be connected directly.

Only the higher priced laptops came with 3-4 USB-C and nothing else. i had plenty of choice for my needs, and it's still compliant to the USB-C mandate for charging.
At this moment the USB-C thing is a non issue.
tooki:

--- Quote from: dunkemhigh on September 11, 2022, 05:08:15 pm ---
--- Quote from: tooki on September 11, 2022, 04:54:47 pm ---But it’s equally naive to think that ALL companies ONLY consider profit maximization in their decisions to the exclusion of all else.

--- End quote ---

I know you qualify that with 'of all else' but how does it square with:


--- Quote from: tooki on August 09, 2022, 11:39:28 am ---But as a publicly traded company, making money is their primary goal, as is literally required by law.

--- End quote ---

--- End quote ---
Two ways:

1. Not all companies are publicly traded.

2. This:

--- Quote from: tooki on September 11, 2022, 04:54:47 pm ---There are many competing factors and motivations: legal, image, reputation, competition, short term vs long term profit vs market share growth vs profit share growth vs stock price growth, company culture and values, and many more I’m sure.
--- End quote ---
” short term vs long term profit vs market share growth vs profit share growth vs stock price growth” are all ways of making money.
Navigation
Message Index
Next page
Previous page
There was an error while thanking
Thanking...

Go to full version
Powered by SMFPacks Advanced Attachments Uploader Mod