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The Hyperloop: BUSTED

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mtdoc:

--- Quote from: helius on July 29, 2016, 01:33:21 am ---
--- Quote from: mtdoc on July 29, 2016, 12:57:03 am ---
--- Quote from: EEVblog on July 29, 2016, 12:35:39 am ---
--- Quote from: mtdoc on July 28, 2016, 08:14:49 pm ---Hyperloop is different - this is a new concept and most of the technology has yet to be developed. 

--- End quote ---

It's a concept that is nearly 100 year old.

--- End quote ---

I thought it was obvious that I was referring to the specific case of using it ("the compressor within a tube" concept) for mass transit on a large scale - and not the general concept of transport of an object in a low pressure tube - which has been around and used for years...

The comparison to solar roadways is bogus in either case.

--- End quote ---

In fact, its specific case of mass transit has been in use for almost 200 years.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_railway

--- End quote ---

Interesting history. Thanks for the link. But of course very different than the hyperloop.

EEVblog:

--- Quote from: Mark_Of_Sanity on July 29, 2016, 04:28:31 am ---Where as with the vactrain i.e. Hyperloop, the supposed benefit is frictionless travel.
Maglev to get rid of wheel friction and a vacuum environment to get rid of air resistance.

--- End quote ---

Why bother?
I've been on a MagLev train at 430kmh, it works, it's safe, it's robust, and it's fast enough.
To go through orders of magnitude more engineering complexity, safety, and security to get the only tangible benefit which is double the speed seems pretty darn stupid to me.

EEVblog:

--- Quote from: Mark_Of_Sanity on July 29, 2016, 04:28:31 am ---So like I said, completely unfair and disingenuous to suggest that this is in the same line as the
conceptually stupid solar roadway project.

--- End quote ---

It's a completely fair conceptual benefits comparison I think.

The benefit of Hyperloop is double the speed of existing proven MagLev at the cost of orders of magnitude more complexity

The benefit of Solar Roadways is using existing road surface area at the cost of orders of magnitude more complexity.

EEVblog:

--- Quote from: rs20 on July 28, 2016, 09:06:29 pm ---The claims made by solar roadways can be demonstrated to be impossible on the back of an envelope. Not just impractical, but forbidden by the basic laws of physics.

--- End quote ---

Yes, many of the claims are. But the concept is perfectly plausible, and can actually be implemented and will produce energy. It's just horribly inefficient, non robust, and impractical on a large scale. It is guaranteed to fail miserably. But it can work, that is why it's so attractive to so many people.
(Of course I think the Colas Wattway project is much more practical than the stupid Solar Roadways glass tiles, but that's beside the point)

mtdoc:

--- Quote from: EEVblog on July 29, 2016, 04:38:32 am ---
Why bother?
I've been on a MagLev train at 430kmh, it works, it's safe, it's robust, and it's fast enough.
To go through orders of magnitude more engineering complexity, safety, and security to get the only tangible benefit which is double the speed seems pretty darn stupid to me.

--- End quote ---

That is a completely fair assessment and one I would not argue with but it is completely different than TF's attempt at "busting" it.


--- Quote ---It's a completely fair conceptual benefits comparison I think.

The benefit of Hyperloop is double the speed of existing proven MagLev at the cost of orders of magnitude more complexity

The benefit of Solar Roadways is using existing road surface area at the cost of orders of magnitude more complexity.
--- End quote ---

But that comparison has nothing to do with the supposed "busting"

The difference is that the solar roadways claims regarding solar output (and therefore benefit of the roadway) are easily and verifiably false where as the possibility of building a hyperloop with the benefits as envisioned by Musk is unknown - despite TFs elaborating on some of the challenges.  They may turn out to be insurmountable - but at this point that is an unknown.

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